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??Engine's as RIT?? ??RIGHT or WRONG??

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  • #16
    Here's where you hit the nail on the head;
    If i were a Batt i would rather have a Truck on stand-by, if resource permits.
    Many places do not have a truck co, or only have a few truck co's, but what they do have is engine co's. RIT's can be engine co's, truck co's, rescue, squads or what have you. It doesn't matter what the company rides in all that matters is that the members have the training and tools to do the job properly.

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    • #17
      In my opinion EVERY member (trained to enter a structure) of every department should be trained in RIT operations. If you expect one company weather it be a Truck, Engine or Rescue to be your RIT everytime, you are taking a risk anytime the alarm sounds. What happens if your Truck Co. (the only ones trained in RIT) is out on another call when the structure fire comes in. You are there waiting for another company from another district to come in and be your RIT team. And what happens if trouble starts before they arive on location or are in place. If everyone is trained in RIT operations then you can have a set assingment for RIT team Ex: the third unit in is RIT. I just hate to see a department say only a certin group will be assigned RIT operations, to say that you arer rolling the dice that they will be available for the call when the tones drop.
      A "Good" fire is not measured by how big it is, but by the fact that everyone is going home safe, and that we possibly learned something new about firefighting. Member:IACOJ

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      • #18
        City RIT

        Again i also think everyone should be and more than likley has been trained in RIT op's. Let me see if this helps what im tryin to say, this could apply to the city FF around the country more so than to the areas where trucks are few. In an area where there are plenty of eng's and trucks do you think a seasoned truck crew that does the kind of work involved in rescue's should be utilized over a seasoned eng crew?
        Even in our city there is a need to use an eng for RIT at times. But should it be replaced with a Truck when one arrives. Second Truck here on a Box.
        345

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        • #19
          Josh - I understand your "Engine vs. Truck" point, but how efficient is a Truck Co. as a R.I.T. when they must stretch & operate a hoseline because that is the best way to immediately protect / save a ff's life? What's the experience level on some Engines vs. Trucks? Who would you rather have coming for you - A 10-15 year Engine FF or a 2 year Truck FF? IMO the most important thing is to train ALL FF's and have the proper R.I.T. equipment available on the fireground. Stay Safe!

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          • #20
            In Houston, we're cross-trained, and we use Engines as RIT. Most of us have gone to a formal RIT class and there's a bunch of RIT stuff carried on the Chief's car, where the RIT reports on assignment.
            Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by THTMAN View Post
              Josh - I understand your "Engine vs. Truck" point, but how efficient is a Truck Co. as a R.I.T. when they must stretch & operate a hoseline because that is the best way to immediately protect / save a ff's life? What's the experience level on some Engines vs. Trucks? Who would you rather have coming for you - A 10-15 year Engine FF or a 2 year Truck FF? IMO the most important thing is to train ALL FF's and have the proper R.I.T. equipment available on the fireground. Stay Safe!
              Alright, now I'm gonna throw a wrench into this whole mix.

              I am not a fan of RIT having to pull a line. What the hell are your engine companies doing while RIT is going to work? Put the water-squirters to work protecting the man while RIT gets his *** out. Isn't that why we have RIT... So that we don't have to take people off already assigned tasks when resources may already be thin???
              Originally posted by ThNozzleMan
              Why? Because we are firemen. We are decent human beings. We would be compelled by the overwhelming impulse to save an innocent child from a tragic, painful death because in the end, we are MEN.

              I A C O J
              FTM-PTB


              Honorary Disclaimer: While I am a manufacturer representative, I am not here to sell my product. Any advice or knowledge shared is for informational purposes only. I do not use Firehouse.Com for promotional purposes.

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              • #22
                2yr Truck man??

                Originally posted by THTMAN View Post
                Josh - I understand your "Engine vs. Truck" point, but how efficient is a Truck Co. as a R.I.T. when they must stretch & operate a hoseline because that is the best way to immediately protect / save a ff's life? What's the experience level on some Engines vs. Trucks? Who would you rather have coming for you - A 10-15 year Engine FF or a 2 year Truck FF? IMO the most important thing is to train ALL FF's and have the proper R.I.T. equipment available on the fireground. Stay Safe!
                Wow, Brother. a 2 yr truck man, who does he know? Again yes train us all, but just like a well oiled NAVY SEAL TEAM, where they all are cross trained but we also have some with extra training and more on the job experiance.
                Im a die hard pipeman but any half trained fireman can figure out how to point a nozzle, so a truck guy operating a pipe in an emergency, as funny as he may look, im sure he could putt some of the impingement out. Then the other Truck guys can be used to search and bring us home. This can be done with the everyday skill's of tools he has over the eng guy.
                We lost a guy in 1994 (Nutter) fell tru a roof of a storage unit (prior to any RIT)with out explaining the special building constuction we had trouble accessing where h was traped.
                Could a truck with special training have made a diff. YES! Could an Eng? YES! But who would be faster and better suited??
                345

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                • #23
                  batt's extra equipment

                  Originally posted by johnny46 View Post
                  In Houston, we're cross-trained, and we use Engines as RIT. Most of us have gone to a formal RIT class and there's a bunch of RIT stuff carried on the Chief's car, where the RIT reports on assignment.
                  Our Batt carry the spare air pack, so we have to go find where he parked??
                  345

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                  • #24
                    Took me a min

                    Originally posted by Res343cue View Post
                    Alright, now I'm gonna throw a wrench into this whole mix.

