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Faliure to Yield

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  • osfd100
    replied
    I also have never seen anyone cited for not yeilding to fire apparatus. I do feel it is a problem in many areas.

    However;

    The only law I follow is getting to the station and back home home safely. I take responsibilties for my actions and I'm always prepared to take action in case the other divers screw up. Laws or not, you just can't trust the other drivers... people do crazy things if and when they hear or see fire apparatus approaching.

    Leave a comment:


  • REVANANT
    replied
    Originally posted by SgtScott31
    Because of several recent officer fatalities in Nashville and surrounding counties, several DA's are pushing for the law to become an arrestable offense. So rather than getting a citation, we haul your a** to jail.
    I was in the area when the funeral for one of the officers was held. He'd pulled over to help a disabled motorist and was struck by a tractor trailer, the driver of the truck was arrested for manslaughter and several other offenses. The D/A's and law enforcement there take this very seriously.

    http://www.officer.com/article/artic...&siteSection=2
    http://www.tdot.state.tn.us/news/2005/090205.htm

    Leave a comment:


  • Saultfirepics
    replied
    Well there seems to be second guessing on his part too. As well as doing a job of CYA on his part too. Don't forget he has a lot on line for being an instructor/trainer too. If anyone who took his classes gets into accident it could come back at him, that is just how lawyers are to get more money.

    Now a little information that isn't entirely true as per written codes in the law as it is read by you and me, may led to certain doubts about his ability to tell truthful information. What I am concern about is the codes in the law that all, but neutralizes the particular codes that you have issue with. Lot of the enforcement of these laws are done by humans. We all wish all laws to be enforced equally, but when laws are enacted that contradict other laws. Well, honestly, can we not see why certain laws appear to go un-enforced.

    So like I said maybe you and other who have concern may just want to ask why first before pointing a finger. As they say in the UK SAS there are always three more pointing back at you.

    Leave a comment:


  • swfire42
    replied
    Originally posted by Saultfirepics
    Wow, that is enlightingly. I don't know about you, but most jobs I have had there is always 'What is written' and there is 'This is how we do this'. Maybe other than slamming this instructor for 'lying' to you. You may want to find out why he had given the information that way. Like was pointed out he may just trying to do you favor. Yes, it may not have been the most accurate way to inform you. Yet, if he stood there and said, 'Gee, there is law that saids we have the right away, but you have to respond with all due care.' Most people 9 times out of 10(with some groups this would be high, and other would be too low) would stop listen after being told they had the right away. They would give the rest of the sentence another thought again until they were being sued.

    As said laywers don't give two cents that legally you had the right away, for there are dozen other laws that make it so cloudy and clear as mud in court of law. Those cases that go before juries too are the worse in which you, various others who may not know what all the various laws may state or means to look this up when they make their decisions.

    So maybe you should ask the instructor why, instead of coming here before you have talk to him. Or for that fact give this information to others your class. The instructor is trying to teach you how to do something safely. Way it sounds now most of the class will not really pay attention to him due to they think he is full of BS. Which isn't good, for it may save your life later on what he has to say.

    Just some thoughts...
    I understand where you are coming from. It is sad that there are people in this business that would take advantage of the law. My big problem with him telling us something that isn't true is that now he has us second guessing everything he is telling us. There has to be a better way of going about it other than telling a group of grown men a flat out lie.

    Leave a comment:


  • ADSNWFLD
    replied
    One side note, we had better start policing our own better. With the added scrutiny that will follow enforcement, I see cases being dropped because the fire department didn't act with due reguard when responding or didn't follow acepted procedures for warning and blocking a street as spelled out in the MUTCD. Chapter 6 covers our work http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/index.htm

    This year we have lost many of our members to vehicle accidents, we can't expect the public to drive well when we don't. Be a good example both on runs and cruising around town.

    Stay safe

    Leave a comment:


  • ADSNWFLD
    replied
    You do realize these laws are made to make the politicians look good and have little to do with our safety.
    In IL you could face a $10,000 and a 2 year suspension, similar laws are present in a construction zone.
    All it is by us is punishment AFTER we are in an accident and killed.
    It is better then nothing, but it needs to be enforced like the seatbelt laws.
    Cameras in the rigs would probably be needed to document tags

    Leave a comment:


  • Saultfirepics
    replied
    Originally posted by SgtScott31
    In TN it is a traffic citation for failure to yield. I cited a guy a couple of months ago for it. It cost him a ride to jail because his license ended up being suspended.

