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fire retardant gel.

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  • fire retardant gel.

    apparently a new" product "which can help firefighters to fight fires and save homes:

    http://firefightingnews.com/article-...rticleID=39134
    "sauver ou périr"

    "courage et dévouement"

    2 french mottoes in french fire service.

  • #2
    It's been around here a while, and many depts store some for wildland season. Most common brand name around here is "Barricade". Works amazingly well.

    It is extremely expensive however, compared to conventional measures (NAFS and CAFS), and has an expiry date. The old price last time the salesman was around was about $2000 for enough gel to do one large home.

    Tough sell for small community fire departments, so the talk was of getting the homeowners to buy, store, and even apply it themselves when directed. It is cheap on that scale, compared to the potential losses, but when a community FD would need to keep 50 grand worth and replace it every few years...

    As the price comes down, I'm sure you will see more of it on the trucks.
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

    IACOJ

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by mcaldwell View Post
      It's been around here a while, and many depts store some for wildland season. Most common brand name around here is "Barricade". Works amazingly well.

      It is extremely expensive however, compared to conventional measures (NAFS and CAFS), and has an expiry date. The old price last time the salesman was around was about $2000 for enough gel to do one large home.

      Tough sell for small community fire departments, so the talk was of getting the homeowners to buy, store, and even apply it themselves when directed. It is cheap on that scale, compared to the potential losses, but when a community FD would need to keep 50 grand worth and replace it every few years...

      As the price comes down, I'm sure you will see more of it on the trucks.
      expiry date,wow.i could not imagine that.
      "sauver ou périr"

      "courage et dévouement"

      2 french mottoes in french fire service.

      Comment


      • #4
        I have only seen this used personally once in Idaho

        This year, when a fire threatened million dollar vacation homes in the Ketchum ID area (Sun Valley Ski Resort), the AIG insurance company hired a special truck that came in and applied gel to the homes that were insured by them.

        I think we will see more situations like that in the future.

        Comment


        • #5
          We use it, and it works quite well.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by sentrymechanic View Post
            We use it, and it works quite well.
            does it also work well,for big houses,with many rooms?i thought it was ok for houses but not large houses.
            "sauver ou périr"

            "courage et dévouement"

            2 french mottoes in french fire service.

            Comment


            • #7
              Gel works to treat any size structure. All exposed surfaces must be treated or you are wasting your time. The larger houses take longer and and use more gel to treat but it can be done. The failure to treat any flamible area is the only way it does not work. You must treat the underside of eaves and decks, windows to prevent radiant heat from starting flammable curtains on fire, etc.

              We can buy gel, Thermo-Gel @ $289.25 / 5 gal pail or Barricade II @ $264.64 / 4 gal pail thru GSA. Both work about the same in training. We have not used any on a real structure during a wildland fire. It will work to extinguish fires but for us, it is cost prohibitive. We are saving our limited funds to purchase a CAFS unit.

              Brad

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Bowbreaker View Post
                Gel works to treat any size structure. All exposed surfaces must be treated or you are wasting your time. The larger houses take longer and and use more gel to treat but it can be done. The failure to treat any flamible area is the only way it does not work. You must treat the underside of eaves and decks, windows to prevent radiant heat from starting flammable curtains on fire, etc.

                We can buy gel, Thermo-Gel @ $289.25 / 5 gal pail or Barricade II @ $264.64 / 4 gal pail thru GSA. Both work about the same in training. We have not used any on a real structure during a wildland fire. It will work to extinguish fires but for us, it is cost prohibitive. We are saving our limited funds to purchase a CAFS unit.

                Brad
                thanks for your reply.
                "sauver ou périr"

                "courage et dévouement"

                2 french mottoes in french fire service.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Bowbreaker View Post
                  Gel works to treat any size structure. All exposed surfaces must be treated or you are wasting your time. The larger houses take longer and and use more gel to treat but it can be done. The failure to treat any flamible area is the only way it does not work. You must treat the underside of eaves and decks, windows to prevent radiant heat from starting flammable curtains on fire, etc.

