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  • #16
    The thing that gets to me is that if you are a comedian and can't deal with hecklers, in a less than spastic manner, then maybe you're in the wrong buisness.

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    • #17
      Why David Letterman is a genius.

      Anyone catch the Michael Richards apology on Letterman? Ol' Dave just sat back and watched Richards morph into Kramer right before everyones eyes. Brilliant. It looked like Seinfeld was going to have a CVA.... It is curious how this all came about when season 7 of SEINFELD is being released on DVD.
      IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

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      • #18
        Originally posted by lvwrench
        The thing that gets to me is that if you are a comedian and can't deal with hecklers, in a less than spastic manner, then maybe you're in the wrong buisness.
        Agreed. The sign of a really good comedian is being able to insult the hecklers back and make them think its the funniest thing in the world.
        Tom Warshaw
        Station 13 (Bethel)
        Sumter Fire Department

        "Scientists believe that the world is composed mainly of hydrogen because in their opinion, it is the most abundant element. I however, feel the earth is composed mainly of stupidity, because it is more abundant than hydrogen." - Frank Zappa

        September 11, 2001. We Must Never Forget.

        In memory of Thomas Sabella, L-13, FDNY


        All opinions stated are my own and do not reflect the opinions of my department or any organization I may belong to.

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        • #19
          Just a few thoughts...

          1. Who said the career he is throwing away was successful? Wasn't the Letterman thing his first national TV appearance in months?

          2. His use of the N-word when he was apparently really mad and flying off the handle--his excuse on Letterman--tells a helluva lot more about his subconscious (or nonpublic) beliefs than Mel Gibson's anti-Semitic rant; at least Mel was drunk. I am more inclined to think Richards meant it, whereas Mel...maybe not.

          3. This talk about comedians using the word is absurd. Chris Rock, Sherman Hemsley, or anyone else can call me a honky until the cows come home, and it will NEVER hurt me the way the N-word hurts black people. Why? Because neither I nor my ancestors have ever been enslaved, beaten, lynched, raped, imprisoned, or denied basic human dignity because of our race, at least not on this continent.

          And I have heard George Carlin discuss the N-word, in terms of context. My best attempt at a transcript:

          "Take the word n------. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the word, in and of itself. It's the racist a**hole who's using it that you've got to worry about. We don't care when Richard Pryor or Eddie Murphy use it, because we know they're not racists. They're n*****s! Context!! Context!! We don't mind their context because we know they're black!"

          And he's right. It is an old strategy for abused/discriminated groups to "take away" their oppressors' epithets in an attempt to remove the sting from them. That is why homosexuals call themselves queers, and that is why some blacks use the N-word. As George said, the word is harmless once you it is used by someone who clearly does not use it in hate.

          So back to Cosmo...

          I'm not the one hurt by his words, but his apology is worthless to me, so I am quite sure it's worthless to those whom it did hurt. Kramer, better head to McDonald's, and take a resume.
          Last edited by EastKyFF; 11-22-2006, 01:35 PM.
          “I am more than just a serious basketball fan. I am a life-long addict. I was addicted from birth, in fact, because I was born in Kentucky.”
          ― Hunter S. Thompson

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          • #20
            Originally posted by EastKyFF
            3. This talk about comedians using the word is absurd. Chris Rock, Sherman Hemsley, or anyone else can call me a honky until the cows come home, and it will NEVER hurt me the way the N-word hurts black people. Why? Because neither I nor my ancestors have ever been enslaved, beaten, lynched, raped, imprisoned, or denied basic human dignity because of our race, at least not on this continent.

            Chris Rock talks **** about white people all the time, Im not talking about when he says ******. Who says white people aren't hurt by it?

            Reguardless, reguarding to the "****** hurts blacks cause they were enslaved" thing...

            Thats BS. Do I feel symapthy for all that has happened to Blacks, without a doubt, but do I feel anything for blacks now bacause their ancestors delt with it? Not at all. I don't feel at all like blacks should have an "out" or anything different because their ancestors were treated terribly. Unless it was actually them being beaten, I feel nothing more for them than anyone else.

