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??Engine's as RIT?? ??RIGHT or WRONG??

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  • ??Engine's as RIT?? ??RIGHT or WRONG??

    Just a question? What do you brother's think of engine company's bein assigned to RIT? To me this is as unthinkable as hiring a plumber to do electric work. Department's may be puttin firefighters at risk with this practice. An engine, (even as tough as we are) just isnt as trained or experienced as our lazier and dumber Truck Guys across the floor. Let alone an engine doesnt carry the tools needed to save one of our own. Help me out Brother's i have seen this across the nation.
    ??RIGHT OR WRONG??
    345

  • #2
    It depends on the department. An FD may have all members cross trained for engine, truck, and rescue work.

    Specialization is a luxury to many FD's. It is more about training than where you normally ride.

    Our RIT procedure is to have off duty fire fighters respond in the rescue truck for RIT.
    Last edited by KenNFD1219; 01-01-2007, 04:02 PM.
    -------------------
    "The most mediocre man or woman can suddenly seem dynamic, forceful, and decisive if he or she is mean enough." from "Crazy Bosses"
    -----------------------------------------------
    Genius has its limits, but stupidity is boundless.

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    • #3
      IF the entire department has been trained on RIT procedures it shouldn't matter who is assigned to RIT.

      On my career FD Truck 1 is the RIT equipped rig and responds to all alarms of fire in the city. This does not mean however that Truck 1's assigned crew is always RIT. If they are needed to do truck work they do it and another company becomes RIT and that company may be an engine or quint company or made up of multiple rescue squads (ambulances, our rescues are staffed with firefighter EMTs or firefighter paramedics).

      This set-up works for us..others opinions may vary.

      FyredUp
      Crazy, but that's how it goes
      Millions of people living as foes
      Maybe it's not too late
      To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

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      • #4
        Whether you're a "Truckie" or an "Engine Puke" ( ) you're still one thing: A Firefighter .

        Around here, the "RIT" equipment is generally carried on one apparatus, and FIREFIGHTERS are assigned to the task. If a spare engine crew is all that is available, I have no doubt that brothers on that crew would make a save any different then the brothers that are from a "Truck".

        In the places where you can have defined, and always available resources, having a specific crew that can do RIT may work. In the smaller areas like mine, you have to train each and every member to function as not only an "Engine Puke" but as the hardened, esteemed, and well mannered Truckie that we all are at heart. ( )

        In my opinion, having firefighters that are trained properly to notice their surroundings, be proficient with their skills, and can work together will make much more of a difference then whether or not they arrived on the Pump or the Stick.
        Originally posted by ThNozzleMan
        Why? Because we are firemen. We are decent human beings. We would be compelled by the overwhelming impulse to save an innocent child from a tragic, painful death because in the end, we are MEN.

        I A C O J
        FTM-PTB


        Honorary Disclaimer: While I am a manufacturer representative, I am not here to sell my product. Any advice or knowledge shared is for informational purposes only. I do not use Firehouse.Com for promotional purposes.

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        • #5
          The real question should be why is your department assigning members tasks that they haven't been trained for?

          Don't be so quick to assume that ALL engine co. members don't have the training to opperate as a RIT. If YOUR engine guys haven't been trained then that is something that you should address within your dept. Here, our engine guys have been designated as the RIT because of the abundance of engine cos. and the relatively small number of trucks. On some busy days the third due truck could be coming from across the city, which would mean an unacceptable response time for a unit that is supposedly there to protect our safety. On the other hand, the RIT engine can usually be on scene within 3-5 min.

          In short, we do it because it works for us.

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          • #6
            As was basically said earlier, we assign an engine compaines crew to be the RIT team, because they can do it. If they have to take a tool off of another rig, so be it. What happens when you get out in the rural areas, and NO ONE has a truck. It's Engine's all around, so by the logic presented you need a truck to be RIT, one would have to wait about 45 min, to an hour in some places, before any interior operations could take place, because RIT wouldn't be around if there was a problem.

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            • #7
              whoops, double post

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              • #8
                Originally posted by JoshWebb View Post
                Just a question? What do you brother's think of engine company's bein assigned to RIT? To me this is as unthinkable as hiring a plumber to do electric work. Department's may be puttin firefighters at risk with this practice. An engine, (even as tough as we are) just isnt as trained or experienced as our lazier and dumber Truck Guys across the floor. Let alone an engine doesnt carry the tools needed to save one of our own. Help me out Brother's i have seen this across the nation.
                ??RIGHT OR WRONG??
                You don't carry forcible entry tools? Radios? Air packs with buddy breathing capabilities? Spare SCBA tanks?

                PS: there are more engine companies than ladder companies. Let the knuckle draggers do their thing.
                ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
                Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by CaptainGonzo View Post
                  You don't carry forcible entry tools? Radios? Air packs with buddy breathing capabilities? Spare SCBA tanks?

                  PS: there are more engine companies than ladder companies. Let the knuckle draggers do their thing.
                  That's MR. Knuckle Dragger to you!

                  You may out number us, but that just means we work harder
                  Originally posted by ThNozzleMan
                  Why? Because we are firemen. We are decent human beings. We would be compelled by the overwhelming impulse to save an innocent child from a tragic, painful death because in the end, we are MEN.

