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Boarded Up: What Would You Do?

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  • #46
    Originally posted by DeputyMarshal
    Bullsh*t. That's what kills firefighters needlessly. Unless we have a credible reason to believe there is a rescue to be made, we should stay out. That's why I suggested a preplan now -- before the building burns.

    No firefighter's life should ever be placed at risk without good reason. "We didn't do our job and preplan" isn't a good reason.
    Isnt a fire in a vacant house credible enough for you? I pose the question again....how did the fire start?
    And because there might be squatters in there, and not working people such as ourselves, we shouldnt make an attempt?
    Last edited by nyckftbl; 11-22-2006, 09:08 PM.
    Proud East Coast Traditionalist.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by DeputyMarshal
      Bullsh*t. That's what kills firefighters needlessly. Unless we have a credible reason to believe there is a rescue to be made, we should stay out. That's why I suggested a preplan now -- before the building burns.

      No firefighter's life should ever be placed at risk without good reason. "We didn't do our job and preplan" isn't a good reason.
      Please tell me that you don't base building occupancy solely on a preplan! Holy crap!

      A structure isn't clear unless we clear it! Preplans be damned!
      They serve an important function and provide good information, but in NO WAY WILL WE EVER rely on them in lieu of an actual search!
      Fire Lieutenant/E.M.T.
      IAFF Local 2339
      K of C 4th Degree
      "LEATHER FOREVER"
      Member I.A.C.O.J.
      http://www.tfdfire.com/
      "Fir na tine"

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by DeputyMarshal
        Bullsh*t. That's what kills firefighters needlessly. Unless we have a credible reason to believe there is a rescue to be made, we should stay out. That's why I suggested a preplan now -- before the building burns.

        No firefighter's life should ever be placed at risk without good reason. "We didn't do our job and preplan" isn't a good reason.
        How 'bout the fact that a fire started? Usually it ain't nature. Know your territory and your structures.

        Calculated risks.
        Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by DeputyMarshal
          Bullsh*t. That's what kills firefighters needlessly. Unless we have a credible reason to believe there is a rescue to be made, we should stay out. That's why I suggested a preplan now -- before the building burns.

          No firefighter's life should ever be placed at risk without good reason. "We didn't do our job and preplan" isn't a good reason.
          And how the hell are we supposed to preplan every board up in our district? Just start breaking and entering??? (actually we were doing that until we caught a beef for ....... wait for it...... you guessed it - breaking and entering).
          I am a complacent liability to the fire service

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by johnny46
            How 'bout the fact that a fire started? Usually it ain't nature. Know your territory and your structures.

            Calculated risks.
            You also have to take into account arsonists, fire bugs, juvenile firesetters, etc. The biggest factor that gives any indication that someone may be inside is the lady's statement that her boyfriend was inside and they were trying to keep warm.

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by LaFireEducator
              In the interest of peace and harmony during the holidays, I will refrain from posting an opinion on this one.
              Heartless killjoy.

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              • #52
                A boarded up house that has been boarded up for quite a while. Smoke showing from this house.

                Here is what I would do...360 survay looking for where possible vagrants or vandals entered. If I found it I would have that entrance enlarged. If not the chain saw would come out and a HUGE opening would be cut for safe entrance and egress. IF a working fire was found that place would look like swiss cheese when my truckies were done.

                Look it is a boarded up structure. VACANT. Once a rapid search was done to ensure no victims I couldn't care less if it burned to the ground. Of course we would make an attempt to put the fire out. But if it gets to the point of risking guys for nothing...looks like time for a new parking lot.

                I know my attitude may get me called a coward by some and perhaps even worse. Don't confuse my attitude with cowardice. I just haven't met a vacant, unoccupied building worth dieing over yet. If there are people in there that is a different story, all out, balls to the walls, effort to rescue them. Nobody in there fight the fire safely, never losing site of the fact it is a boarded up vacant building.

                FyredUp
                Crazy, but that's how it goes
                Millions of people living as foes
                Maybe it's not too late
                To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by FyredUp
                  A boarded up house that has been boarded up for quite a while. Smoke showing from this house.

                  Here is what I would do...360 survay looking for where possible vagrants or vandals entered. If I found it I would have that entrance enlarged. If not the chain saw would come out and a HUGE opening would be cut for safe entrance and egress. IF a working fire was found that place would look like swiss cheese when my truckies were done.

                  Look it is a boarded up structure. VACANT. Once a rapid search was done to ensure no victims I couldn't care less if it burned to the ground. Of course we would make an attempt to put the fire out. But if it gets to the point of risking guys for nothing...looks like time for a new parking lot.

