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Tanker-Tender Definition

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  • Tanker-Tender Definition

    The 2015 NOFO on page 44 has definitions for apparatus. For Tanker-Tender apparatus it just states "1000 gallon capacity or more" with no pump size mentioned. When selecting the type of apparatus you are requesting funding for on the grant application pull down menu the selection of Tanker-Tender is shown as "1000 gallons or more and pump capacity of 750 gpm or less"
    So can a Tanker-Tender apparatus for the 2015 AFG have a pump capacity greater than 750 gpm ie: a Pumper-Tanker apparatus?

  • #2
    You're saying you are requesting a pumper-tanker? Anything that is greater than 750 gpm is considered a pumper. So if your requesting something like 1250 gpm pump and 1500 gal tank AFG just considers that a pumper with a big tank, which would not fall under the tanker-tender designation.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by edge1317 View Post
      You're saying you are requesting a pumper-tanker? Anything that is greater than 750 gpm is considered a pumper. So if your requesting something like 1250 gpm pump and 1500 gal tank AFG just considers that a pumper with a big tank, which would not fall under the tanker-tender designation.
      I don't think you are correct.

      I have seen a number of departments get tenders with larger than 750gpm pumps.

      Remember that to meet the definition of an engine there are attack and supply hose, ladder and toll/equipment requirements.
      Train to fight the fires you fight.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by LaFireEducator View Post
        I don't think you are correct.

        I have seen a number of departments get tenders with larger than 750gpm pumps.

        Remember that to meet the definition of an engine there are attack and supply hose, ladder and toll/equipment requirements.
        I stand corrected. I've thought that those that are awarded tankers with larger than 750gpm pumps requested funds to purchase a 750 gpm pump but then paid out of pocket (without grant funds) to upgrade to the larger pump.

        Which still begs the question of the OP then, if an applicant wants a larger pump in the tanker/tender category how do they list this? The Vehicle Activity states under tanker/tender "The vehicle may or may not be equipped with a fire pump, however, if the vehicle includes a pump, the pumping capacity may not exceed 750 gpm."

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        • #5
          Less tan 750

          An engine is anything with a pump capacity 750 gpm or greater. That's why you see most grant tankers at 500 gpm, I got an earlier tanker before they changed the rule with a 1250 gpm pump.

          So my tanker that I got with a grant (1250 gpm/2500 gallons) is now considered a engine because of it's pump size.

          My 2000 gallon/250 gpm tanker is considered a tanker since its pump is less than 750 gpm and it's tank is 1000 gallons or more.

          So a truck with a 1000 gallon tank and 250 gpm pump is an tanker (also seems to fit the Brush/Quick Attack)

          Upgrade the pump to a 750 gpm and you now have an engine.

          At least that's mu understanding

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          • #6
            The definition on page 44 for the tanker-tender is incomplete. It should read this:

            Tanker-Tender (an apparatus that has water capacity in excess of 1,000 gallons and a pump with a pumping capacity of fewer than 750 gallons per minute)

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            • #7
              Andy beat me to it, but that's the breaks on it. Also anyone that received a tanker award and a vehicle was delivered with an on paper GPM rating over 750gpm bought a pumper, not a tanker and is subject to award repayment for not buying within the scope of the grant. Even if it was done as an overmatch with local money making up the difference in price. The side of a pump panel on a water supply truck can't be more than 750gpm per the existing rules. Old rules was tank size, new rules for past 8-10 years is the GPM rating. Has nothing to do with ladders or other Class A equipment required on pumpers.
              Brian P. Vickers
              CEO - Vickers Consulting Services, Inc
              FH.com/Firehouse Mag Contributor
              www.helpmewithgrants.com
              www.facebook.com/vcsinc

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              • #8
                All of which is still just as confusing as it has been for the last several years...

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