                  We can buy gel, Thermo-Gel @ $289.25 / 5 gal pail or Barricade II @ $264.64 / 4 gal pail thru GSA. Both work about the same in training. We have not used any on a real structure during a wildland fire. It will work to extinguish fires but for us, it is cost prohibitive. We are saving our limited funds to purchase a CAFS unit.

                  Brad

                  How much does 5 gals cover? Does it cover as much as 5 gals of foam at a high percentage?
                  Last edited by svmech17; 10-21-2007, 04:46 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    5 gallons will do around 2000 to 3000 square feet of wall or roof.

                    Add the roof, and you need three to four times that amount for complete protection of a medium sized home.

                    Depending on your specific circumstances though, you can also be selective in it's application, and only use it on the combustible features and windows on the flame affected side.

                    So a house with decent fuel separation that is stucco with cedar roof and wood trim could get away with about half the amount of the same house of fully combustible siding.

                    The advantage over NAFS or CAFS is that it will last for days, won't evaporate off, and can be applied well in advance of the firefront. It also has superior heat resistance.

                    Here is the Barricade site. The FAQ's will answer a lot of questions.

                    http://www.barricadegel.com/default.asp
                    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

                    IACOJ

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Here is a link to a company that has developed a delivery system for gel.

                      www.dakfire.com

                      I have known Gordy Sabo for many years (and no, I do not have any fiancial interest in the company). Gordy would be happy to answer any questions on application and coverage. There are also some links to news articles.

                      We first looked at gel several years ago for use in South Dakota. Initially we had problems with getting a good ratio of gel to water in the mix. It appeared that altitude, water hardness, and possibly other factors made a good mix hard to obtain.

                      Gordy and associates managed to come up with a solution that works.

                      Stay Safe
                      IACOJ

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by kd7fds View Post
                        I have only seen this used personally once in Idaho

                        This year, when a fire threatened million dollar vacation homes in the Ketchum ID area (Sun Valley Ski Resort), the AIG insurance company hired a special truck that came in and applied gel to the homes that were insured by them.

                        I think we will see more situations like that in the future.
                        Yea, we fed that truck with water. The gel leaked on the ground, ate the asphalt, removed the paint from one of the structures, and they had a very hard time getting it to come off. It was a mess. Not sure how it all came out in the end. I'd rather use foam. JMO.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by architectbuildr View Post
                          Yea, we fed that truck with water. The gel leaked on the ground, ate the asphalt, removed the paint from one of the structures, and they had a very hard time getting it to come off. It was a mess. Not sure how it all came out in the end. I'd rather use foam. JMO.


                          And this is worse than total structure loss how? (Kidding)


                          There is a learning curve to these types of products, and there is even debate right now about the environmental impact. But at the end of the day, the average value of a Mtn home in my neck of the woods is $750,000, with the big ones in the several million dollar range. I'm sure your resort area is similar.

                          From a strictly financial point. It only takes one home saved to pay for repaints and driveway patch ups for the entire neighborhood.



                          And BTW,

                          Good job to your gang this summer as well. Sounds like you did a great job all around.


                          Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

                          IACOJ

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I live near Ketchum, Idaho (Hailey). On the castlerock fire I saw the gel on houses and kept it hydrated. I was really impressed but its way too expensive for our department, even when we protect million dollar homes. I do hope they work on it and lower the cost so it can become as common as foam is now.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Property Damage from gel products

                              Originally posted by architectbuildr View Post
                              Yea, we fed that truck with water. The gel leaked on the ground, ate the asphalt, removed the paint from one of the structures, and they had a very hard time getting it to come off. It was a mess. Not sure how it all came out in the end. I'd rather use foam. JMO.
                              Different gel products obviously have different formulations. Some products contain petroleum distillates (deodorized kerosene, for one) some use mineral oil, a petroleum by-product as a suspension medium. Some of the surfactants used are also toxic. These products do have the possibility to produce property damage in certain situations.

                              Barricade II by Barricade International doesn't have petroleum distillates or NPEs. It has received an EPA Champion Award. Barricade II Fire Blocking Gel has been recognized by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency for its environmentally friendly formula through the use of safer surfactants and for its efforts in documenting a strategy for ensuring that only safer surfactants are used.

                              Don't judge all firefighting gels from one bad experience.

                              Check out the FAQ at http://firegel.com

                              Comment

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