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  • disturbing article

    http://phillymag.com/articles/philad...re_the_firemen

  • #2
    Maybe the first firehouse they should close is in Noel Weyrich's neighborhood. Maybe he feels a fair tradeoff for closed fire companies is his fire insurance rate going up. Maybe he is just another uninformed *******....You know the dangerous kind, the one that thinks he knows more then he really does.
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

    Comment


    • #3
      I don't know

      Some of what he says makes a certain amount of sense, shifting assets to EMS inside of firefighting when you have stations making less than a hundred runs a year is not unreasonable. Do I take what he says with a grain of salt, you bet I do! Do I believe that IAFF does some unneccesary fear mongering, You bet I do! This is nothing more than political posturing on both sides. Both sides need to come together and discuss whay truly is best for the city and be honest about it. Do I believe that will happen??


      YOU BET I DON'T!!!!
      Last edited by Mzanghetti; 09-09-2006, 02:54 PM.
      Mark Zanghetti
      FF-EMT
      Goshen Fire Dept.
      Waterford, CT

      Comment


      • #4
        I will take my Brothers side over some blogger ANY time.

        I would like to see those so called run stats before making assertations based on someone who refers to himself as a "contrarian". Also, I believe the PFD suppression companies respond on EMS runs.
        IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by MIKEYLIKESIT
          I would like to see those so called run stats before making assertations based on someone who refers to himself as a "contrarian". Also, I believe the PFD suppression companies respond on EMS runs.
          Just because it has worked for the past 20 years does not mean that it is the best system. If companies indeed are not doing more than a few runs a week, then something is wrong with the equation here. Perhaps a re-vamping of staffing/districting is in order.

          And as for apparatus reponding to medicals, I have two points:

          1) they need to actually do something.

          2) It does no good if you are waiting 20 plus minutes routinely for an ambulance.

          Philly has been lambasted with bad PR and several major lawsuits involving deaths due to not utilizing thier resources (especially EMS) properly.

          Both sides need to be realistic and open minded. It won't happen, but it needs to be done.
          "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

          The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

          "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

          "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

          www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

          Comment


          • #6
            Well Weyrich calls for FIRING half the City of Philadelphia Fire Department. That in itself is all I need to see to realize HE has ZERO credibility. Add ambulances. Don't fire firefighters.
            IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

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            • #7
              Using Weyrich logic, his idea would be to have 30 Engine Companies 14.5 Trucks serving a population around 1.5 million. Absolutely insane. Also, in the 16 years that the department has been "gathering cobwebs", they have lost in my estimation 16 to 17 members from LODD's. I stand by my opinion that Weyrich is a hack.
              IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

              Comment


              • #8
                .02

                Originally posted by DaSharkie
                Just because it has worked for the past 20 years does not mean that it is the best system. If companies indeed are not doing more than a few runs a week, then something is wrong with the equation here. Perhaps a re-vamping of staffing/districting is in order.

                And as for apparatus reponding to medicals, I have two points:

                1) they need to actually do something.

                2) It does no good if you are waiting 20 plus minutes routinely for an ambulance.

                Philly has been lambasted with bad PR and several major lawsuits involving deaths due to not utilizing thier resources (especially EMS) properly.

                Both sides need to be realistic and open minded. It won't happen, but it needs to be done.
                Nothing hurts FD Public Relations more than seeing a fire engine with 3 or 4 firefighters standing around doing nothing waiting for the ambulance. There is quite a bit of documentation around about how there are fewer and fewer structure fires every year. Ems runs are constantly increasing. I just think that Fd's that look down and refuse to do EMS cuz they are waiting for the big one are out of touch with todays reality. It is possible that this author was using hyperbole to make a point as well. There needs to be some changes in the way things seem to be working there and the author is just voicing his opinion in the discussion
                Mark Zanghetti
                FF-EMT
                Goshen Fire Dept.
                Waterford, CT

