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  • #91
    Damn right you consume products from undocumented workers. And the fact is that many of those folks are working with forged documents so that they are paying taxes and paying into social security yet will never get a chance to collect that ss contribution or get a refund of any over payment on the taxes.
    Do you have any facts/numbers on the amount those who are illegal and paying taxes put in vs. how much they take out? I would bet more money is spent by those legally living here paying taxes supporting those who are illegal than they are supporting themselves or others. We are paying for their: Medicaid, medical treatment for those uninsured, food assistance programs, the federal prison and court systems, and federal aid to schools, etc. The products we consume from these illegal aliens ("undocumented workers") comes at too high a price.

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    • #92
      Also, many get paid cash, they don't get paid with checks because they don't have a bank account to get the money. So, taxes are NOT taken out. Plus, much of the money they earn is sent back to Mexico, or wherever they're from to their families.
      Contractors know they can pay them less with no payroll taxes. This is not enforced enough.

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by emtbff927
        Do you have any facts/numbers on the amount those who are illegal and paying taxes put in vs. how much they take out? I would bet more money is spent by those legally living here paying taxes supporting those who are illegal than they are supporting themselves or others. We are paying for their: Medicaid, medical treatment for those uninsured, food assistance programs, the federal prison and court systems, and federal aid to schools, etc. The products we consume from these illegal aliens ("undocumented workers") comes at too high a price.
        This might be a good place to start.

        S & P's Analysis of Illegal Immigration
        I'm not saying you're stupid. I'm saying you have bad luck when it comes to thinking.

        Comment


        • #94
          An online magazine with maybe two paragraphs of minimal and broad statistical information. great!

          Doesn't change what I wrote in my above two posts, and doesn't prove illegals' tax contributions (however large...or tiny they may be) would make up for the money they are using from our taxes via healthcare, judicial system, etc etc etc. Plus the fact that many aren't paid legally...

          Breaking the law is breaking the law.

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by emtbff927
            An online magazine with maybe two paragraphs of minimal and broad statistical information. great!
            You might have missed this part where I wrote, "This might be a good place to start." I was thinking you might have been inspired to do a little more digging on your own. Sorry, I was mistaken.

            Originally posted by emtbff927
            Breaking the law is breaking the law.
            So is running a stop sign. And I don't see people getting all wacked about that.
            I'm not saying you're stupid. I'm saying you have bad luck when it comes to thinking.

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by DennisTheMenace
              Do you enjoy your neighbors lawn looking nice or would you rather they look like crap? Go to a hotel/motel this year? Did you like having the room clean? Been to a newly constructed building lately? Go to your bank or the mall lately? Did you enjoy the cleanseness there? Did you have a salad or fruit to eat this week? Damn right you consume products from undocumented workers. And the fact is that many of those folks are working with forged documents so that they are paying taxes and paying into social security yet will never get a chance to collect that ss contribution or get a refund of any over payment on the taxes.
              Forgery is a crime... any how, most "undocumented" workers work solely under the table. No taxes paid at all.

              Most use the hospital ER as their doctor's office for everything. Since they caqnnot be turned away, someone has to pay...that means those who have health insurance or can pay out of pocket.

              My local hospital rarely went on diversion due to a backup in the ER.. now it has become almost a daily occurrence.
              ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
              Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

              Comment


              • #97
                You might have missed this part where I wrote, "This might be a good place to start." I was thinking you might have been inspired to do a little more digging on your own. Sorry, I was mistaken.
                I've given my answer, I was hoping for a more informed debate from the other point of view. Sorry, I was mistaken.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by emtbff927
                  I've given my answer, I was hoping for a more informed debate from the other point of view. Sorry, I was mistaken.
                  Business Week and S & P are both highly respected institutions in the business and finance community. I'm sure if you were to contact them directly they would be more than happy to accomodate your request.

                  Be prepared. That will require you to put forth some effort.

                  Are you up to it?
                  I'm not saying you're stupid. I'm saying you have bad luck when it comes to thinking.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    If you'll look at my first post, I have given much data on the issue. Other posts by myself have raised issues that have not been addresed by anyone. I havn't seen hardly any effort put in from you; You aren't convincing me. You're bantering...not debating.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by CaptainGonzo
                      Forgery is a crime... any how, most "undocumented" workers work solely under the table. No taxes paid at all.

                      Most use the hospital ER as their doctor's office for everything. Since they caqnnot be turned away, someone has to pay...that means those who have health insurance or can pay out of pocket.

