Opinions on Bush's cuts?

[DaSharkie]

Imperialism and the excessive military spending that goes with it will be what bankrupts the United States...not social spending.

I never said that it wouldn't Nozz. I also never said social spending would.

I said that Socialism will bankrupt this nation as we move further towards it. Socialism IS largely made up of social programs that will end up costing us ridiculous amounts of money offering little benefit but wasting billions in tax dollars.

I prefer capitalism to Socialism any day of the week, but there is irresponsibility in both.

[DaSharkie]

DaSharkie...

We have debated this topic before and frankly there is no point discussing this with you because you are simply closed minded.

Until you stand up at your local city council and tell them noit to accept one cent of federal money for anything. AND I mean ANYTHING...you are a hypocrit. Your city uses federal money for more than you coud ever imagine, do some research before you spout such ridiculous things such as YOUR taxes are funding Tennesee. Well, mine probably funded your city's last sewer and water project or the highway project that leads nearby your city, or subsidizes the bus line or the trains or hundreds of other things you take for granted everyday.

By the way thank you for the roughly 2 or 3 cents or so of your federal taxes that funded our new rescue pumper. We do appreciate it and the fact that you are so opposed to this program is actually good for me because it makes for one less fire department we have to compete against every year.

By the way I take it you are not one of the compassionate conservatives I hear so much about.

Have a nice day.

FyredUp

Call me close minded, I don't give a damn. You want a new pumper? You get yout city to pay for it, not a grant from the Feds to do it. Fire service and law enforcement, and educational funding are local funding responsibilites. I do not think that communities need to suck at the trough to get a fire truck, fire station, police officers, school books, or a new high school. The same goes for funding a city's sewer system or whatever. It is not a federal government responsibility.

These programs stem from a collective, voluntary will for a group of politicians to stay in office at the local level by vowing to not raise local taxes for local responsibilities knowing full well that the burden will be passed right up the line to the higher taxation and deeper pockets of the federal government. A lack of political will on the part of your local politicians to do what is right does not make it a federal need or responsibility.

Your 2 or 3 cents added with Nozz's, and FDNYs, and LAFD, and Sacramento, and Boston, and Albany, and Raleigh, and Pensacola, adds up. You can minimize the point by saying it is only 2 or 3 cents, but it adds up - very quickly.

Funding of highway projects is a different issue. This is a necessity for national commerce, disaster relief and evacuation, and were built under the auspices of the latter in the 1950s as I have stated multiple times. There are limits to this however. The "Big Dig" in Boston is a wasteful and ultimately unnecessary mostly federally funded highway project that benefits no one but the residents of the City of Boston and its northern/southern suburbs and workers.

I take nothing for granted. I understand that federal money pays for an infinite number of things at my local level - but that does not make it right now does it? All I say is that the tax structure of our nation ought to be totally inverted with the largest portion of our tax dollars going to the local levels and the federal government getting the least amount of money of anyone. It will never happen, but that is how it really ought to be.

And I am not a compassionat conservative. Never claimed to be - so you can take your not-so-subtle personal dig and stuff it. I have conservative views, and I have compassion for my fellow man, but to have put the two terms together is ridiculously stupid. I just disagree with the fundamental belief that the federal government is here to cure the ills of our nation.

Remember, "we're from the government and we're here to help."

[ThNozzleman]

Socialism will bankrupt this nation further, so beware what you wish for.

Imperialism and the excessive military spending that goes with it will be what bankrupts the United States...not social spending.

[scfire86]

I think they're great. Especially these ones.

Plenty of money to pay mercenaries and Halliburton's numerous overcharges, but minimal monies to care for the troops coming home wounded or maimed.

Oh well. Like Rep. Rohrbacher (R-CA) stated, "they volunteered."

[jasper45]

Well, mine probably funded your city's last sewer and water project or the highway project that leads nearby your city, or subsidizes the bus line or the trains or hundreds of other things you take for granted everyday.

For what it's worth, I KNOW for a fact you are paying for my sewers, and my roads, and my zoo, and let's not forget the deep tunnel project. (I know Sharkie is contributing to that boondoggle)
Thank you!! We could never waste that money without your support!