                    I am not a fan of RIT having to pull a line. What the hell are your engine companies doing while RIT is going to work? Put the water-squirters to work protecting the man while RIT gets his *** out. Isn't that why we have RIT... So that we don't have to take people off already assigned tasks when resources may already be thin???
                    Ok i see what ya mean, brother. Yeah Rit may need an extra line but nothin wrong with usin existing lines and personal to help with a rescue. Keep the fire off the traped guy, improve the smoke conditions, stay calm and get to him FAST, we may just keep ourselves alive.
                    345

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                    • #25
                      How we do it.....

                      At my Paid-Call Department, which is 69 stations and runs 2,3 or 4 man Engines and 4 man Trucks, they run it this way..... Dependant upon the district normally the 3rd due unit will be assigned as the Back-up Team..... R.I.T. is established if more units or alarms are needed.
                      Here is exactly how it is worded:

                      B. The “ Two In, Two Out” Rule
                      The “Two in, Two Out” Rule shall be adhered to. The Incident Commander and other Company Officers must determine whether I.D.L.H. conditions exist at every incident. If I.D.L.H. conditions are found, the I.C. or Company Officer shall ensure that at least one two-person Standby Crew is in place, before committing personnel into the hazardous area. The only allowable exception occurs when the I.C. or Company Officer determines that there is an imminent life-threatening situation, where immediate action could prevent the loss of life or serious injury. No exception shall be permitted when there is no possibility to save lives. In these exceptional cases, a Standby Crew shall be established immediately upon the arrival of sufficient resources. When this “life-saving emergency rescue.” exception is invoked, the circumstances must be investigated and documented “with a written report submitted to the Fire Chief” following the instructions found in Procedures. B. 2. c. 1. d. (From NFPA 1500. 6-4.4.5)
                      C. Rapid Intervention Crews
                      The Incident Commander shall designate at least one two-person crew (preferably an engine company) as a RIC whenever an incident expands in size or complexity that includes an IC’s request for additional resources beyond the first alarm assignment. (Nothing precludes individual battalions from establishing a R.I.C. as a standard response on the first alarm.)

                      1. This includes interior structure fires, confined space rescues, building collapses, trench collapses, tunnel fires, high rise fires, and other I.D.L.H. incidents.
                      2. When available, a Technical Rescue Company will respond on Second Alarm responses for commercial fires, residential fires, high-rise fires, and other high-risk incidents that require the presence of Rapid Intervention Crews. A truck company or other appropriate resource may be substituted as necessary.
                      a. Consideration shall be given to the potential rescue problem of an incident and a matching of crew / equipment capability (i.e. medium / heavy rescue–collapse
                      At my career department the 3rd due unit is also the R.I.T. We are currently looking at adapting another policy since we run out of manpower real fast. What we are currently looking at is something like this..... The FFs from the first due engine are Fire Attack, the initial I.C. and the Engineer of the Attack Engine is the "standby crew." This requires the Captain, Engineer and both FFs to be ready to fight fire or rescue before the initial Interior Attack is made. It works for us because we all cross-train and we all have 4 man units.

                      As far as the initial question goes, personally and professionally I believe that the best trained personnel should be the "Standby Crew" since FF safety is always our first priority. Like it was typed earlier, any monkey can be trained to pull hose and spray water. Rescuing our own is a unique job, and it should be looked at that way.

                      Just my two cents........
                      "Be LOUD, Be PROUD..... It just might save your can someday when goin' through an intersection!!!!!"

                      Life on the Truck (Quint) is good.....

                      Eat til you're sleepy..... Sleep til you're hungry..... And repeat.....

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                      • #26
                        Webb,while your pristine outlook may apply to Louisville,I think you're seeing it doesn't apply too well to the rest of the world.Speaking only for my(and surrounding local)districts,there is a 98.9 percent reality your RIT WILL BE an"Engine" company.In the world of POC,there is no "Truck" company,at least not here.Everybody is capable of and trained to do truck work,or Engine work as required.Our policy on RIT is to use people from the nearest neighboring community that are properly trained for the job.In most cases they comprise experienced FF's with over 5 yrs on the job who have recieved advanced training.There are probably !0-15 Engines to every Truck in these parts.Add to this the fact your next "Truck"may be twenty miles away;well you do the math.I don't care who does RIT as long as they can do it and do it well. T.C.

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                        • #27
                          Here we are a small town dept. and all we have around us is small volly departments. We have to be cross trained to do everything. One fire here you may be the IC, next fire you may be pumping the truck, or doing roof work. I depends on who gets to the station first and what training you have had so far. We don't have one job task for any members, just what ever needs to be done at any given time.
                          www.clevelandokfd.com

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                          • #28
                            I'm new here so please bare with me. What does RIT stand for? From reading this thread I'm guessing the R stands for Rescue but what about the IT.

                            Thanks

                            clipse
                            sigpic

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                            • #29
                              Rapid Intervention Team
                              I am a complacent liability to the fire service

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by ChicagoFF View Post
                                Rapid Intervention Team
                                Thanks.
                                sigpic

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