                  I know my attitude may get me called a coward by some and perhaps even worse. Don't confuse my attitude with cowardice. I just haven't met a vacant, unoccupied building worth dieing over yet. If there are people in there that is a different story, all out, balls to the walls, effort to rescue them. Nobody in there fight the fire safely, never losing site of the fact it is a boarded up vacant building.

                  FyredUp
                  I dont think anyone would really argue...what irks me is the people who dont believe the building should even be searched. Fires dont just spontaneously combust in vacant dwellings. Once searches are made, by all means, let it burn.
                  Proud East Coast Traditionalist.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    that place has meth lab written all over it.
                    If their is smoke coming from that place you might want to have hazmat in the back of your head if you go in.

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                    • #55
                      I agree that the building needs opened up. Lets say a hole is cut in first floor, how big would the initial hole be. Huge to make entry or small to investigate where the fire is? We make our hole and have light smoke on first floor but here crackling fire on 2nd floor. Now what? Would you make an interior attack now or would you throw ladders to second floor to make another entry/egress/vent hole before making the interior attack? I guess what I am saying or asking is, would you make an aggresive interior attack with only the one hole on the 1st floor?
                      IACOJ - Senior Jake

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by SSHANK42
                        I agree that the building needs opened up. Lets say a hole is cut in first floor, how big would the initial hole be. Huge to make entry or small to investigate where the fire is? We make our hole and have light smoke on first floor but here crackling fire on 2nd floor. Now what? Would you make an interior attack now or would you throw ladders to second floor to make another entry/egress/vent hole before making the interior attack? I guess what I am saying or asking is, would you make an aggresive interior attack with only the one hole on the 1st floor?

                        If you are making an interior attack, it should be done from the first floor (especially if the fire is on the 2nd). The reason an aggressive interior attack would be made is if the brothers are in there searching for possible victims, in which case the hoseline must go between the fire, the victims, and the means of egress.
                        Proud East Coast Traditionalist.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Shank,Take a look at pictue two.New front door has been "installed" and it looks like we got fire enough for a party.Now regroup and give us your version of the battleplan.I say put the Hi-ex to it,the people in the basement can live in bubbles and when it comes out the eaves we can finish up.A few minutes of 2.5 cannonarly in the "front dooor" would probably have a good effect. T.C.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            How old is that building? What type of construction? Layout?
                            Do you have a preplan on that place?
                            If not I would suggest formulating one asap or at least get an idea of what the place looks like on the inside.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by SSHANK42
                              I agree that the building needs opened up. Lets say a hole is cut in first floor, how big would the initial hole be. Huge to make entry or small to investigate where the fire is? We make our hole and have light smoke on first floor but here crackling fire on 2nd floor. Now what? Would you make an interior attack now or would you throw ladders to second floor to make another entry/egress/vent hole before making the interior attack? I guess what I am saying or asking is, would you make an aggresive interior attack with only the one hole on the 1st floor?
                              Reread this quote from my post. Pay particular attention to the highlighted part:

                              Here is what I would do...360 survay looking for where possible vagrants or vandals entered. If I found it I would have that entrance enlarged. If not the chain saw would come out and a HUGE opening would be cut for safe entrance and egress. IF a working fire was found that place would look like swiss cheese when my truckies were done.
                              I assumed, my bad I guess, that saying my truckies would make the place look like Swiss cheese was a clear picture of how open the place would be if there was a fire. Of course if crews are working inside there would have to be more than one means of egress. If the fire is on the second floor the roof would be opened up or at least the windows uncovered. Sorry I wasn't that graphic in my explanation.

                              FyredUp
                              Crazy, but that's how it goes
                              Millions of people living as foes
                              Maybe it's not too late
                              To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by nyckftbl
                                I dont think anyone would really argue...what irks me is the people who dont believe the building should even be searched. Fires dont just spontaneously combust in vacant dwellings. Once searches are made, by all means, let it burn.
                                Please tell me there are no firefighters here that are that ignorant. Please...I don't want to believe that firefighters would assume that no teenagers have snuck in there to use it as a place to get high or drunk or well...go bowling. Or that no vagrants or homeless persons might think it was a perfect place to crash for a while. Or for that matter the property owner is in there doing renovation work.

                                Have we sunk so far in basic firefighting skills that we don't search anymore IF the building gives the appearance of not being occupied? I was taught both in fire school and by the old crusties that helped me in the beginning of my career that EVERY building is occupied until WE as firefighters say it isn't.

                                I am just shaking my head once again...I would imagine that the IC has a cool looking command vest on though.

                                FyredUp
                                Crazy, but that's how it goes
                                Millions of people living as foes
                                Maybe it's not too late
                                To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                                Comment

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