                Comment


                • #9
                  If you have an engine crew standing around and doing nothing on an EMS run they should be retrained. Their is nothing treatment wise an ALS engine can't do that the ambulance can. If their is an extended wait then the engine should be done and waiting to transport by the time the MICU arrives.
                  EMS is rapidly becoming the bulk ouf our job, get used to it or retire.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ADSNWFLD
                    EMS is rapidly becoming the bulk ouf our job, get used to it or retire.
                    Or transfer to a company where ems is not the majority of the work. Everyone keeps saying that they don't do fires anymore. There are still plenty of working companies here, and I'm sure there are around the country as well. For those who like the ems crap, great. Get yourself on an ambo and be happy. But that does not change the fact that the FIRE departments main repsonsibility is to fight fires. Get used to it or go to an ambo. The ems "side" of the department (although my job has no more in common with a paramedic than it does with a plumber) is always telling us how much ems is increasing, but if we sent two or three rigs to every auto, rubbish, dumpster, etc - like we now do to every tummy ache, stubbed toe, drunk, or guy asleep on the sidewalk, we could claim that fire was taking over, get used to it and get ems out of the house. Just because every BS run gets an engine or two does not mean ems is increasing, it just means the city is wasting time and resources on BS.
                    I am a complacent liability to the fire service

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Mzanghetti
                      There is quite a bit of documentation around about how there are fewer and fewer structure fires every year. Ems runs are constantly increasing.
                      I just had five fires in four shifts, three shifts without, then another last night. Tell me which one we should have had a delayed response to so that we could go on an ems run where an engine is such a big help. We don't even carry c-collars, for christs sake. But we do carry alot of hose and five guys trained to put out fires. Which is more important again? Where are you a fireman?
                      Last edited by ChicagoFF; 09-07-2006, 09:30 PM. Reason: miscount
                      I am a complacent liability to the fire service

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Posted by ChicagoFF
                        I just had five fires in four shifts, three shifts without, then another last night. Tell me which one we should have had a delayed response to so that we could go on an ems run where an engine is such a big help. We don't even carry c-collars, for christs sake. But we do carry alot of hose and five guys trained to put out fires. Which is more important again? Where are you a fireman?

                        From Mzanghetti's geocities page
                        Emergency Medical Technician-I work at Foxwoods Casino, Goshen Fire Department in Waterford, CT is where I volunteer as an EMT when I am off duty from my regular job. I actually live in the City of New London, but they have a full time paid fire department and don't use volunteers.
                        ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
                        Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by ADSNWFLD
                          If you have an engine crew standing around and doing nothing on an EMS run they should be retrained. Their is nothing treatment wise an ALS engine can't do that the ambulance can. If their is an extended wait then the engine should be done and waiting to transport by the time the MICU arrives.
                          EMS is rapidly becoming the bulk ouf our job, get used to it or retire.
                          My crew and I stand around quite routinely. We do not need re-trained. What we need is to not be sent on BS EMS calls. I do not even need to here the call. I can call BS with I am sure over a 95% accuracy rate, just by hearing the description of the call from our dispatcher.

                          I do not mind at all going on EMS calls where we are needed. If we can have a positive outcome on the outcome of a patients condition, I am all for it. I do not need to go babysit a grown person who has had a stomach ache for the last 3 days because the ambulance is coming from across town and it would look better; aka - possibly reduce the risk of liability on the cities behalf because the 30 ALS ambulances we have are all tied up on other BS runs.

                          So Adsnwfld, what class would you recommend that I retake because my best treatment for people with stomach aches, headaches, stumped toes, cut fingers, back aches, or my favorite - the perverbial *** bleed consists of:

                          "Sir (or Maam) - Do you want to be taken to the hospital by ambulance?"

                          "Okay. Sit back and relax. The ambulance is coming from across town. There is not much I can do for you. If something gets worse let us know."

                          In Memphis, it is very clear that if someone calls and asks for an ambulance, they are going to get one, and maybe a fire company along with it. It is also very clear that regardless of how bogus, if that person wants to be transported, you take them.

                          That is not EMS taking over fire departments. You do realize that the "E" is for emergency.....right????

                          BS is taking over fire departments, not EMS.
                          Last edited by MemphisE34a; 09-07-2006, 11:05 PM.
                          RK
                          cell #901-494-9437

                          Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

                          "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


                          Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            while structure fires have on an average been on the decline ..............this guy sounds like a goofus to me. I cant imagine there is ONE city Philly company doing 1 run a week. So things maybe need to be shifted around ? Possibly but firing half of them ....plain ol ludicris. Chicago ..........not even a c-collar bro ?
                            IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
                            Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
                            ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
                            RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
                            LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
                            I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
                            "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
                            http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Weruj1
                              I cant imagine there is ONE city Philly company doing 1 run a week. So things maybe need to be shifted around ? Possibly but firing half of them ....plain ol ludicris. Chicago ..........not even a c-collar bro ?
                              We have rigs here that probably do less than that. They are the airport crash rigs. Should we get rid of those??? Nope, not even collars. We used to carry them but they came and took them off awhile back.
                              I am a complacent liability to the fire service

                              Comment

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