Leader

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Interchanging SCBA - Real, or a pipe dream?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Interchanging SCBA - Real, or a pipe dream?

    Since we are getting new SCBA, FF at nearby departments keep saying we should have gotten the same brand they did, in case of an emergency (?).

    So:
    Have any of you had to interchange your SCBA with another department? I don't mean using their bottles. or even using their SCBA. I mean, have you ever had to use, say, your mask with their SCBA. Or their mask with your SCBA?

    Please note, I said HAD to mix equipment. If both departments have the same vintage of, oh, MSA, you COULD use your mask and their pack. But have circumstances ever compelled you to mix gear like this?

    Thanks for your time.

  • #2
    You can't mix masks and packs between different manufacturers and models but SCBA bottles of the same pressure rating are designed to be interchangeable in an emergency.

    IOW, if you both have 4500psi systems, you can use each others air bottles in a pinch. It should not, however, be something that you plan do do in the normal course of mutual aid responses.
    Last edited by DeputyMarshal; 02-02-2007, 02:47 PM.
    "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"
    sigpic
    The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
      IOW, if you both have 4500psi systems, you can use each others air bottles in a pinch. It should not, however, be something that you plan do do in the normal course of mutual aid responses.
      so you are telling me that you should wait till someone fills a bottle from your dept.? around here we all run 2216 bottles, we interchange them all the time on calls, no problems whatsoever doing that, filled ones go in one area, and empty one in another to get filled, whatever they grab to out in your pack you get, whether aluminum or carbon fiber. after everything is through and completly under control then we worry about sorting out bottles.


      slueth, are you talking about in like RIT situations? other than that I am having trouble figuring out why you would need to use a mask with a different comp. pack as they should all have the mask and pack together

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by fire0099881 View Post
        so you are telling me that you should wait till someone fills a bottle from your dept.? around here we all run 2216 bottles, we interchange them all the time on calls, no problems whatsoever doing that, filled ones go in one area, and empty one in another to get filled, whatever they grab to out in your pack you get, whether aluminum or carbon fiber. after everything is through and completly under control then we worry about sorting out bottles.
        It's not an issue of who owns the bottles but who who the labeled manufacturer is. i.e. Scott packs should be used with Scott bottles, MSA packs with MSA bottles, etc.

        The bottles are all physically interchangeable* (and may well have all come from the same factory for all we know) but they're not supposed to be mixed and matched between manufactuerers except in an emergency. i.e. Scott bottle on an MSA pack or vice versa, etc.

        *Obviously you can't use a 4500psi bottle on a 2216psi pack but you can use a 2216psi bottle on a 4500psi pack if that's your only option.
        "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"
        sigpic
        The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
          It's not an issue of who owns the bottles but who who the labeled manufacturer is. i.e. Scott packs should be used with Scott bottles, MSA packs with MSA bottles, etc.

          The bottles are all physically interchangeable* (and may well have all come from the same factory for all we know) but they're not supposed to be mixed and matched between manufactuerers except in an emergency. i.e. Scott bottle on an MSA pack or vice versa, etc.

          *Obviously you can't use a 4500psi bottle on a 2216psi pack but you can use a 2216psi bottle on a 4500psi pack if that's your only option.
          ok, I guess I wasn't thinking the same way as to what you was saying, guess they never heard of that, we used to have old style MSA packs, but all we used and had was scott bottles, and there is still a few depts. around us that use MSA and are still the same way as they use scott bottles with theirs, and everyone else runs the new scott's

          Comment


          • #6
            When my old department was out on mutual aid,we'd fill any air bottle brought to the air truck,no questions asked.Well,we did ask how much PSI it took.
            I don't know if that counts as interchangeable but the threads all screwed in correctly and we didn't test the "bomb proof"container in the filling station.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by fire0099881 View Post
              so you are telling me that you should wait till someone fills a bottle from your dept.? around here we all run 2216 bottles, we interchange them all the time on calls, no problems whatsoever doing that, filled ones go in one area, and empty one in another to get filled, whatever they grab to out in your pack you get, whether aluminum or carbon fiber. after everything is through and completly under control then we worry about sorting out bottles.
              In the past we have been told by SCBA company reps that no company will warranty their pack with anothers bottle on it, as it sits stored. In an emergency if you need to utilze another's bottle for any reason, this would be acceptable. This at least assures them that departments are standardized.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by doughesson View Post
                When my old department was out on mutual aid,we'd fill any air bottle brought to the air truck,no questions asked.Well,we did ask how much PSI it took.
                I don't know if that counts as interchangeable but the threads all screwed in correctly and we didn't test the "bomb proof"container in the filling station.
                When operating a mobile air supply unit..

