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Battle of the Badges on Route 80

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  • 434Jim439
    replied
    Originally posted by boxcom View Post
    Hey gang!
    I've been following this story, since it is of great interest. In regard to this incident, the vehicle went off the road into a ditch. NJSP arrived on scene and requested EMS ONLY. The FD was never requested by NJSP. The driver signed an RMA and the EMS crew was returning to their rig when the FD arrived and setup their apparatus in the way to create the buffer. In this situation, it was not necessary. Everyone was going on their merry way. This was one instance where the FC was wrong. All of it was on the Tropper's video, including audio.

    As for PD not shutting down lanes, all you need to do is ask them. If they refuse, return your apparatus until they shut the lane down. Stay safe all!
    I know that in this area, any wrecks on state highways, no matter the severity, always require the dispatch of two squads, two engine companies, and a medic unit if need me. Perhaps similar protocols are in place in that area?

    Leave a comment:


  • drparasite
    replied
    Originally posted by Bones42 View Post
    That would be borderline "abandonment".
    maybe, maybe not. one could argue that without the lane/road closed, the scene is unsafe.

    similarly, if you respond to a chest pains, and when you start treating the patient, you note two of the bystanders have guns in their waistbands, would you not be within your rights to retreat to safety? that wouldn't be abandonment, would it?

    I know the not closing of the lane isn't as cut and dry as a weapon on scene. but if push comes to shove, I bet you can make it a valid argument against it being abandonment.

    Leave a comment:


  • TFW1TFW1
    replied
    Glad to see they were dismissed, but screw apologizing for it. The cops should own up to their trooper's "Big Head" attitude as well. It should have been dismissed based on the fact that both parties could have done better.

    Sounds like to me that maybe the FD didn't need to be there. On the flip side, the po-po can get all fired up when it comes to authority over firefighters. Those issues have been around for years.

    I too, after all, was arrested for the same thing in Virginia on I-95 by a trooper. The screwed up part about ours is that the vehicle was a minivan, overturned, with a FDNY firefighter entrapped. The ambulance was parked on the shoulder when we arrived, but was sticking out in the lane, so I blocked the lane. I was told to move it or a tow truck would be called, I said no, got thrown across the hood of his police car, and damn near got pepper-sprayed. It was absolutely insane. He and I were the only ones that were involved and no one else could hear what was said. He says I called him an MF'er, and I swear on my mama's life that he is lying, I never cursed him. I just told him to move it himself or call a tow truck. I knew he couldn't do it because it was a Mack double-clutch stick shift. That's when he got all badgy on me and used the "you cursed me" trick.

    Long story short, I got it expunged thanks to the help of another trooper that is now a volunteer with our station. The original trooper was sent north to bad cop school, I think.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Charges dismissed!

    01/31/07 - Posted from the Daily Record newsroom
    Charges against Rockaway firemen dismissed
    BY ROB JENNINGS
    DAILY RECORD
    LINCOLN PARK -- Charges were dropped today against two Rockaway Township firefighters after both apologized to a state trooper and agreed they should not have questioned his authority at a Route 80 accident scene last November.

    Township Fire Chief Robert Jenkins and Firefighter Allen Bell shook hands outside of court with state trooper Kevin Fritz after the hearing that had been moved from Rockaway Township to Lincoln Park because the firefighters hometown was paying their legal bill.

    "I'd like to apologize to Officer Fritz for my actions that night," Jenkins said in court before the judge. "I believe my emotions got in the way during that incident."

    The judge agreed to a request from the prosecutor to dismiss the charges against both men.

    "Whether or not the state police are right or wrong... usually when an officer gives a directive, you have to follow it." Municipal Court Judge Andrew Wubbenhorst said in statements leading up to his announcement that charges were dismissed.

    Jenkins had been charged with disobeying a state trooper and disorderly conduct in connection with the Nov. 26 dispute. Bell was cited for disobeying a state trooper and for operating a vehicle without his driver's license, which he had left behind while changing at the fire station.

    Jenkins, in previous interviews, said he was only trying to shield first responders at an accident scene from oncoming traffic when he ignored Fritz' order to move a fire truck.

    State police countered that there were no cones or flares by the fire truck to warn approaching motorists and that Fritz did the right thing in ordering it be moved.

    This was the first hearing in the case since it was transferred out of Rockaway Township. Jenkins was deputy fire chief at the time of the incident. He became fire chief on Jan. 1.