            Untill people don't get bothered by racism, it will continue. The fact that this is in the news continues to let all racists know that **** like this bothers blacks.
            Get busy livin, or get busy dyin. - Shawshank Redemption
            IACOJ

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            • #21
              People pay a cover charge to get in to see someone and immediately think that they paid for the right to use them as a punching bag.
              Richards walks off the stage, he gets skewered for that. He retorts, he gets skewered for that. He lets them continue to heckle him and the club management doesn't have enough sense to ask those people to leave.
              Richards was defenseless, thanks to the club owners and responded out of frustration.
              Without knowing what the others said, I don't know if what he was saying was too strong or not strong enough, but he had EVERY RIGHT to respond.
              CR
              Visit www.iacoj.com
              Remember Bradley Golden (9/25/01)
              RIP HOF Robert J. Compton(ENG6511)

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              • #22
                And its okay for the whacko libbie celebs, to bash the President and the Republicans at every chance? While not the same kind of thing, I still think its a double standard. Leave the guy alone.
                Last edited by WaterbryVTfire; 11-22-2006, 02:12 PM. Reason: spelling mistake
                "If people concentrated on the really important things in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles."
                ********

                IACOJ

                ********

                "Criticism is prejudice made plausible."
                - H. L. Mencken (1880-1956)

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by OlieCan
                  Chris Rock talks **** about white people all the time, Im not talking about when he says ******. Who says white people aren't hurt by it?

                  Reguardless, reguarding to the "****** hurts blacks cause they were enslaved" thing...

                  Thats BS. Do I feel symapthy for all that has happened to Blacks, without a doubt, but do I feel anything for blacks now bacause their ancestors delt with it? Not at all. I don't feel at all like blacks should have an "out" or anything different because their ancestors were treated terribly. Unless it was actually them being beaten, I feel nothing more for them than anyone else.

                  Untill people don't get bothered by racism, it will continue. The fact that this is in the news continues to let all racists know that **** like this bothers blacks.

                  You know what? The people who are offended today don't have to be beaten to be hurt by people using the N word. If my father had been run out of a restaurant by people who "wouldn't serve n-----s," it would hurt my feelings to be called that today.

                  Keep in mind, pal, slavery has been gone for a long time but there are some rather young black Americans among us who clearly remember segregated schools, "colored" water fountains, and the midnight rides of the Klan. I think they have every right to say that word is offensive to them.

                  And just because the children of those people were probably never subjected to that kind of treatment doesn't mean the word isn't hurtful to the younger generation, too.

                  Do you think there is a beating license or something? That you can refer to blacks by the N word unless they have personally been beaten? Are you kidding?

                  It is not your place to decide what should not offend other people.
                  Last edited by EastKyFF; 11-22-2006, 02:28 PM.
                  “I am more than just a serious basketball fan. I am a life-long addict. I was addicted from birth, in fact, because I was born in Kentucky.”
                  ― Hunter S. Thompson

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    CR - the guy said his friend didn't think Richards was funny. They, in no way, were responsible for how he responded.

                    Ruin his career? This made his career. Let's be honest. Has anyone heard anything from him in the last year? Now, lots of people are talking about him.

                    He still has no talent.
                    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by EastKyFF
                      You know what? The people who are offended today don't have to be beaten to be hurt by people using the N word. If my father had been run out of a restaurant by people who "wouldn't serve n-----s," it would hurt my feelings to be called that today.

                      Keep in mind, pal, slavery has been gone for a long time but there are some rather young black Americans among us who clearly remember segregated schools, "colored" water fountains, and the midnight rides of the Klan. I think they have every right to say that word is offensive to them.

                      And just because the children of those people were probably never subjected to that kind of treatment doesn't mean the word isn't hurtful to the younger generation, too.

                      Do you think there is a beating license or something? That you can refer to blacks by the N word unless they have personally been beaten? Are you kidding?

                      It is not your place to decide what should not offend other people.

                      Reguardless, my point remains that racism will continue to happen until it stops bothering people. If I called you a ******, and it ****ed you off, I would know that I could always **** you off by saying it, if it didn't **** you off, chances are, I would stop calling you that. If people want this all to stop then they have to stop letting it bother them.

                      Also, keep in mind Im not saying its ok to say it or anything, and I sympathize what you/your father have gone through, I was simply saying that just because of what happened in the past, it doesn't give every black man alive today the right to say, "My people were tortured in the past, so thats hurtful to me" I think that for the same reason I don't think some random Jew kid should hate germans for the holocaust, Most jews today weren't in the holocaust, and same for the germans, but people continue to bring it up.