                #1: Check the pressure on the bottle Trying to fill a 2216 bottle with 4500 PSI will cause the burst disc safety to blow... and it's guaranteed to scare the living crap out of you!

                #2: Check to hydrostatic test date. It must be within 3 years of the date for an aluminum or carbon wrapped bottle, 5 for a steel bottle. If it exceeds the time frame.. do not fill it, despite how much the brothers beg. If it lets go while in the shatter shield, it will make a loud bang and scare the rest of the crap out of you. If it happens on someone's back.. it's a LODD.

                #3 All SCBA cylinders are to be filled in the shatter shield. Period. See reason #2 above.
                Last edited by CaptainGonzo; 02-03-2007, 06:54 PM.
                ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
                Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hey Chief , question,

                  aren't aluminum bottles five years for hydro aswell?
                  Firefighter
                  Eureka District Fire Department

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Thaddie View Post
                    Hey Chief , question,

                    aren't aluminum bottles five years for hydro aswell?
                    I thought so too. But the New Chief (Congrats) may know something I don't. I just picked up 16 aluminum bottles from hydro today. They did not say hey, your two years over... now you have me wondering.

                    I also think "some" depending on manufacture and manufacture date of the composites can go to 5 years, but still have the 15yr Remove from service date.

                    But... no matter how hard I try I still get those moments when I say to myself, " You stupid $#@@%!! What were you thinking!!!"

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      yeah, thats why I'm asking, I'm not 100% sure myself. I didn't think I was getting old this young At least the grey hairs haven't shown yet
                      Firefighter
                      Eureka District Fire Department

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Here's what I found on hydotesting...
                        All SCBA cylinders require periodic hydrostatic testing as required by 49 CFR 180.205. The frequency of the maintenance depends upon the cylinder material.

                        Steel cylinders should be tested every five years. They have an indefinite service life until they fail a hydro test.

                        Aluminum cylinders (not including hoop-wrapped) should be tested every five years. They have an indefinite service life until they fail a hydro test.

                        Hoop-wrapped cylinders should be tested every three years. Hoop-wrapped cylinders have a 15-year service life.

                        Fully wrapped fiberglass cylinders should be tested every three years. They have a 15 year service life.

                        Fully wrapped Kevlar cylinders should be tested every three years. They have a 15-year service life.

                        Fully wrapped carbon fiber cylinders should be tested every five years. They have a 15-year service life.
                        ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
                        Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Dang i gotta get my mind out of the gutter and wash it off. At first i thought this said intercourse.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            They keep changing the rules

                            We started using the carbon cylinders six years ago. Received first hydro after 3 years. I was starting to gather them up for their sixth birthday hydro & have found out that they can now go five years.
                            From Scott’s web site:
                            Aluminum Cylinders
                            • Scott’s Aluminum cylinders are built around the DOT
                            specifications and has a working pressure of 2216 psig
                            • Rated for 30 minutes in duration
                            • Free gas capacity of 45 SCF
                            • Hydrostatic testing to be performed every 5 years
                            • Unlimited life expectancy
                            Carbon Cylinders
                            • Scott’s Carbon cylinders are built around DOT specifications
                            and have a working pressure of 2216, 3000, or 4500 psig
                            • Lightweight, composite cylinder consisting of an aluminum
                            alloy inner shell, with a total overwrap of carbon fiber,
                            fiberglass and an epoxy resin
                            • Rated for 30, 45, or 60 minutes in duration
                            • Hydrostatic testing to be performed every 5 years
                            • 15-year life expectancy

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Interchangeability. (not even sure thats a word)

                              FF down, damaged regulator. do you have one that can be swapped with his? does he have one that can be swapped with yours?

                              Do you have more guys showing up than SCBA's available?

                              Can group purchasing happen? Like each department in the area buy 5, but all on 1 order for qty discounts?
                              "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

                              Comment

                              300x600 Ad Unit (In-View)

                              Collapse

                              Upper 300x250

                              Collapse

                              Taboola

                              Collapse

                              Leader

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X