    For more on this story, see tomorrow's Daily Record.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Originally posted by boxcom View Post
    Hey gang!
    I've been following this story, since it is of great interest. In regard to this incident, the vehicle went off the road into a ditch. NJSP arrived on scene and requested EMS ONLY. The FD was never requested by NJSP. The driver signed an RMA and the EMS crew was returning to their rig when the FD arrived and setup their apparatus in the way to create the buffer. In this situation, it was not necessary. Everyone was going on their merry way. This was one instance where the FC was wrong. All of it was on the Tropper's video, including audio.

    As for PD not shutting down lanes, all you need to do is ask them. If they refuse, return your apparatus until they shut the lane down. Stay safe all!
    Your information is not accurate. I would say you are about 10% correct in regards to the accuracy, as a matter of fact.

    Read back through the various threads and see where you are wrong.

    Thanks

    Leave a comment:


  • Bones42
    replied
    Are you talking about the right call?

    #1 - it's already been determined that the EMS in that area is part of the FD. Therefore, you don't request 1 or the other, they come as one.

    #2 - there's reports of the patient being wheeled on a stretcher close to the road due to positioning of vehicles. If they signed a RMA, they would not have been transported at all.

    #3 - if the vehicle was in a ditch, how did the Trooper know FD was not needed? Was he able to visibly see there were no fluids leaking or anything of that nature? Can I get a pair of his special glasses that would allow that visibility in a ditch?

    If they refuse, return your apparatus until they shut the lane down.
    That would be borderline "abandonment".

    Leave a comment:


  • boxcom
    replied
    Hey gang!
    I've been following this story, since it is of great interest. In regard to this incident, the vehicle went off the road into a ditch. NJSP arrived on scene and requested EMS ONLY. The FD was never requested by NJSP. The driver signed an RMA and the EMS crew was returning to their rig when the FD arrived and setup their apparatus in the way to create the buffer. In this situation, it was not necessary. Everyone was going on their merry way. This was one instance where the FC was wrong. All of it was on the Tropper's video, including audio.

    As for PD not shutting down lanes, all you need to do is ask them. If they refuse, return your apparatus until they shut the lane down. Stay safe all!

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Case postponed until Jan 31

    I just read that this case was postponed until January 31.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Originally posted by AflackQuack View Post
    Hmmmm lets get this straight. NJSP and NJSP Helo Medivac, and they need FD? And why would this be?
    Actually that is the medevac's policy. They request us. Although, I guess the trooper can throw their little fire extinguisher god forbid something happen or perhaps they can shoot at it.

    Wow... you come up with the weirdest stuff on this board and others.

    Leave a comment:


  • Halligan84
    replied
    How do you not know a helo is coming? If EMS requests it before we arrive we are notified or we discuss it on scene. PD generally does not request a helo, again if they do it goes through fire communications. When we do get southstar they talk directly to us on the SJ Net frequency but do notify the Troops on the 800 radio

    Leave a comment:


  • AflackQuack
    replied
    Stay in the house and cook somethin'

    Originally posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Well, we all know that there will be no compromise with the NJSP. I would settle for at least being included in the plan. Many times I hear about what is going to happen (like a NJSP medivac landing on the highway) as it happens.
    Hmmmm lets get this straight. NJSP and NJSP Helo Medivac, and they need FD?
    And why would this be?

    Leave a comment:


  • KenNFD1219
    replied
    I guess we are pretty lucky here. We have really never had a problem with shutting down the limited access highway here. The CT State Police assigned to my area are great to work with and have no problem in shutting down a lane. We always try to open up the lane as fast as possible. It's all about a little give and take. The only issue we ever with the had with the CSP involved a personality conflict between one of my captains (now retired) and just about anyone else who arrived on scene.

    We had an LODD of a police officer at a traffic stop in the early 1990's. The local LEO's who were on then have no problem with us shutting down a road for an MVA.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stopdropnroll
    replied
    anyone know how this ended? SDnR

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Originally posted by Bones42
    I asked before, for the NIMS fans (that actually believe in that system)...what happens when the Unified Command is not unified? Then what?

    (I'll give you a hint...the police arrest the fire chief)
    Good point, good question... usually it involves compromise. Well, we all know that there will be no compromise with the NJSP. I would settle for at least being included in the plan. Many times I hear about what is going to happen (like a NJSP medivac landing on the highway) as it happens.

    That said, I believe in NIMS/ICS, but it has to be embraced and practiced by those involved. We all know that the SP follow SPIMS, here in NJ.

    LOL

    Leave a comment:


  • Bones42
    replied
    Originally posted by chief6400
    work together
    That is the key.

    I asked before, for the NIMS fans (that actually believe in that system)...what happens when the Unified Command is not unified? Then what?


    (I'll give you a hint...the police arrest the fire chief)

    Leave a comment:

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