                      I never understood why people got hurt by words in the first place... If it was a white man who came up with the word ******, all the blacks saying it keeps it alive.
                      Get busy livin, or get busy dyin. - Shawshank Redemption
                      IACOJ

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                      • #26
                        Let me try to civilly address the points that have been brought up by many of you:

                        ChiefReason, just what could have Richards have said that would have been "stronger" than what he actually said. I can't think of any word or phrase that would hurt me as much as being called a ******. I'm not saying that he didn't have the right to rip these guys to shreads for interrupting his act, but he went waaaay too far.

                        Oliecan, you keep bringing up Chris Rock; what specifically has Chris Rock said that has offended you as a white person? Chris Rock has been an equal opportunity offender, in fact one of my favorite jokes is his act about how he loves black people but hate "niggas." I don't think this is an incident of blacks being over sensitive to a joke; personally I don't mind laughing at a firehouse joke about how my favorite food is fried chicken, or a funny remark about rap music or culture. However, there is no humor in being told that I should be lynched for disagreeing with a white person.

                        DaSharkie, and everyone else: Should I be equally offended by black people saying ****** as a white person saying the same word? Yes. Am I? No. I have heard white people in my age group (18-25) use the word with absolutely zero malice, but it still offends me although I know that these people are my friends and have no racism in their hearts. I honestly do not know why hearing a white colleague use the "n" word as a congenial term, or while singing along with a song still offends me. No matter how much I know that it is equally wrong, a double standard does exist, and probably always will.

                        Finally, just as I can't stand to be told by some liberal what I should be offended by, I also find it condescending to be told by anybody, white or black, what I shouldn't be offended by.

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                        • #27
                          First, let me clarify. I'm white; the bit about me and my father is hypothetical.

                          As for the rest of it, I give up.
                          “I am more than just a serious basketball fan. I am a life-long addict. I was addicted from birth, in fact, because I was born in Kentucky.”
                          ― Hunter S. Thompson

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            ChiefReason, just what could have Richards have said that would have been "stronger" than what he actually said. I can't think of any word or phrase that would hurt me as much as being called a ******. I'm not saying that he didn't have the right to rip these guys to shreads for interrupting his act, but he went waaaay too far.
                            Well, this being a "family" forum and all, I can't respond to that specifically here, but I can think of several rascist epithets that, in my opinion, would be alot more hurtful than the term "******".
                            You see; in my white mind, "******" describes ANYONE who has been oppressed. Why does everyone think that the blacks own this word? When I was in college, I read a book entitled "The Student As ******" and what it was espousing was that college students-and keep in mind that this was when the Vietnam War was going on-were being led into submission to certain indoctrinations at the time. It was interesting reading at the time.
                            Like I said, I don't know what was said, but I think a performer should have the right to perform without interruptions from the peanut gallery, unless interaction with the audience is their "shtick".
                            This topic is too touchy for me since I grew up as poor white trash.
                            I'm out.
                            CR
                            Visit www.iacoj.com
                            Remember Bradley Golden (9/25/01)
                            RIP HOF Robert J. Compton(ENG6511)

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                            • #29
                              CR, your remark about ****** being applicable to people of all races is an interesting and respectable belief. However, I don't think that is an accurate description of how most of America views that word. For example, 95% of my friends are white, but if someone were to walk into a party and begin to complain about ******s, it would be assumed that this person was referring to me.
                              I think everyone is in agreement that Richards had a right to finish his act, and most of us agree that he at least went too far (a gross understatement in my book). It is notable to see how this has been discussed here in a much more civil tone than on many other forums/sites.

                              FTM-PTB

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                              • #30
                                Just as an observation (and a good point I picked up in Coach Carter), but does the young black society not teach other ethinicities to use the "N-word"? Honestly, if it's OK for one person to use it, why should the be offended when someone else does? It'd be the same as me using derogatory terms for Native Americans or white people then complaining about someone else doing it.

                                At the same time, I cannot remember any time I've heard anyone apologize for using the terms "cracker," "honky," or "whitey," "spic," "Mic," "beaner," or any other of a variety of terms.

                                Seems like it's a bit of a double standard. If our society trully wants to rid itself of racism, everyone needs to play their part. This is just one of many examples of things that keep racism alive and going.

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