Leader

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse

Firehouse.com Forum Rules & Guidelines

Forum Rules & Guidelines

Not Permitted or Tolerated:
• Advertising and/or links of commercial, for-profit websites, products, and/or services is not permitted. If you have a need to advertise on Firehouse.com please contact [email protected]
• Fighting/arguing
• Cyber-bullying
• Swearing
• Name-calling and/or personal attacks
• Spamming
• Typing in all CAPS
• “l33t speak” - Substituting characters for letters in an effort to represent a word or phrase. (example: M*****ive)
• Distribution of another person’s personal information, regardless of whether or not said information is public knowledge and whether or not an individual has permission to post said personal information
• Piracy advocation of any kind
• Racist, sexual, hate type defamatory, religious, political, or sexual commentary.
• Multiple forum accounts

Forum Posting Guidelines:

Posts must be on-topic, non-disruptive and relevant to the firefighting community. Post only in a mature and responsible way that contributes to the discussion at hand. Posting relevant information, helpful suggestions and/or constructive criticism is a great way to contribute to the community.

Post in the correct forum and have clear titles for your threads.

Please post in English or provide a translation.

There are moderators and admins who handle these forums with care, do not resort to self-help, instead please utilize the reporting option. Be mature and responsible for yourself and your posts. If you are offended by another member utilize the reporting option. All reported posts will be addressed and dealt with as deemed appropriate by Firehouse.com staff.

Firehouse.com Moderation Process:
Effective immediately, the following moderation process will take effect. User(s) whose posts are determined by Firehouse.com staff to be in violation of any of the rules above will EARN the following reprimand(s) in the moderation process:
1. An initial warning will be issued.
2. A Final Warning will be issued if a user is found to be in violation a second time.
3. A 3-day suspension will be issued if the user continues to break the forum rules.
4. A 45-day suspension will be issued if the user is found to be a habitual rule breaker.
5. Habitual rule breakers that have exhausted all of the above will receive a permanent life-time ban that will be strictly enforced. Reinstatement will not be allowed – there is no appeal process.

Subsequent accounts created in an effort to side-step the rules and moderation process are subject to automatic removal without notice. Firehouse.com reserves the right to expedite the reprimand process for any users as it is deemed necessary. Any user in the moderation process may be required to review and agree to by email the terms and conditions listed above before their account is re-instated (except for those that are banned).

Firehouse.com reserves the right to edit and/or remove any post or member, at any time, for any reason without notice. Firehouse.com also reserves the right to warn, suspend, and/or ban, any member, at any time, for any reason.

Firehouse.com values the active participation we have in our forums. Please ensure your posts are tasteful and tactful. Thank you very much for your cooperation.
See more
See less

Know your locks

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Know your locks



    FTM-PTB

  • #2
    Is that know your locks or know your ROCKS? Look at the size of that diamond.

    Seriously though I bet many firefighters don't even know what type of locks those are or how to defeat them other than beat down the door.

    Comment


    • #3
      What are the four bolts on the top rim lock? Is it for a reinforcement plate on the front of the door?
      ullrichk
      a.k.a.
      perfesser

      a ship in a harbor is safe. . . but that's not what ships are for

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by ullrichk View Post
        What are the four bolts on the top rim lock? Is it for a reinforcement plate on the front of the door?

        I do believe so.

        FTM-PTB

        Comment


        • #5
          Fred,

          I get the jist of the post, but in situations like that, your only option is brute force. There is no way to be on the other side of that door and "skillfully" work on each of those locks to gain entry.
          RK
          cell #901-494-9437

          Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

          "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


          Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

          Comment


          • #6
            Maybe start thinking about taking the hinge side..

            Comment


            • #7
              As long as the police lock isnt in place thats a standard NYC door. I would doubt anyone would have trouble with it, unless of course the door started to fall apart then its a mess cause you lose so much energy from the door moving.

              Comment


              • #8
                I know looks can be decieving but from what I can see they used small sheet metal screws on a hollow jamb. I know you cant see this from the other side but a couple of good hits with a sledge or axe and you should be well on your way in
                Buck
                Assistant Chief/EMT-B

                Comment


                • #9
                  it looks like splitting and blowing out the back of the jamb would eliminate most of the problems there. baseball swing..

