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Mutual aid request denied by city official

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  • #16
    We have same discussion on leaving coverage in our area

    I'm on the side of help thy neighbor when in need and if needed have another neighbor cover your area.

    Most of our neighbors are 10 to 15 miles apart. If we refuse and have them call the next neighbor help was delayed by 10 to 20 minutes to the original call.

    I also believe in inviting neighbors to the call and then canceling if not needed - I have seen calls where they waited until arrival and then called for help and the delay possibly prevented saving more property.

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    • #17
      would you say there are mutual aid agreements, and then there are your departments/city's procedures/ laws, etc. that you have to go by?

      mutual aid agreement, yes respond per them.

      But if a neighbor city does not have an agreement with you, do you supply your city resources, liablty, etc, to go into their city??
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZdEH...e_gdata_player

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      • #18
        In my area we have recently been faced with the not so mutual aid. I work for a paid city department that is surrounded by several volunteer departments. When I started in 2005 until recent, these volunteer departments would respond into our area for support on structural fires and we would do the same for them (mutual). The volunteer departments like most in our area have had an increase in calls, but continue to lose volunteers. The paid staff is now starting to handle calls on a regular basis for the volunteer departments, because they have no one to respond and we are no longer getting any support from them when needed (not mutual). The problem we are faced with is all the fire departments within our county have signed a mutual aid agreement, basically for insurance purposes.

        Is anyone else faced with something similar to this and how did you change or adjust this agreement that is no longer working?

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        • #19
          How does the agreement read???

          Are they suppose to supply a minimum amount of equipment and or manpower??

          If so and they are not doing it, seems like the city attorney can send something saying you are in violation of the agreement and after this set date we will no longer respond
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZdEH...e_gdata_player

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          • #20
            I am not quite sure how mutual aid agreements can effect ISO Ratings, which would effect building insurance rates or insurance availability. Mutual aid is ISO neutral....it does not help, but it usually does not hurt either .... unless you end up helping others much more than others help you. Then it MAY directly affect many different ISO aspects.

            Auto aid plans definitely affect ISO Ratings. But even then it can be a double edged blade. It all depends how much and how often who helps whom on that first alarm structure fire call out. I do not think mutual aid denials can be legally actionable. There is no legally defined requirements to automatically help somebody else out with mutual aid

            The needful agency must ask after that first alarm structure fire turnout. Of course this does not address other agreements regarding grass, interface, wildfires, big floods, etc.. Just structure fires. On the West Coast, it is not unusual for a City Manager to counterman a mutual aid response ordered by the Fire Chief. It does happen. HB of CJ (old coot)

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            • #21
              Originally posted by mikeyboy411 View Post
              Yes sir, you are correct..... Refusal results in an investigation, discipline and possible removal of the Unit. It's a very defined process and Cal-EMA (formerly OES) takes it seriously.
              Although I can't say for sure, I bet that CAL-EMA really doesn't care what happens around Johnson City, TN.
              RK
              cell #901-494-9437

              Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

              "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


              Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

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