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    Have any of you heard about an anti-terrorism law from 2005 that will now require you to provide a certified or original copy of your birth certificate and a social security card to get a drivers license or renewal after May 2008? We just got word about this on e-mail.

  • #2
    I don't know how true it is but last year when I converted my Kentucky license back to the Tennessee license I'd had since 1982,I had to get a new birth certificate copy to prove who I was.Dumb ol me,I thought that was what the picture I posed so handsomely for on the driving license was for.

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    • #3
      When I switched from NY to MD (January 2005), my passport was good enough.
      "When I was young, my ambition was to be one of the people who made a difference in this world. My hope is to leave the world a little better for my having been there."
      -- Jim Henson (1936 - 1990)

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      • #4
        I think Ohio started that last year.
        IACOJ - Senior Jake

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        • #5
          Sounds like a good idea to me!
          September 11th - Never Forget

          I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

          Sheri
          IACOJ CRUSTY CONVENTION CHAIR
          Honorary Flatlander

          RAY WAS HERE FIRST

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          • #6
            Originally posted by DianeC View Post
            When I switched from NY to MD (January 2005), my passport was good enough.
            People might as well start getting passports. In order to get one you need to show a certified copy of your birth certificate and other supporting documentation. With a passport in hand, it should be easier to get a license like DianeC stated. I believe in 2008 a passport will be required to cross into Canada by car and it is needed for many air destinations these days.
            Tom

            Never Forget 9-11-2001

            Stay safe out there!

            IACOJ Member

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            • #7
              Even though the January 23rd deadline has passed, the lineups at the Passport Office in Victoria continue to be horrendous, with people lining up for up to 8 hours to get in. News on the radio this morning indicated that the Passport office said by coming in person it will currently take 6 weeks to get your passport, and if applying by mail it would take 8 weeks!

              Like WTF have these people been doing for the past few months (if they knew they were going to be flying across the border), sitting on their butts??

              Another problem that has cropped up is that people are finding out they really aren't Canadian after all. This past week, one lady in Ontario, or somewhere back East, was interviewed on the news. I think she was 74. Believed all her life that she's a Canadian and has all the appropriate documents saying so. One of her parents was American, and by not telling the Canadian government her preference by her 24th birthday, she ceased being a Canadian citizen the day after her 24th birthday. hmmmmmm I'm sure they've had no problem taking her taxes all these years.

              Then there are the Border Babies (closest hospital to your town/residence but over the border). If born in hospitals on the US side of the border, the baby needed to be registered (I think that was the word used) with the Canadian government. So here we have a bunch of mothers who gave birth in the States but the parents didn't know they had to tell the Canadian government that their kids were born there. Well, that was my understanding of the story.

              I'll see if I can find some links.



              As to the Driver's License issue, if it helps prevent another September 11th, I'm all for the extra hassle. And like others have said, having a passport is the reality in this new world we are living in. How many of those terrorists had a Driver's License?
              September 11th - Never Forget

              I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

              Sheri
              IACOJ CRUSTY CONVENTION CHAIR
              Honorary Flatlander

              RAY WAS HERE FIRST

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              • #8
                The problem is "papers" are inherently(sp?) poor security.

                They can be forged. And with RealID that was supposed to strengthen driver's license requirements, it's meant there's fewer styles to now master for forging. That's certainly a trade-off...fewer IDs for the border guards to be familiar with to scrutinize, but once the forger has that one document compromised, that's it.

                I had to open a business checking account today to deposit a check made to my DBA. Both the DBA certificate and IRS letter for the EIN would be trivial to forge. And yet it was done under the new "Patriot Act" rules for opening a new account. Call me cynical, but knowing the problems with SSNs, by the time the IRS clarified with a bank a problem with an EIN (the business equivelant of a SSN), some could be long gone with the funds.

                The showing of a driver's license or other photo ID post 9-11 was something the airlines had long wanted for business reasons -- people were selling tickets on the black market, especially between big cities (i.e. "I have a ticket NY to LA, for a male." That was simply the other half of a round trip ticket when it was cheaper to buy round trip then one-way)

                Which I guess is all to say, the ID stuff is what is called "Security Theater" -- the people who want to go around it still can go around it. It lets the Government track everyone else a bit easier, which may help things like petty drug smugglers and collecting proper taxes but isn't going to do much against an organized enemy.

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                • #9
                  what will you do for the other 5 months??

                  I have a CDL with hazmat, and the renewal is going to take 6 months with all the "Patriot Act" bulls**t, and an extra $85.00.

                  NO I will not be convinced that this will make a damn bit of difference!!!

                  Alan

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ARH176 View Post
                    I have a CDL with hazmat, and the renewal is going to take 6 months with all the "Patriot Act" bulls**t, and an extra $85.00.

                    NO I will not be convinced that this will make a damn bit of difference!!!

                    Alan
                    That's another reason I haven't gotten around to renewing my Master 100 tons Western Rivers license.Too many extra hoops that weren't there in 95 when I got the thing the first time.
                    My name's already in the system,pictures,fingerprints and all.It shouldn't be my responsibility to prove that I am who I claim.

                    The way it's going,it may not be too long before we're being stopped at the state line with some guy in a greatcoat demanding"Papers" before we go on to where the load's going.

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                    • #11
                      U.s.s.a. ??

                      I do beleive the time is coming that we will be required to show papers to travel anywhere. The quote from one of our founding fathers about those who give up liberty for security deserving neither is really starting to ring true.

                      Alan

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by ARH176 View Post
                        I have a CDL with hazmat, and the renewal is going to take 6 months with all the "Patriot Act" bulls**t, and an extra $85.00.

                        NO I will not be convinced that this will make a damn bit of difference!!!

                        Alan
                        I agree that it is bullsh#$ I have a CDL, the way I look at it is if someone is gonna do something in a truck, they ain't gonna get that certification, let alone placard their truck.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by fire0099881 View Post
                          I agree that it is bullsh#$ I have a CDL, the way I look at it is if someone is gonna do something in a truck, they ain't gonna get that certification, let alone placard their truck.
                          Who knows what hinkdom those guys that got stopped earlier this month Miami could have been up to.I remember one of my cousins who'd been an MP while he was in Viet Nam saying that just because someone had the proper "Certificates of Mother may I?"didn't mean that they weren't up to something.He said the bodies near his position after one fight had the proper ID cards to go along with their AKs and other weapons but the farmers he had to roust on a daily basis didn't have one piece of paper attesting to who they were.
                          Anyone who wants to duck under the radar of security only has to get the ID required and then not have to worry about getting caught.

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                          • #14
                            In general terms, papers and identification are realistically not worth the paper, plastic or metal they are created with. Anyone who has the talent, the money and the technical resources can forge pretty much anything he wants, given time and desire. My wallet literally explodes with identification of one type or another, (State, Provincial, County and military) and then I "trump" it all with my green passport. Go figure.

                            Somehow a phrase from an rather old movie comes to mind: The more you tighten your grip, the more systems will slip through your hands.


                            (or something like that.)

                            So it goes with any security measures. I do agree that some strengthening and tightening of the ole belt is required. But how far can it go before it gets to be rediculous?
                            Last edited by MalahatTwo7; 01-29-2007, 12:05 PM.
                            If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)

                            "I may be slow, but my work is poor." Chief Dave Balding, MVFD

                            "Its not Rocket Science. Just use a LITTLE imagination." (Me)

                            Get it up. Get it on. Get it done!

                            impossible solved cotidie. miracles postulo viginti - quattuor hora animadverto

                            IACOJ member: Cheers, Play safe y'all.

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