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1985 Seagraves Aerial Ladder
It has been a while since I last posted and it would seem that I have a burning topic, pardon the pun, to post again.
We have a 1985 Seagrave 100' Standard Aerial Ladder in my Division which has recently been failed by two ladder testing companies due to excessive twist to the left side of the ladder. It had passed for the previous three years. A Seagrave salesman (recently retired from the Covengton, Ky FD I believe) showed up after being called by a councilman and declared that the ladder had been tested incorrectly. He stated that the 3" hose (100') and the master stream must be removed to check for the twist in the ladder. Mind you that the ladder was delivered from the manufacturer with this in place on the left side of the ladder and had always been tested with this in place. This salesman "tested" the ladder and deemed it "passed". So, we asked Seagrave, who tests your ladders at the factory? The response - Midwest and Underwriter's Laboratories. Can you guess who we hired? Well, UL came in, did the testing and failed the ladder for excessive twist to the left.
Seems pretty cut and dry, right? Well, Seagrave has admitted over the phone that the removing the hose is an "unwritten" rule (UL was unaware of it) and they are considering deeming the ladder safe based on the word of the salesman. (First they want to check with the Legal Department though!) Now keep in mind it has failed three times in the last six months!
The councilman who called the salesman is a former fire Lt. from the Division. You say great! Well, not. He has been bragging around town how he saved the city $600,000 for stopping the purchase of a new aerial tower. By the way, he announced last week he is running for County Commissioner this year.
The salesman from KY has failed to produce nearly every peice of documentation that has been requested from him including a letter stating what repairs he has made on the ladder thus far and a statement on Seagrave's letterhead as to if the ladder is safe to be used or not. He has shown up with a welder and performed work for $1000 without meeting the Fire Chief's request for an estimate in order to secure a PO for the work. He just showed up a month ago (an hour before council meeting) with welder in tow and began work. By the way - that entire senario is illegal in the State of Ohio. He has managed to send a bill though!
The councilman has told the Fire Chief that he (the Chief)has a personality conflict with the salesman. Yeah, well so do I and I haven't even met him!
Tonight we go back before council and we will see what happens. I suspect it could be interesting. About 15 members of the Fire Division will be at the Council meeting (normally council draws only about 25 citizens anyway). This councilman I have been mentioning is also going to the County Firefighters Association Meeting next Monday to ask for the Associations endorsement in his run for Commisssioner - not if I have anything to do with it! I should also mention that this same councilman has his one and only son on our Fire Division - and his son is very unhappy with his father!
We have also been without an Aerial Ladder now for three and one-half months, the first due mutual aid ladder is 18 miles away, next due is 30 miles. Think ISO would be interested in all of this? How about the 9 major manufacturing facilities in our city or their insurance companies?
I am interested in your thoughts - and if you know any good attorneys in this area of expertise!
Stay safe...
[This message has been edited by Capt. Skippy (edited January 24, 2000).]
We have a 1985 Seagrave 100' Standard Aerial Ladder in my Division which has recently been failed by two ladder testing companies due to excessive twist to the left side of the ladder. It had passed for the previous three years. A Seagrave salesman (recently retired from the Covengton, Ky FD I believe) showed up after being called by a councilman and declared that the ladder had been tested incorrectly. He stated that the 3" hose (100') and the master stream must be removed to check for the twist in the ladder. Mind you that the ladder was delivered from the manufacturer with this in place on the left side of the ladder and had always been tested with this in place. This salesman "tested" the ladder and deemed it "passed". So, we asked Seagrave, who tests your ladders at the factory? The response - Midwest and Underwriter's Laboratories. Can you guess who we hired? Well, UL came in, did the testing and failed the ladder for excessive twist to the left.
Seems pretty cut and dry, right? Well, Seagrave has admitted over the phone that the removing the hose is an "unwritten" rule (UL was unaware of it) and they are considering deeming the ladder safe based on the word of the salesman. (First they want to check with the Legal Department though!) Now keep in mind it has failed three times in the last six months!
The councilman who called the salesman is a former fire Lt. from the Division. You say great! Well, not. He has been bragging around town how he saved the city $600,000 for stopping the purchase of a new aerial tower. By the way, he announced last week he is running for County Commissioner this year.
The salesman from KY has failed to produce nearly every peice of documentation that has been requested from him including a letter stating what repairs he has made on the ladder thus far and a statement on Seagrave's letterhead as to if the ladder is safe to be used or not. He has shown up with a welder and performed work for $1000 without meeting the Fire Chief's request for an estimate in order to secure a PO for the work. He just showed up a month ago (an hour before council meeting) with welder in tow and began work. By the way - that entire senario is illegal in the State of Ohio. He has managed to send a bill though!
The councilman has told the Fire Chief that he (the Chief)has a personality conflict with the salesman. Yeah, well so do I and I haven't even met him!
Tonight we go back before council and we will see what happens. I suspect it could be interesting. About 15 members of the Fire Division will be at the Council meeting (normally council draws only about 25 citizens anyway). This councilman I have been mentioning is also going to the County Firefighters Association Meeting next Monday to ask for the Associations endorsement in his run for Commisssioner - not if I have anything to do with it! I should also mention that this same councilman has his one and only son on our Fire Division - and his son is very unhappy with his father!
We have also been without an Aerial Ladder now for three and one-half months, the first due mutual aid ladder is 18 miles away, next due is 30 miles. Think ISO would be interested in all of this? How about the 9 major manufacturing facilities in our city or their insurance companies?
I am interested in your thoughts - and if you know any good attorneys in this area of expertise!
Stay safe...
[This message has been edited by Capt. Skippy (edited January 24, 2000).]
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