                  I A C O J
                  FTM-PTB


                  Honorary Disclaimer: While I am a manufacturer representative, I am not here to sell my product. Any advice or knowledge shared is for informational purposes only. I do not use Firehouse.Com for promotional purposes.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Like most here have said we are all firefighters and we should all be well versed in every part of the job INCLUDING saving our own. There are many FD's out there that have limited or no Truck Co. capabilities so there really isn't much of a choice. Many depts. are now equipping Engine Co's with more tools and many include FAST Co. set ups on there as well. Unless you are in a medium to large municipality, Engine Co. will always largely outnumber Ladder Co's. For example, Providence has 14 Engines, 8 Ladders and a Heavy Rescue. A Structural Assignment gets 3 engines, 2 ladders, Special Hazards (heavy rescue) a BC and an EMS rescue. Upon transmission of the Code Red (Rhode Islandese for working fire) the assignment gets filled out with 1 engine as a safety co. (assists in removing hazards from around the fireground and can be assigned as needed by IC), 1 ladder as FAST Co. and Engine 5 with Air Supply (tandem co.) This varies because there have been times where an engine has been FAST due to multiple incidents, any one of the fill in co's can be used as a FAST Co. and I have seen variations as well as an engine and ladder teaming up as a FAST team if the ladder co is a 3 man co. (3 of the 8 ladders have 3, the rest have 4).
                    "I have no ambition in this world but one, and that is to be a fireman. The position may, in the eyes of some, appear to be a lowly one; but we know the work which a fireman has to do believe that his is a noble calling."

                    Edward F. Croker
                    Chief 1899-1911
                    Fire Dept. City of New York

                    HOOK N' CAN of the I.A.C.O.J.

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                    • #11
                      Our depts. policy is for the 2nd arriving piece of equipment to desiginate 2 members to an r.i.team, whether its an engine or ladder co. All our crews are trained for this task, and we try to change them up if its a major fire, as most f.f."s would rather be busier. On a different topic, can anyone explain to me how to start a new thread? i just registered and cant for the life of me figure it out. thank-you in advance. happy new year from Burnaby,B.C.!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by polecat View Post
                        Our depts. policy is for the 2nd arriving piece of equipment to desiginate 2 members to an r.i.team, whether its an engine or ladder co. All our crews are trained for this task, and we try to change them up if its a major fire, as most f.f."s would rather be busier. On a different topic, can anyone explain to me how to start a new thread? i just registered and cant for the life of me figure it out. thank-you in advance. happy new year from Burnaby,B.C.!

                        It's probably not you polecat ... there have been ongoing technical issues with the forums for months and months and months now. Driving us all insane because the webteam seems to be on permanent vacation.

                        To start a new thread, go to the appropriate forum and near the top, left hand side, there's a New Thread tab.

                        Happy New Year from across the water in Victoria.
                        Last edited by RspctFrmCalgary; 01-01-2007, 07:15 PM. Reason: To fix a mistake
                        September 11th - Never Forget

                        I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

                        Sheri
                        IACOJ CRUSTY CONVENTION CHAIR
                        Honorary Flatlander

                        RAY WAS HERE FIRST

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                        • #13
                          Do the members of that department never ride another company? If an engine isn't as trained as a truck company then shame on the training program in that department. True, you can teach a chimpanzee to "pull hose squirt water, pull hose squirt water. But if that's all they feel they're good for then the men next to them on the truck are taking a gamble everytime they enter a burning building because the engine isn't as trained to get them out. Every member in my department is taught RIT. Not just in a classroom, but we've gone to vacant buildings and practice actual removals with fully geared up FF's. If there's a possibility of causing injury we use a manican. Recruits in the accademy get two days RIT training. We have 9 truck companies, but still train the engine guys on Rit just as much.

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                          • #14
                            "RIT training and the real world"

                            OK guys, i agree we are all taught to do both jobs. I think the guys on the Truck regularly on a day to day basis deal with the type of work involved in savin one of our own?? I know that we as firefighters in our hearts trust there is no challenge we cant over come. Louisville FD motto is "The Diffucult we do Immediately, The Imposible take's a Little Longer" example=a seasoned truck guy could breach a wall, take out a diffucult door more quickley than an engine FF that does not deal or think about this asspect of the job as much, our truck guys train on these things more often.
                            Im just sayin comein from an all paid dept where we ride every day on the same rig, ( exception of OT and Details) the Truck guys are out there bangin doors every day either on fires or forcin doors for police EMS whatever.
                            Im bein realistic i know from ridin on an engine every day im not as proficient as our Truck guys, no matter the amount of training i do.
                            If i were a Batt i would rather have a Truck on stand-by, if resource permits.
                            345

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                            • #15
                              I have an article somewhere about RIT or FAST engine co. lemme see if I can find it, maybe it will help.


                              *** Here is one, but I dont think it is the one I am looking for....

                              http://cms.firehouse.com/content/art...Id=10&id=10287
                              Last edited by backsteprescue; 01-01-2007, 10:08 PM.
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                              These opinions are mine and do not reflect the opinions of any organizations I am affiliated with.
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