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  • Messing with equipment

    In the morning we do checks on all appartus to check that basic equipment is there and in working order...as I suppose most fire departments do. However, we recently discovered that our bosses are purposely messing with equipment to make sure the checks are being performed. We are supposed to "catch" the items they mess with....like disconnecting high pressure lines from SCBA and disconnecting nozzles from high rise packs. We asked upper management about it and they said this was "acceptable" so the bosses could make sure we are doing our checks.

    Does any other department allow this? Does this seem "acceptable"?

  • #2
    And just what happens if an early morning fire comes in BEFORE anyone has had time to even start checkout? What then? When some poor bastard grabs a pack that has the hose disconnected, or the hi-rise pack without the nozzle in it? When they're already 5 stories up before they realize? Who is going to answer to the board of inquiry or judge and jury if someone should get injured or worse because the equipment was tampered with?

    I'm sorry, but you do NOT play games with equipment like this. That equipment is there to save our lives and the lives of the people we protect.

    Perhaps if these supervisors are so worried about checkout not getting done properly, they should do their jobs and actually SUPERVISE. If there is any reason for them to mistrust the crews, then there is a much bigger problem, and that usually starts with poor leadership, not leading by example or improper training.

    Completely unacceptable.

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    • #3
      that is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. There are other ways to supervise that don't comrpromise life safety.
      Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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      • #4
        I have to agree that this is the stupidest and most negligent thing that I have ever seen posted here. How the upper management can support middle management doing something like this is completely beyond me.

        You should print the responses to this thread and hang them up in the station.
        Career Fire Captain
        Volunteer Chief Officer


        Never taking for granted that I'm privileged enough to have the greatest job in the world!

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        • #5
          Originally posted by BoxAlarm187
          I have to agree that this is the stupidest and most negligent thing that I have ever seen posted here. How the upper management can support middle management doing something like this is completely beyond me.

          You should print the responses to this thread and hang them up in the station.
          That used to be done in my dept. quite a few years ago. They finally realized how STUPID that is and trust the company officers and drivers to do their jobs.

          There is no excuse for messing with or removing equipment.
          FTM-PTB-RFB
          IACOJ

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          • #6
            Not only is that stupid its unnessessary, they could do the same by slipping notes into equipment "A shift rules, B shift drools, C shift are fools" it gets the same point across without endangering the ability to respond and is kind of funny.

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            • #7
              The instructors used to slip little tags on things we should be checking, like the engine oil dipstick, inside of the dualies, etc when I was in basic training. If you didn't come up with the right number of tags, start doing pushups.

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              • #8
                Umm, yeah. Real smart. Then someone gets hurt or killed.

                Time to do several things- Document, document, document. Then notify your state's OHSA office.

                Lastly, I would nofity the local media. Let the local taxpayers know what their dollars are being wasted on and putting public safety in to jeapordy. Doesnt management have anything better to do than "set traps" for it's trusted employees???

                Total joke and no professionalism there. Get on it!

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                • #9
                  Here's a better idea; instead of messing with equipment how about the officer's start being officer's. If the officer's are sitting on there a** and wondering if the machine is getting checked out. Then maybe the need to get the lead out there a** and get out in the engine bay and make sure the check is being done. What a crok of ****.

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                  • #10
                    I agree 100% with what others have said above. It's ludacris that tampering and/or removing equipment would be condoned by upper management. The ONLY case that I've heard about where management was insuring truck checks were being complete involved removing "seals" from the zippers on the EMS bag. This would force the person checking the bag to make sure that nothing is missing from that part of the bag. Apparently, the same department also devised a way to "seal" each compartment door of the AFTER they completed their checks. When the next crew came in, in the morning, they were supposed to break the "seal" do a "quick check" (starting saws, fans, etc. etc.) and then "re-seal" the compartment. However, if the seals were broken during the day, the crews were supposed to replace/clean/etc. any used equipment and then "re-seal." NOW, if the compartment was not "sealed" in the morning, the incoming crew had to do a complete check of the equipment.

                    So I hear... this "policy" was short-lived! As you can imagine, it tends to promote laziness and management started to notice negative results.

                    **I apologize for the long-windedness!
                    Do it because you love it, not because you love being seen doing it.

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                    • #11
                      Wow. Major safety issues for all involved. They are trying to teach you to be responsible to complete your duties by compromising your safety? That is so ***backwards. Lazy, ignorant and downright unprofessional. I can understand testing you and jokes but not when it comes to safety with equipment. I agree, print this out and present it at the next meeting or sooner before someone gets hurt. I can see the headlines now. Firefighters loses life due to negligence of officers.
                      Last edited by firetruckred; 09-17-2006, 01:45 AM.

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                      • #12
                        A former department had a Battalion Chief who would put a stone on the top of the apparatus sneakily. This would allow him to see if the truck was moved in the morning and the apparatus properly inspected by the Engineer.

                        Never had any equipment vandalized though. A couple of the other shifts were famous for leaving equipment around and kind of like playing "Hide & Go Seek" every morning when we did our checks.

                        *Mark
                        FTM-PTB-RFB-EGH

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                        • #13
                          One word for them.

                          MUTTS
                          Psychiatrists state 1 in 4 people has a mental illness.
                          Look at three of your friends, if they are ok, your it.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by onlyredtrucks
                            In the morning we do checks on all appartus to check that basic equipment is there and in working order...as I suppose most fire departments do. However, we recently discovered that our bosses are purposely messing with equipment to make sure the checks are being performed. We are supposed to "catch" the items they mess with....like disconnecting high pressure lines from SCBA and disconnecting nozzles from high rise packs. We asked upper management about it and they said this was "acceptable" so the bosses could make sure we are doing our checks.

                            Does any other department allow this? Does this seem "acceptable"?
                            I would immediately call the union and get this practice ended immediately. Purposely sabatoging the equipment is insane.

                            If your boss has no problem with it and his bosses don't see any problem with disabling your SCBAs and such it must be OK(turnabouts fair play!)...come up with a new house rule, Everyone checks their own mask(good rule to have anyhow)...and every day disconect the bosses mask, turn his high pressure on...etc. See how long until this bl*w job gets sick of showing up a jobs with a f*cked up mask.

                            A few times of being left on the floor below will teach him the errors of his ways.

                            If your officer has no concern for your safety or well being...you shouldn't be concerned with his either.

                            FTM-PTB

                            PS- If I was at a job and had a malfunction and I found out that someone purposely did this....They would be getting a tune-up from me as soon as I made it back to the street. I'm sure all the men I work with would feel the same.
                            Last edited by FFFRED; 09-17-2006, 08:39 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally Posted by onlyredtrucks
                              In the morning we do checks on all appartus to check that basic equipment is there and in working order...as I suppose most fire departments do. However, we recently discovered that our bosses are purposely messing with equipment to make sure the checks are being performed. We are supposed to "catch" the items they mess with....like disconnecting high pressure lines from SCBA and disconnecting nozzles from high rise packs. We asked upper management about it and they said this was "acceptable" so the bosses could make sure we are doing our checks.

                              Does any other department allow this? Does this seem "acceptable"?
                              That is not a "boss" ... that is a class "a" Mutt who will probably get someone killed.


                              If upper management concurs and condones with this practice, they are mutts, too
                              ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
                              Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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