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  • Garden Apartment

    Let's critique this one: Tuesday, 9:30 AM; fire in an occupied multiple dwelling/garden apartment type as shown. The main building entrance and central stairwell is on the far right of the photo. To the left, where the hose is being operated, is the patio door to the apartment of origin on the first floor. What do you think of this operation?
    Click image for larger version

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  • #2
    A wide shot from later on in the fire:
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    • #3
      Thats not what we mean here when we say garden apt. Here a garden is half below, half above grade, so you would go down a few stairs to enter it.
      I am a complacent liability to the fire service

      Comment


      • #4
        Pitched roof?
        Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

        Comment


        • #5
          Was it out when you left? If it was, you did fine. But no worries, your pictures will get shredded soon by all the arm chair quarterbacks.
          Like chicago, our garden discription is about the same. The 1st floor windows are just above grade.
          My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
          "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
          George Mason
          Co-author of the Second Amendment
          during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788
          Elevator Rescue Information

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          • #6
            Line going in the patio door instead of a window.
            Fire's out...building saved.
            No one hurt.
            Well done.
            Last edited by len1582; 12-15-2006, 05:06 PM.

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            • #7
              ChicagoFF: Here a "garden apartment" means a low-rise, generally two to four story, building set back off the street in such a way as to have a lawn or "garden" area for the tenants. The buildings typically have four apartments per floor off a central stairwell and are often connected to similar attached buildings to form rows of two to four buildings. They can be brick or frame constructed, flat or pitched roof. In the D.C. Metro area, they were mostly built from Post WWII to the mid 60's to provide affordable housing. Years ago the late Prof. Francis Brannigan described them as the ghettos of the future and he wasn't far off the mark.

              johnny46: Pitched roof.

              SPFDRum: This wasn't my department; a small city to our east, so all you armchair QB's feel free, I'll chime in with my 2 cents worth later. That's how we learn or hopefully, educate others.
              __________________________________________________

              A couple of more shots:
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              • #8
                Garden Apartments?

                Dident that name come from the Houston Area during the 60'S AND 70'S. The apartments that were made in record speed, No fire codes and Built to burn. Ive been to Houston and have seen these apartments. They take up a large area. Have 100 to 300 units. Built in a square, and has a Garden in the middle. From the photo above that dont look like a true Garden Apartment. All other apartments are just apartments. Looks like they did a good job. If its a true Garden Apartment and they saved some units.....WOW..... Most fires in a true Garden Apartment go the High Alarms, as the fire burns through the attic, with no fire walls.

                www.PineBluffFire.com
                "BEST IN THE SOUTH"
                Last edited by firefighter7160; 12-15-2006, 05:11 PM.

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                • #9
                  Holy Crap !!!!!
                  Didn't see the roof shot in the earlier post. Well, some plywood, some tarpaper......

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                  • #10
                    Len:
                    Well, actually, one mother and infant were flown to a regional trauma center with smoke inhalation; 40 people homeless;1.5 million in damage and 16 units heavily damaged or destroyed by fire.

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                    • #11
                      It's too bad about the mother and infant..but these things do happen.
                      As far as the 40 displaced that's also a shame, but they're [I]alive [I].
                      While considerably damaged the building looks as though it can be repaired.

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                      • #12
                        Where I am at these are just called apartment buildings. We mostly call "garden style" apartments with a similiar layout, however the middle staircase is open and made often of combustible pressure treated lumber.

                        If I could take a picture of a complex where I am at, exactly same layout, look etc. You would think it was the same building with the only exception being the type of glass in the common area entrance.

                        If they saved some apartments kudos to them. These fires are extremely difficult to control when they occupy the cockloft area and the ones we have do not have any fire stops or barriers. I have seen where the first arriving engine has pulled the first line to the broken out sliding glass door of the 1st floor apartment. He did confirm the apartment door was closed to the common area, however we did have some discussion during the incident critique about this tactic due to we had yet determined if any civilian occupants were trapped in the bedroom areas. The second line was taken to the second floor apartment for extinguishment there when we realized fire had vented out the back bedroom windows and extended into the cockloft. The 2nd due truck immediately began to aggressively try to trench cut the peak roof ahead of the fire and contain it to the section of units being the involved units were a group of 4 on the D side end. Good thinking by an experienced operations officer with 2 1/2" made a stand, some of the other units we wer in took some water damage however the trench helped, getting water into the attic space while the trench was trying to be completed helped to slow the advance. The trench was never completed on the the rear peak section but it helped enough and we ended up losing 4 total units, vs. 16

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                        • #13
                          BackstepFF

                          Looks like a nice job!!!!! How was your water supply, do you have hydrants or do you run a water shuttle ? And or both? Are you from West virginia?

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                          • #14
                            And............

                            BackStepFF - Hi neighbor. Let me add a couple of things, first for those of you beyond the Mid-Atlantic area, these are the prime example of what we call Garden Apartments. They were calling them Garden Apartments when I joined the department back in 1958, so it's nothing new. They were built to the code of the times, way before sprinklers were required. The example that Backstep shows here is located in an area where Adequate Water is not a concern, since Hydrants are spaced on 300 to 500 ft spacing, and water mains are 10 - 12 inch, with larger distribution mains a few blocks away. Before anyone asks, this is not my district, but I've worked several jobs there over the years (Mutual Aid). For those of you with an interest in this subject, there is a book on Firefighting in Garden Apartments, authored by Chief Glenn Gaines (ret.) Fairfax County Va. I'm not sure where to find it though.

                            Now, back to work - Tactical Considerations -

                            Fire Spread - A common pipe chase feeds utility lines (Gas, Water, Electric, Phone) into each Apartment unit at the kitchen wall. ANY sign of Fire in the Kitchen means a mandatory opening of the Chase to THOROUGHLY examine the area for Fire Spread.
                            Life Safety - With many of these developments being Rental Properties, There are often people asleep in midday as well as at night. A "Fine Tooth Comb" search is necessary.
                            Structural Stability - Some of these Apartment Developments were built before 1960, most were completed before 1985. Age translates into deterioration, in most cases. I was on a High Angle Rescue Today (See FH.Com Home Page) where the injured person had put his foot thru the roof. This was possibly due to deterioration of the plywood sheeting. As with almost everything else, some Apartments are properly maintained, while others fall into varing states of disrepair.
                            Fire (Fuel) Load - Like single family dwellings, apartments are sometimes occupied by packrats. In turn, this is a problem for us from several directions, such as tight spaces to move about, increased difficulty advancing lines and searching, and most important, increased Floor loading. Contents such as Piled newspaper and clothing will absorb lots of water, increasing the floor loading even more.
                            Access for Apparatus - A common belief here is that every tenant owns at least 3 cars . Parking areas range from congested to impossible.

                            For now, that should give y'all some things to think about. Stay Safe.
                            Last edited by hwoods; 12-15-2006, 10:29 PM.
                            Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
                            In memory of
                            Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
                            Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

                            IACOJ Budget Analyst

                            I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

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                            • #15
                              adding on to hwoods...

                              ...don't forget, all floors might not be accessed off the same stairwell either.
                              Attached Files
                              "If you put the fire out right in the first place, you won't have to jump out the window."
                              Andy Fredericks,
                              FDNY E.48, SQ.18
                              Alexandria, VA F.D.

                              Rest in Peace

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