[FyredUp]

DaSharkie...

We have debated this topic before and frankly there is no point discussing this with you because you are simply closed minded.

Until you stand up at your local city council and tell them noit to accept one cent of federal money for anything. AND I mean ANYTHING...you are a hypocrit. Your city uses federal money for more than you coud ever imagine, do some research before you spout such ridiculous things such as YOUR taxes are funding Tennesee. Well, mine probably funded your city's last sewer and water project or the highway project that leads nearby your city, or subsidizes the bus line or the trains or hundreds of other things you take for granted everyday.

By the way thank you for the roughly 2 or 3 cents or so of your federal taxes that funded our new rescue pumper. We do appreciate it and the fact that you are so opposed to this program is actually good for me because it makes for one less fire department we have to compete against every year.

By the way I take it you are not one of the compassionate conservatives I hear so much about.

Have a nice day.

FyredUp

[DaSharkie]

furtlofmalta, the issue here is not troop pay. It's the other war expenses that you cite yourself that are the problem. If we weren't blowing so much money on "Vietnam in the Sand", those troops could probably be paid more and we'd still see FIRE, SAFER, and the others better funded.

Somebody help me...How many days of ops, excluding the troop salaries that would be paid they were stateside, would cost enough to fully fund the $1B authorized for FIRE? Not too &#$% many, I bet.

We are in over our heads in Iraq and it's hurting FF's and everybody else back home. Should've put a helluva lot more into Afghanistan and finding OBL to make a real difference with al-Qaida and left Iraq--tyrant and all--alone.

Yes dammit! I want all that federal money to take care of local issues.

BULL! It is still not the federal government's responsibility to buy your firetruck or your bunker gear or your radios because your elected local political officials have VOLUNTARILY DECIDED NOT to raise local taxes to pay for local needs.

My wallet aches from payin for your needs in Kentucky while I live in North Carolina and have local needs here to pay for. Socialism will bankrupt this nation further, so beware what you wish for.

[Dave1983]

furtlofmalta, the issue here is not troop pay. It's the other war expenses that you cite yourself that are the problem. If we weren't blowing so much money on "Vietnam in the Sand", those troops could probably be paid more and we'd still see FIRE, SAFER, and the others better funded.

Somebody help me...How many days of ops, excluding the troop salaries that would be paid they were stateside, would cost enough to fully fund the $1B authorized for FIRE? Not too &#$% many, I bet.

We are in over our heads in Iraq and it's hurting FF's and everybody else back home. Should've put a helluva lot more into Afghanistan and finding OBL to make a real difference with al-Qaida and left Iraq--tyrant and all--alone.

BINGO!! Well said...

[jccrabby3084]

I don't believe that federal funding should pay for any local services like police or fire.There would be too much temptation to have national standards or laws that ALL cities had to enact or risk losing funding.

Doughesson.....Kind of in short this is already happening. The feds like to call it NIMS and standardize everything across the country. Some things are good, I like for one common language vs. ten code. The rig numbering thing is BS though and so forth. Point being..in order to get some grants a FD has to be NIMS compliant to get it...usually.

I read an article in one of the fire service publications saying that the feds look at the NIMS compliant depts to determine grants, yet the law enforcement side, who also has to have NIMS, still get what seems anything they ask for. In a way...NIMS is the feds making national standards or laws.

I can't speak for other departments or agencies, but I see where Fyrdup is coming from. The fire service has to beg and plead for money, when law enforcement just says the buzz word "terrorism" and gets funding.

[EastKyFF]

furtlofmalta, the issue here is not troop pay. It's the other war expenses that you cite yourself that are the problem. If we weren't blowing so much money on "Vietnam in the Sand", those troops could probably be paid more and we'd still see FIRE, SAFER, and the others better funded.

Somebody help me...How many days of ops, excluding the troop salaries that would be paid they were stateside, would cost enough to fully fund the $1B authorized for FIRE? Not too &#$% many, I bet.

We are in over our heads in Iraq and it's hurting FF's and everybody else back home. Should've put a helluva lot more into Afghanistan and finding OBL to make a real difference with al-Qaida and left Iraq--tyrant and all--alone.

