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Hybrid extrication - do you do it?

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  • #16
    Please take the time to learn the facts about Hybrids. There has been plenty of testing to show that you will not be shocked or electrocuted. We even cut through the High Voltage cables while they were fully charged and demonstrated that the relays open and shut down voltage before any enters the tool.

    And if you are afraid of the current Hybrids, take a look at this announcement dated Mar 15, 2007 4:26 PM:

    "A partnership between Peterbilt and Eaton is set to build an aerodynamic and fuel-efficient diesel-electric Model 386, which will be validated by operations in Wal-Mart’s private fleet"

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    • #17
      Originally posted by SOTA4311 View Post
      Please take the time to learn the facts about Hybrids. There has been plenty of testing to show that you will not be shocked or electrocuted. We even cut through the High Voltage cables while they were fully charged and demonstrated that the relays open and shut down voltage before any enters the tool.

      And if you are afraid of the current Hybrids, take a look at this announcement dated Mar 15, 2007 4:26 PM:

      "A partnership between Peterbilt and Eaton is set to build an aerodynamic and fuel-efficient diesel-electric Model 386, which will be validated by operations in Wal-Mart’s private fleet"

      SOTA, where I am from there has been VERY LITTLE information coming into the training avenue. I am trying to get as informed as the next guy but one thing is for sure, I am glad you aren't my training officer. I find it in the like mindsets of Lairdsville and Baltimore in which you seem to be familiar. Why would you even at a 1/1000 of a chance, even in the most farthest regions of practicle thought take it as a "not a problem" though and CUT INTO THE ORANGE WIRE when in ALL the ERG's for what I have read it says numerous times "DO NOT CUT THE ORANGE WIRE", let alone the thought that you directed another firefighter to cut the wire. One thing I do know that if you go outside recognized training or use a product beyond the manufacturers reccommendations that YOU take on the liability in whatever issue it involves.

      I by no means am afraid of the Hybrid issues I am trying to become more informed and actually your statment about the hybrid semi isn't quite new news. I am privy to the info going into the new IFSTA rescue book and it discusses the various types of hybid vehicles currently on the road.

      Please don't get me wrong here, I am tryin to keep in mind here the safety issues that the people that make these things say to do and not to do in THEIR ERG's. I was in a class put on mainly intended for repair technichians but was supposed to have info that we could use. the speaker kept talking about that famous orange wire and all the safety systems built in to it and he just went blank when I asked him these questions.

      1. Do all vehicle mfg's use the orange wire from the same source?
      2. Is there any type of documentation on cycle testing done on the famous orange wire?

      The reason I asked these simple two questions gets to the point at why we still have house fires today. New houses still burn today with all of the safety systems built into new home construction. I am not saying that manufacturers have to build cars to crash to test the wire but build testing devices and nick the wire to see how many times that once nicked at what percentage were/if there were any failures, lets face it guys everything is man made and suceptable to failurers and I feel we need to know what to prepare for rather than become the Dayton Ohio for Hybrid Cars
      The evidence of God's presence far outweighs the
      proof of His absence.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Lieutenant387 View Post
        SOTA, where I am from there has been VERY LITTLE information coming into the training avenue. I am trying to get as informed as the next guy but one thing is for sure, I am glad you aren't my training officer. I find it in the like mindsets of Lairdsville and Baltimore in which you seem to be familiar. Why would you even at a 1/1000 of a chance, even in the most farthest regions of practicle thought take it as a "not a problem" though and CUT INTO THE ORANGE WIRE when in ALL the ERG's for what I have read it says numerous times "DO NOT CUT THE ORANGE WIRE", let alone the thought that you directed another firefighter to cut the wire. One thing I do know that if you go outside recognized training or use a product beyond the manufacturers reccommendations that YOU take on the liability in whatever issue it involves.

        I by no means am afraid of the Hybrid issues I am trying to become more informed and actually your statment about the hybrid semi isn't quite new news. I am privy to the info going into the new IFSTA rescue book and it discusses the various types of hybid vehicles currently on the road.