                  Originally posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
                  As long as the police lock isnt in place thats a standard NYC door. I would doubt anyone would have trouble with it, unless of course the door started to fall apart then its a mess cause you lose so much energy from the door moving.
                  How does the police lock work?

                  n/m

                  found this

                  "Q. Among the many old locks, deadbolts and metal plates encrusted on the front door of my apartment is a metal slot for an old ''police lock.'' It occurs to me that I haven't actually seen one in use for years. Have they become a thing of the past?

                  A. ''I still keep them in stock,'' said John Littlejohn, manager of Abbey Locksmiths at East 81st Street and Second Avenue for 30 years. ''But sales have been fading for the past 20 years.''

                  Mr. Littlejohn said that police locks were designed to be used with wooden doors, but that with the steel or steel-framed doors now in common use, ''you don't need that kind of lock.'' The locks use a heavy rolled-steel bar; one end is set in a floor socket while the other is locked into a metal box attached to the door. A door thus equipped could withstand all but the most formidable assaults, short of outright demolition.

                  The first brace-type police locks were manufactured by the Fox Police Lock Company of New York about 1907, to the designs of Emiel R. Fox, a former night watchman. Gene Skratt, owner of Fox, has said the locks took their name from an old police procedure used to secure damaged doors after a burglary, when a 2-by-4 was set across the gap between the door and a piece of wood nailed into the floor. The locks were sold almost exclusively in and around New York City. Other brands, like Magic Eye and Parker, appeared later, Mr. Littlejohn said."
                  Last edited by LeatherHed4Life; 06-08-2008, 06:11 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    . . .Fox Police Lock from occupants side
                    .
                    .
                    Attached Files

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      any indicators of this from the outside? for size up ?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Usually you can eyeball a lock thats off center from the others more toward the center of the door and above the mortise lock of the door knob. The only trick that really works was taught to us by an old R-3 guy, but its not that commonly accepted, the blade of a venetian blind slipped under the door to knock the bar out. Either way you still need to see if its even in place by taking the door or if your eyes are good enough and the door has enough space by looking under the door and the saddle to see if its in place.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Ok first.

                          I disagree with any maul/baseball swing method for a few reasons.

                          1. It won't work as well as one thinks.
                          2. You loose control of the door and quite posibly destroy any integrity it had.
                          3. It borders on the amature methods employed by the cops.

                          Those jambs won't split (steel doesn't split normally) easily on the back side and they don't give much either.

                          Once you have an idea that certain locks are rim locks....taking off the plate and driving the cylinder through (thus the lock off the door) would be a possible method.

                          Chain in place would be easy to remove with a swing of an axe and indicate presence of a person inside.

                          The Police lock is shown not being in place. (the photo following mine is of a different lock) That is the only one where I've learned giving a shot to the door with a maul or axe is practicable and sometimes the only method to dislodge the bar. Although I'm sure using a thin blind might work to kick it out of the hole in the floor.

                          (PS-the family who made them is no longer in the business and still owns the rights to its production so unless they start back into the locksmithing biz or sell the rights to someone else...you won't see any new ones out there.)

                          Remember...all, some or none of those locks may be egaged when you find them...if the occupant evacuated in haste the slam lock might be the only one working (if it has oneto begin with). I would start at the top and work my way down if it were me.

                          FTM-PTB

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            As stated earlier....this is a very common door in this city. The rim locks should really not give too much trouble. Work from the upper locks down, and take them one or two at a time.

                            The biggest problem will be the Police Lock. If it is engaged, the first step I would take is to try to knock the bar out of the floor slot. Pull the knob of the door towards you (this pulls the bar in the floor closer to being out)...now give the bottom of the door a good shot in an attempt to dislodge the bar from the floor. If that didn't work, I would attempt to remove the cylinder and minipulate the lock (through the lock).....if it still didn't work, I would then attempt to drive the lock body off the door by inserting the pike of the Halligan (or officers tool) into the hole and driving it off. If all this fails, it's time to start thinking about knocking out a panel, taking the hinges, or beating the **** out of the door.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by FFFRED View Post
                              Ok first.

                              I disagree with any maul/baseball swing method for a few reasons.

                              FTM-PTB
                              Absolutely. Steel doors and jambs with stronger locks among other security measures have turned forcible entry from brute force with a maul or a foot into a wooden door into a skill that needs to be learned and practiced.
                              Taking a door can make you look like a champ or a chump.

                              Comment

                              300x600 Ad Unit (In-View)

                              Collapse

                              Upper 300x250

                              Collapse

                              Taboola

                              Collapse

                              Leader

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X