[DaSharkie]

There is some truth to what you posted here. I am for cutting the federal budget too. BUT, and listen closely now, not at the expense of the fire service. Every year the fire service is on the chopping block. Every year the AFG and the Fire Academy are on that chopping block. I say it is time we stand up and say NO MORE!!

They cut the fire service yet leave crap in like useless studies and useless pork belly projects like bridges to no where. We never seem to hear outrage by the police of this country that the feds are cutting their piece of the pie. Wonder why? I don't, they aren't getting cut. We are the true first responders. We have and will continue to pick up the pieces after fires, natural disasters and terrorists acts. We have mandates shoved down our throats year after year and yet we roll over and play dead when they cut funding...Maybe it is just like that old saying goes "We have met the enemy and he is us." If we don't rise up and say no more for ourselves, who will?

FyredUp

So to make up for the lack of political will on the local level to raise taxes to pay for fundamental local services, you want the Feds to pay for it.

How wonderful. I don't give a damn how much the police get. The Feds should not be giving a dime to them either so don't p!ss and moan about they get more than the fire service. I don't give a damn.

You want a fire truck? Then you need to push for it at the local level and substantiate it to your citizenry. If your elected officials will not do what is necessary you need to puch for it as best you can.

Going to the tit of federal government to suck the money out of the trough is not the answer. Don't say you want to suck at the tit of government for this and then decry how much the beaurocracy of government is hindering our nation and how we have all of these programs that are unnecessary.


A lack of political will to do what is necessary at the local level does not make an emergency on the part of the Federal Government.

[BFDNJFF]

Okay, can you see the hypocrisy in your post here?

No , I am not the one who applies for grants. I may not agree in it but would you turn down free money? If it were gone I would not cry over it.

[doughesson]

I don't believe that federal funding should pay for any local services like police or fire.There would be too much temptation to have national standards or laws that ALL cities had to enact or risk losing funding,for example.
If you're fed up like I am about pork barrel projects,write your congresscritters and let them know what you want.
It doesn't have to be pages and pages of graphs and stats.Just write,"I don't want any further funding cuts for fire departments....."with a short reason why.
The congresscritter's staff just read enough of the letter to see what the subject is and how the voter stands on it and then makes a mark on a tally sheet to let the representative know what issues are big and how the folks back home feel about them.
Like you said,"If we don't rise up and say no more,who will?".Anyone who doesn't at least know HOW to contact their congresscritters probably shouldn't bother voting in my opinion.

There is some truth to what you posted here. I am for cutting the federal budget too. BUT, and listen closely now, not at the expense of the fire service. Every year the fire service is on the chopping block. Every year the AFG and the Fire Academy are on that chopping block. I say it is time we stand up and say NO MORE!!

They cut the fire service yet leave crap in like useless studies and useless pork belly projects like bridges to no where. We never seem to hear outrage by the police of this country that the feds are cutting their piece of the pie.

Maybe it is just like that old saying goes "We have met the enemy and he is us." If we don't rise up and say no more for ourselves, who will?

FyredUp

[captstanm1]

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[FyredUp]

"Cutting the budget?"
This is still the largest budget in US history even accounting for inflation. Our troops are still making a measly 15k a year to be in places like Al Anbar, while companies like KBR are collecting absurd amounts of tax payer money for a job (supporting our troops) poorly done so that they can drive escalades through the streets of Baghdad and make 150k a year to do a horrible job washing our troops' laundry.
Is that really necessary.
I'm sorry if I offend anyone but I do not see how cutting infrastracture at home and increasing it abroad is accomplishing anything even remotely productive towards a better future for this country.

I couldn't agree more.

I have the solution for the out right theft committed by these contractors. Time to charge them with TREASON. They are hurting our country as surely as the enemey is by weakening our ability to fund the war effort by stealing funding that is not due to them. Maybe after a few of the heads of these corporate leaders faced a long prison term or even execution for treason their greed may be tempered a bit. Harsh? Absolutely, but no harsher than realizing what they are doing is essentially aiding the enemy.

FyredUp