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Reciprocatin saw info.

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  • #16
    instead of cutting the glass why not cut along the roof between relief cuts just behind the A pillars and leave the screen in place. 9 times out of 10 its not going to get in the way and solves a lot of risk created with fine glass dust, just cover the cut edge with duck tape.

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    • #17
      Not Our Style............

      Originally posted by darrellb
      instead of cutting the glass why not cut along the roof between relief cuts just behind the A pillars and leave the screen in place. 9 times out of 10 its not going to get in the way and solves a lot of risk created with fine glass dust, just cover the cut edge with duck tape.
      Not us. When we take a roof off, Everything goes from the bottom edge of the glass, all the way around, we also remove A and B posts at the bottom (lowest point). We also do not flap the roof, we take the whole thing off. Why? We can do this procedure very fast, 90 - 120 seconds usually, and there is nothing left to get in the way of rescuers or patients. Stay Safe....
      Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
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      Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
      Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

      IACOJ Budget Analyst

      I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

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      • #18
        Using A sawzall for cutting glass is a good idea and having done this many times I offer one word of advice, once you cut glass, toss the blade and put a fresh one in. Even by cutting slow, the teeth generally will get clogged and make metal cutting all that much more difficult. Additionally if you use a sawzall I stongly reccomend that "Hard Protection" be used as well soft protection.

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        • #19
          i was attending a fire extrivcation class in a fire dept on week this year and there was a challenge and it was left up to use on what would be the quickest and safeist way to perform a task and it is a good scenerio to use with your department if you can get ahold of some old ones in good shape (school buses that is) i am young an found out what uses the recip saw can be used for the challenge was to remove patents from the bus inan ordlery and quick fasion....well let me tell you i learned some pretty cool stuff at this class we were broken down into 2 groups of 7 plus and icto bring it to 8.. each team made of different people from different departments none knowing each other..this was a large scale drill), this would be a great drill between 2 departments, to perform this extrication challenge we decided to place our oldest member of a rescue squad incharge of our incident he had the most experience and we were all younger and could crawl in out out of the bus so it was our best move. We had to remove 3 patents out of the side of the bus and 2 out of the back with out useing the doors hmmmmm. i thought. Each crew was given a fully stocked rescue vechical both with the same tools on it at there use....well we only used 3 tools the recip, cutters, and spreaders. i was ammazed at what the recip can do. out ic instructed us to start useing 1 recip in the side and the rest of us on the back with 3 firemen in the bus to do stabilization of your victems..

          (i will explain the side removal first)

          they were instruced to cut out the windows enought to pass a spine board out of long ways so about 6 feet wide we were only takeing tou the post holding the wondows in basicly the post of the bus but we did not cut enough to damage thw structural integrety of the bus...about 4 window i dont remember exactle and then take out one more window on either side for more working space and then the crew inso was directed to come out with the patents side ways as yo allow personle to get under the board and not ti the patent forward or backwardto remove those patents took a total of about 12 min...wow i was amazed

          (the back end)

          we were instructed on to use the same technique cutting all that we could wiht the recip except the main post holding the jams of the door were what we used the cutters to do so basicly we cut all the waw across the top of the bus and along the floor board on bothe sides to make one big ole door worked great alot of blades but worked good and remember to have spray bottles of soapy water to lube those blades....and the spreaders were used to remove the seats as the patents were on the floor....we tryed to use the recip to cut the post to take the seats out but 3 plades later found that was not gonna happen they use some hard stuff in there so what an idea a rookie said was well how about we jsut bear the seat out ....huh? we said lets just pop the bolts out of the floorput the spreaders on the sloor and on the corenr buy the post you want to come out and life that screw isnet that strong well what do you know it was kinda loud and you had to make sure not to drop the seat on your patend but hey it was quick and it worked and the patents jsut slid right out the back that operatrion took us about 23 min and we were working on on the back in simultanously whie the side was being doneso the hole operations took about 23 min while the other team worked for about 38 min and almost removed an arm of a memver of there team useing a tool not designed of that purpose...you need to remeber a a tool is designed for wht that too l is designed for sometheing else spreaders are ment to spread not cut.....and cutters for cutting not spreading......not so hard huh...well i hope this gave you an idea of what a recip can do and maybe an idea for a new scenero have fun and stay safe and think fast

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          • #20
            Originally posted by mesha47
            Using A sawzall for cutting glass is a good idea and having done this many times I offer one word of advice, once you cut glass, toss the blade and put a fresh one in.
            You are right in saying that once you cut glass it is useless for metal. It is still good for glass though. We'll put these blades aside and use them for glass again if needed.

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            • #21
              I teach many extrication classes across the western end of the state. Allof your posts do work. One thing that I am surprised is that no one has mentioned the 14 amp sawzall that is on the market. Makes the 11 amp look like a tonka toy!

              Another method I have used for bus extrication is to leave the air chisel in the truck and just use a halligan, flat head axe, and a sawzall to make access to the passenger compartment. Use the halligan and fla head axe to make a series of holes all the way through both layers of outer skin and then use the sawzall with a good demolition blade (DeWalt, Lennox, or what ever you prefer...) to "connect the dots" and make a great access. This works for either the side or the roof of the bus. It is a good idea to use either an 11 or 14 volt electric for this, due to the strength of the material. Also, have someone handy to pass new blades to the operator. It may be neccessary as well to lubricate the blades, depending on how fast you are cutting. If you take your time, it will only be a few more seconds and the blade will last longer.

              Be safe and train hard!
              Tell me, I will forget. Show me, I will remember. Involve me, I will understand.

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              • #22
                11 or 14 Volt?

                Benford,might you be referring to an 11 or 14 AMP saw as opposed to VOLT?You and I are in disagreement on the air chisel.With the PROPER panel cutter installed I find that the air chisel is MUCH faster than either a axe or a sawsall regardless of amperage.But hey,that's what makes this forum run different methods and tactics with measurable results.As buses evolve,expect that opening them up WILL become more difficult.Amperage IS power,for the doubters get your hands on one and "road"test it.T.C.

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                • #23
                  You are correct Rescue 101. I did mean VOLT instead of AMP!

                  One more valuable lesson. Don't try to post on here without first waking up with your morning coffee!

                  The reason I like the sawzall over the panel cutter is there is only one cut versus two. This saves time and the control is better for the saw as opposed to the panel cutter. Use an 8" blade and it will penetrate just deep enought to cut both layers at once. Just make sure access is made by a rescuer to cover any victims that may be in the bus to protect them or to spot the best place to cut.
                  Tell me, I will forget. Show me, I will remember. Involve me, I will understand.

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