        Please don't get me wrong here, I am tryin to keep in mind here the safety issues that the people that make these things say to do and not to do in THEIR ERG's. I was in a class put on mainly intended for repair technichians but was supposed to have info that we could use. the speaker kept talking about that famous orange wire and all the safety systems built in to it and he just went blank when I asked him these questions.

        1. Do all vehicle mfg's use the orange wire from the same source?
        2. Is there any type of documentation on cycle testing done on the famous orange wire?

        The reason I asked these simple two questions gets to the point at why we still have house fires today. New houses still burn today with all of the safety systems built into new home construction. I am not saying that manufacturers have to build cars to crash to test the wire but build testing devices and nick the wire to see how many times that once nicked at what percentage were/if there were any failures, lets face it guys everything is man made and suceptable to failurers and I feel we need to know what to prepare for rather than become the Dayton Ohio for Hybrid Cars
        SOTA, where I am from there has been VERY LITTLE information coming into the training avenue. I am trying to get as informed as the next guy but one thing is for sure, I am glad you aren't my training officer. I find it in the like mindsets of Lairdsville and Baltimore in which you seem to be familiar. Why would you even at a 1/1000 of a chance, even in the most farthest regions of practicle thought take it as a "not a problem" though and CUT INTO THE ORANGE WIRE when in ALL the ERG's for what I have read it says numerous times "DO NOT CUT THE ORANGE WIRE", let alone the thought that you directed another firefighter to cut the wire. One thing I do know that if you go outside recognized training or use a product beyond the manufacturers reccommendations that YOU take on the liability in whatever issue it involves.

        Lieutenant387, With 7 small steps Hybrids are safer to work than conventional vehicles, In my program I refuse to even list all of the safety factors that are built into Hybrids because I teach that we do not depend on built in safety, we depend on our training and the built in safety covers our human error.

        But in this case I must come to SOTAs defense, The man you are talking to is probably one of the highest rated Airbag and Hybrid Car Experts in the United States
        And the study that he is giving you info on was none in order to write the books you are talking about, The other man or firefighter that you think he put in danger was the Tool manufacturer that helped him do the test, and he was not holding the tool it was taped in the open position and operated by the pump handle. The test was done not for his benefit , but for our protection. The books can not be written unless someone dose the testing and this is the most qualified person around to do that testing.
        In answer to your two question: Question # 2 this test was being done to answer that question.
        question # 1 no they do not come from one source but it is not the source, it is the international standardization of the color, and today many may not know yet but we now have two colors, the GM mild hybrids us a bright blue wire to indicate medium voltage systems.

        PS: Todd and Jeff You guys owe me one now (and you can be my training officer if you want to) But please tell the whole story when you write it I hate seeing you get beat up like this.
        Last edited by LeeJunkins; 03-18-2007, 09:59 PM.
        http://www.midsouthrescue.org
        Is it time to change our training yet ?

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        • #19
          Please do not misunderstand my posting as a recommendation to go ahead and cut the cables. What I am trying to do is let people know that there is no need to treat these vehicles any differently than a non-hybrid vehicle. Maybe I am assumining too much when I trust that the key is removed from the ignition and the battery disconnected on every rescue when possible, and if not possible, additional safety precautions are taken.

          All hybrids position the high voltage cut-off relays in-line where the cables attach to the battery, so all high voltage is limited to the high voltage battery when the key is removed or the 12 volt battery is disconnected. The power is also interrupted when the airbags deploy or the sensor detects a crash has occured. The capacitors contain diodes that prevent back-feeding of the current through the cables under the vehicle, and the vehicle will only generate electrical current if the transmission is locked in the B mode when the drive wheels are turned (which requires a 12 volt signal to the transmission control module).

          By the way, I just read my instruction manual for my new desk lamp and it states that I need to unplug the lamp before installing the light bulb to reduce my chance of electrical shock.

          Comment


          • #20
            crazy

            Absolutely absurd!! Saying that you will not extricate a patient from a hybrid vehicle is a direct relation to lack of training. I instruct our departmen on Auto Technology as well as instruct at fire schools. Every student that I have had has left the class confident that they could safely operate on a hybrid vehicle. All it takes is a little research and training.

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