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  • #31
    One SAFER I helped with was submitted by the department for hiring.....#47

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    • #32
      Originally posted by onebugle View Post
      One SAFER I helped with was submitted by the department for hiring.....#47
      When was it submitted?

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      • #33
        Originally posted by davepa View Post
        When was it submitted?
        Yesterday (Thursday).

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        • #34
          What application number are we at? Submitted ours on 9/9/10 #00016.

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          • #35
            EMW-2010-FF-00098 at 0002.

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            • #36
              Just submitted another R&R app...#156

              I'm scratching my head wondering if the final tally will be this low or if a flood of apps will come in over the next two days.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by davepa View Post
                Just submitted another R&R app...#156

                I'm scratching my head wondering if the final tally will be this low or if a flood of apps will come in over the next two days.
                Just over 2,000 last year with the application period being extended. They doubled the funds...at this pace even wonder if it will reach 2,000. Just means the odds are just better for those that do apply.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by onebugle View Post
                  Just over 2,000 last year with the application period being extended. They doubled the funds...at this pace even wonder if it will reach 2,000. Just means the odds are just better for those that do apply.
                  Yes I have got to agree with you; I think we are going to have a low count. Now if Washington would simply get the message that the money is better spent by putting it back in AFG where it should have been all along. They will save a lot more jobs in the manufacturing sector by doing so. I mean really! SAFER is at best, nothing but a band-aid over a festering wound solution to a much bigger issue. Until we can return the tax base back to what it used to be circa 2006 nobody is going to hire or commit to it without seeing some flicker of light at the end of the tunnel and right now folks; its nothing but a great big black hole!
                  Kurt Bradley
                  Fire/EMS/EMA Grant Consultant
                  " Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by ktb9780 View Post
                    Yes I have got to agree with you; I think we are going to have a low count. Now if Washington would simply get the message that the money is better spent by putting it back in AFG where it should have been all along. They will save a lot more jobs in the manufacturing sector by doing so. I mean really! SAFER is at best, nothing but a band-aid over a festering wound solution to a much bigger issue. Until we can return the tax base back to what it used to be circa 2006 nobody is going to hire or commit to it without seeing some flicker of light at the end of the tunnel and right now folks; its nothing but a great big black hole!
                    Kurt,

                    I agree with you for hiring awards. It's also worth noting, however, that well executed recruitment and retention grants have the potential to generate significant ROI if they increase volunteer recruitment. In other words, when the hiring award period of performance is over, a department must continue funding the positions else the firefighters will leave. In contrast, however, a well done recruitment program can entice new people to become volunteer firefighters, and if the department can hook them for the first 2-4 years, it's likely that these people will continue volunteering for many years thereafter. So my recommendation would be to scale back (or even eliminate the hiring portion of SAFER) but maintain some level of funding for R&R.

                    -dave

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by davepa View Post
                      Kurt,

                      I agree with you for hiring awards. It's also worth noting, however, that well executed recruitment and retention grants have the potential to generate significant ROI if they increase volunteer recruitment. In other words, when the hiring award period of performance is over, a department must continue funding the positions else the firefighters will leave. In contrast, however, a well done recruitment program can entice new people to become volunteer firefighters, and if the department can hook them for the first 2-4 years, it's likely that these people will continue volunteering for many years thereafter. So my recommendation would be to scale back (or even eliminate the hiring portion of SAFER) but maintain some level of funding for R&R.

                      -dave
                      In theory you are probably right davepa and I would tend to agree with you on R&R but, I am also finding that the majority of the R&Rs are asking for "supplemental funding" for stipends, scholarships, gas cards etc. and its still the same old, same old; where do they come up with the funds to sustain those programs after the grant funding is gone?

                      In the case of a volunteer rural department somehwere, most of them are still getting oiperating budget from some form of taxes or simply through donations and fundrasiing or some combination of same.

                      The volunteer departments are faced with members who are running "job scared" and do not want to be seen by their fulltime employers as being an "under performer" at a company where possible layoffs are looming if they go off clock to go answer a call; likewise they can't afford to take off from work when their hours are already being cutback as these companies scale down or tighten their belts. Then you have to account for people just plain leaving the area in serach of fulltime employment! They are fleeing the rural areas in droves headed for the larger metro areas where employment might still be available and that means they are outside the "timely response area" needed to comply with SAFER goals.

                      Fundamentally, until this economy does a bodacious turnaround the departments are still going to face that issue of sustainability. With all of these grants going into performance based reporting, I don't know how the program managers are going to justify the continued expenditure of funding unless ALL the departments can gain more secure economic footing to sustain their own opeations at some basic level somwhere near 2006 levels.
                      Last edited by ktb9780; 09-15-2010, 02:26 PM.
                      Kurt Bradley
                      Fire/EMS/EMA Grant Consultant
                      " Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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                      • #41
                        Hate to say it, but R & R n the volunteer side might be better accomplished by larger regional and national campaigns. Kurt's right about people protecting their main job, and they aren't going to come or stay due to gas cards.

                        When i was attracted to firefighting, it was through a newspaper article discussing the shortage of volunteers, especially during daytime. When i tried to find out more, it was like i was trying to get into a secret society--not on purpose, but since volunteer depts are not manned nobody answers the phone!!

                        People will be more likely to step up IF the need is communicated and the ability to respond is there. Cost is minimal to make it news--and maybe to set up some different means of contact.

                        Just my thoughts--your mileage may vary.
                        earl

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Greenacres2 View Post
                          Hate to say it, but R & R n the volunteer side might be better accomplished by larger regional and national campaigns. Kurt's right about people protecting their main job, and they aren't going to come or stay due to gas cards.

                          When i was attracted to firefighting, it was through a newspaper article discussing the shortage of volunteers, especially during daytime. When i tried to find out more, it was like i was trying to get into a secret society--not on purpose, but since volunteer depts are not manned nobody answers the phone!!

                          People will be more likely to step up IF the need is communicated and the ability to respond is there. Cost is minimal to make it news--and maybe to set up some different means of contact.

                          Just my thoughts--your mileage may vary.
                          earl
                          And as usual, spot on Earl!
                          Kurt Bradley
                          Fire/EMS/EMA Grant Consultant
                          " Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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                          • #43
                            Application #245 @ 1100 pacific

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                            • #44
                              I saw # 316 earlier this afternoon.
                              Kurt Bradley
                              Fire/EMS/EMA Grant Consultant
                              " Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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                              • #45
                                431 @ 1515 EST for the SAFER Grant

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