    Because of several recent officer fatalities in Nashville and surrounding counties, several DA's are pushing for the law to become an arrestable offense. So rather than getting a citation, we haul your a** to jail.

    This sounds like too over due in too many areas of US. I for one hope they succeed. Maybe after a couple time of being arrested, people will get the idea to pull over... Then again, maybe not...

    Leave a comment:


  • Saultfirepics
    replied
    Originally posted by swfire42
    That is quiet possibly the dumbest idea i have ever heard. (not calling you dumb) If that is in fact what he did, by lying his class lost all validity in most of the classes eyes. Why not tell us what the law really says and trust that we are professional emergency personnel and will use our best judgement. We are not kids and can infact handle the truth

    Wow, that is enlightingly. I don't know about you, but most jobs I have had there is always 'What is written' and there is 'This is how we do this'. Maybe other than slamming this instructor for 'lying' to you. You may want to find out why he had given the information that way. Like was pointed out he may just trying to do you favor. Yes, it may not have been the most accurate way to inform you. Yet, if he stood there and said, 'Gee, there is law that saids we have the right away, but you have to respond with all due care.' Most people 9 times out of 10(with some groups this would be high, and other would be too low) would stop listen after being told they had the right away. They would give the rest of the sentence another thought again until they were being sued.

    As said laywers don't give two cents that legally you had the right away, for there are dozen other laws that make it so cloudy and clear as mud in court of law. Those cases that go before juries too are the worse in which you, various others who may not know what all the various laws may state or means to look this up when they make their decisions.

    So maybe you should ask the instructor why, instead of coming here before you have talk to him. Or for that fact give this information to others your class. The instructor is trying to teach you how to do something safely. Way it sounds now most of the class will not really pay attention to him due to they think he is full of BS. Which isn't good, for it may save your life later on what he has to say.

    Just some thoughts...

    Leave a comment:


  • SgtScott31
    replied
    In TN it is a traffic citation for failure to yield. I cited a guy a couple of months ago for it. It cost him a ride to jail because his license ended up being suspended.

    Because of several recent officer fatalities in Nashville and surrounding counties, several DA's are pushing for the law to become an arrestable offense. So rather than getting a citation, we haul your a** to jail.

    Leave a comment:


  • kd7fds
    replied
    I could be wrong (happens often), but I have been checking Idaho law lately for this specific issue.

    I can find city and county ordinances that require people yield to emergency vehicles, but I haven't (yet) found a specific state law requiring the same thing.

    I did find the State Law that holds emergency vehicle operators liable for accidents caused when they are not following traffic laws.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dave1983
    replied
    Yes, in Fla it is against the law not to yield to an emergency vehicle. Ive seen PD pull people over in the past for not moving out of our way. PD is very good about that, at least in my area.

    Leave a comment:


  • MemphisE34a
    replied
    doughesson,

    Agreed. We have the law here, but I have never ever seen anyone cited for it. We are lucky if we can even get the police on any scene we have in a timely fashion, let alone make sure people are moving out from in front of us along the way!!

    Leave a comment:


  • doughesson
    replied
    Yeah,Kentucky and Tennessee both have a move over law.But we rarely have time to get the tag number of the offending vehicle and hand it off to the SO for further action.
    Just because a law exists doesn't mean people automatically follow it.I've seen in my return to Tennessee that most speed limit signs seem to be suggestions.
    LIke another poster says,the police cannot always follow the rig to cite offenders and if they do trail along,they're usually going to the same call and have traffic control and wreck investigation in mind than pulling folks over for traffic citations.

    Leave a comment:


  • swfire42
    replied
    check your state laws. It may be that if you write down the liscense plates you can have a cite sent to them.

    Leave a comment:


  • the1141man
    replied
    Generally cops do not follow every apparatus to give out tickets to drivers who don't yield, however.
    Bingo. Laws are only effective if enforced.

    It's rare that a peace officer happens to be in the vicinity of a code-3 ambulance or apparatus to see anyone failing to yield...often those officers are also responding to calls (probably the same one the ambo or engine is *LOL*) and cannot stop and take 15 mins to pull traffic for FTY.

    Even if they did pull traffic on people...how many vehicles regularly fail to yield on the open highways/freeways, multi-lane streets, etc? Even if you did have a cop around, he can only stop and cite one vehicle at a time. SO...the mindset is the same as with speeding, people figure that hey, the whole pack is speeding, and he can only stop one of us...I'll take my chances.

    You know how it is: getting to the store 30 seconds later will just absolutely trash anyone's day, ruin their life, destroy their marriage, and kill their dog/cat.

    Leave a comment:

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