                      My local hospital rarely went on diversion due to a backup in the ER.. now it has become almost a daily occurrence.
                      Cap, to a point I will agree with you, BUT it is very variable.

                      I work now in a moderate sized city in 2 hospitals (one sees about 35,000 patients a year and the other about 70,000 a year) in North Carolina.

                      The 35,000 hospital is about equivalent to Marlborough Hospital. We really do not see a whole lot of illegal immigrants in our ED - and I will tell you that there is NO shortage of illegal immigrants in North Carolina.

                      Then again, the County Health Department gives a lot of care and the municipal/county support network. But therein lies the cost. Local and county property taxes, along with the 2.5% County sales tax pay for it - along with Medicaid taxes.

                      Now the OB ward - spitting out babies like mad, and Medicare makes sure that the costs are covered. And OB costs are not cheap - especially if there are complications or a high risk pregnancy. And there are tons of those.
                      "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

                      The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

                      "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

                      "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

                      www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by emtbff927
                        Do you have any facts/numbers on the amount those who are illegal and paying taxes put in vs. how much they take out? I would bet more money is spent by those legally living here paying taxes supporting those who are illegal than they are supporting themselves or others. We are paying for their: Medicaid, medical treatment for those uninsured, food assistance programs, the federal prison and court systems, and federal aid to schools, etc. The products we consume from these illegal aliens ("undocumented workers") comes at too high a price.
                        Most American Tax payers consume more than the taxes they pay, the top 10% of tax payers pay 90% of the revenue. So you are condemning most Americans with this post. The fact is that foreign workers, documented or not, do contribute to our tax base. The fact that the undocumented can't collect a refund or on their social security contributions shows that they will contribute more than many native born Americans who accept government assistance.
                        Be for Peace, but don't be for the Enemy!
                        -Big Russ

                        Learn from the mistakes of others; you won't live long enough to make them all yourself.

                        Originally posted by nyckftbl
                        LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by emtbff927
                          Also, many get paid cash, they don't get paid with checks because they don't have a bank account to get the money. So, taxes are NOT taken out. Plus, much of the money they earn is sent back to Mexico, or wherever they're from to their families.
                          Contractors know they can pay them less with no payroll taxes. This is not enforced enough.
                          Legit businesses can't get away with paying anyone in cash, they have books that they must keep in order and can't afford to be making grossly illegal pay outs. They pay folks with checks who provide documentation that they can work, the documents are just not always legit, and those checks have FICA and SocSec and allthe other deductions taken out. Why do you think that there are check cashing places with Western Unions in all of the immigrant neighborhoods, they are the de facto banking establishments for these folks.
                          Be for Peace, but don't be for the Enemy!
                          -Big Russ

                          Learn from the mistakes of others; you won't live long enough to make them all yourself.

                          Originally posted by nyckftbl
                          LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by DennisTheMenace
                            Most American Tax payers consume more than the taxes they pay, the top 10% of tax payers pay 90% of the revenue. So you are condemning most Americans with this post. The fact is that foreign workers, documented or not, do contribute to our tax base. The fact that the undocumented can't collect a refund or on their social security contributions shows that they will contribute more than many native born Americans who accept government assistance.
                            OC is ground zero for the illegal immigration movement.

                            Thank you for pointing that out. When I hear that illegal immigrants don't pay taxes I ask which ones? You can hear an ant pass gas. They pay all the taxes everyone else pays, and as you pointed out, won't collect Social Security and few or none won't get refunds on the state or federal tax they may be owed.
                            I'm not saying you're stupid. I'm saying you have bad luck when it comes to thinking.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by scfire86
                              OC is ground zero for the illegal immigration movement.

                              Thank you for pointing that out. When I hear that illegal immigrants don't pay taxes I ask which ones? You can hear an ant pass gas. They pay all the taxes everyone else pays, and as you pointed out, won't collect Social Security and few or none won't get refunds on the state or federal tax they may be owed.
                              Quit agreeing with me hippy, you are going to make me look bad!
                              Be for Peace, but don't be for the Enemy!
                              -Big Russ

                              Learn from the mistakes of others; you won't live long enough to make them all yourself.

                              Originally posted by nyckftbl
                              LOL....dont you people have anything else to do besides b*tch about our b*tching?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by DennisTheMenace
                                Quit agreeing with me hippy, you are going to make me look bad!
                                Just cuz we're holding hands doesn't mean we're going to start taking long showers into the wee hours of the morning.
                                I'm not saying you're stupid. I'm saying you have bad luck when it comes to thinking.

                                Comment

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