Leader

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Turnout/Bunker Gear: Time for a change?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • RspctFrmCalgary
    replied
    Originally posted by vegas0012
    Has anyone not noticed that the first 20 posts or so were from 'guest' accounts? Does anyone else find that suspicious?
    Nope, not suspicious.

    As has been pointed out, this is a 5 year-old thread brought back to life.

    Most of the names you see as guests are actually active, registered members. Some are previous usernames of current members. This happens all the time with really old posts.
    Last edited by RspctFrmCalgary; 12-12-2006, 06:11 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • vegas0012
    replied
    wtf

    Has anyone not noticed that the first 20 posts or so were from 'guest' accounts? Does anyone else find that suspicious?

    Leave a comment:


  • cdemarse
    replied
    Originally posted by firemanrn
    Hey 19. I think you need to read alittle before making comments. Heart attacks have a strong hereditary link but you need to learn what happens to the body when it is stressed...especially heat stressed. The University of Maryland recently released their "firefighter training guidelines" which does a good job of explaining what happens when heat stressed. It is a very detailed article. The University has a strong history of firefighter research and training. Read the guidelines. It's about 120 pages long. Tell me if your opinion changes after you have some cold facts.
    Stay safe.
    Speaking of reading a little before making comments.
    You just upped a thread that has been dead for over 5 years.

    Leave a comment:


  • johnny46
    replied
    Originally posted by TXFIRE6
    I am curious if there's any Houston firefighters on here who can give us some input.statistically Houston fire Department sually ranks 2nd only to Chicago in total number of fires.Furthermore its one of the most humid and hot places in the country. How many firefighters has Houston lost to heart attacks from bunker gear? O am curious what they think..I saw one of their guys already says full turnouts is the way to go..are there any other Houston guys who might be able to help? They see as much if not more fire than the other cities mentioned, and are in a much worse climate for firefighting for much more of the year than all those cities mentioned...just a thought...

    ------------------
    Any Opinion expressed, are my own, and do not reflect my Department...RB
    Where do you get the 2nd in number of fires?

    I know of one firefighter during ARFF training who had a heart attack.


    Wow. I just looked at the date on this.

    OOOLLLD.

    Leave a comment:


  • firemanrn
    replied
    Hey 19. I think you need to read alittle before making comments. Heart attacks have a strong hereditary link but you need to learn what happens to the body when it is stressed...especially heat stressed. The University of Maryland recently released their "firefighter training guidelines" which does a good job of explaining what happens when heat stressed. It is a very detailed article. The University has a strong history of firefighter research and training. Read the guidelines. It's about 120 pages long. Tell me if your opinion changes after you have some cold facts.
    Stay safe.

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    I am curious if there's any Houston firefighters on here who can give us some input.statistically Houston fire Department sually ranks 2nd only to Chicago in total number of fires.Furthermore its one of the most humid and hot places in the country. How many firefighters has Houston lost to heart attacks from bunker gear? O am curious what they think..I saw one of their guys already says full turnouts is the way to go..are there any other Houston guys who might be able to help? They see as much if not more fire than the other cities mentioned, and are in a much worse climate for firefighting for much more of the year than all those cities mentioned...just a thought...

    ------------------
    Any Opinion expressed, are my own, and do not reflect my Department...RB

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    This is just my opinion but i think it should be up to the individual BUT there should be some sort of clause added to the by laws of the fire department saying that if the person wearing the 3/4 boots and coat were injured due to not wearing full gear the fire department can not be held liable.
    That is just my opinion not the opinion of Eastern Garrett VFRD.

    ------------------
    Matt Briskey
    Eastern Garrett County
    Station 80
    www.easterngarrettvfrd.hoemstead.com/home.html

    "What's in it for me?

    Hard Work
    Injury
    Possible Death
    A deep and abiding feeling of personal satisfaction found in few aspects of life"

    "Nobody ever called the fire department when they did something smart!!"

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    A 40 year old Capt. on our dept. had a heart attack the other day. 40yrs old, 6' 180lbs, works out every day. Eats nothing but lite food. He was driving past the firehouse off duty. Should we blame the car? Yes bunker gear is hot and heavy, but I can't believe the FDNY is experiencing anything but coincidence and bad luck. 10 yrs ago a neighboring dept of 170 FF had three guys in their 40s-50s die within 4 days of each other. Detroit had the second 50 year old guy in 2 years die while sleeping on duty. No more beds?

    ------------------

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    I have read all of the posts on this thread, and I have on bit of input. The career FDs have uniforms that may or may not include wool pants. But for the volunteer crowd we show up to fires in jeans, shorts, nylon wind pants. This shouldnt be an arguement between the paid professionals and the volunteer professionals. I can see the point of view from the guys from CFD, BFD and NYFD. But they wear uniforms that can be designed for their ability to dissipate heat and be fire resistant. But for the volunteer companies out there full turnouts are the way to go, the lighter the better, because of the way that we trnd to turn out for calls.

    Just my two cents.



    ------------------
    Shawn M. Cecula
    Captain
    Lewiston Fire Co. No. 2

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    bfd,

    I really don't care what you, or FDNY, or SFFD or Chicago or where ever wears for turn-outs. And you are right I don't see as many fires as you. I work as a career FF and serve another community as a volly. My volly FD uses the very same bunkers you used to wear, Boston spec. My career FD uses a different brand...heavier and bulkier. I will take the weight and the heat of that stuff for the added protection. I started out with pull-up boots and bought my own bunkers for the protection.

    I think it is absolutely ridiculous to blame the gear entirely for finding yourself in farther than you need to be. Whatever happened to knowing your surroundings? Or watching the fires behavior? If people know the hose stream will flow effectively over 50 feet why do people crawl right into the room, on top of the fire to put it out? Bravado? Stupidity? Poor training? What? This argument is similar to the "I don't wear a hood cause I want my burning ears to tell me its time to leave" argument. Pay attention to what is going on, don't go farther than you have to initially to do the job.

    If heat stress is a problem due to multiple entries into the structure why doesn't your FD Health and Safety committee work towards strict rehab guidelines? My career FD has them in place. Rehydration and opening up or removing gear will alleviate some of those problems.

    Take care and stay safe,

    FyredUp

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    A few weeks back, one of our guys is on a roof making a hole for a fire in the cockloft. Things go bad and the roof goes. Our guy falls through the roof and into the first floor. The place is going like hell making the advancing hoseline fight for every inch. The truck pulls a 20' straight ladder onto the roof and shoves it down the hole. I forget how long it took to get the ladder down to him, but think about it: get it off the truck, to the building, carry it up the ladder, and put it down the hole. Now all this time, our guy is down on the fire floor, no mask, no helmet. The guys on the roof start banging the butt of the ladder against the floor. Our guy hears it, crawls to ladder, climbs up through the flames and through the hole. When he reaches the top of the ladder, he's on fire. The guys rip him off the ladder and throw him into the snow on the roof. After burying him in snow for a minute, our guy's able to climb down the ladder and walk to the ambo. He walked away with 1st and 2nd degree burns to his neck and face, but guess what,the jewels were intact!

    If you haven't tried 3/4 boots, try it. There is a difference. Especially if you catch a double-header! Or a 5 houses on fire and searches need to done in each one!

    As far as being out of shape, I disagree. I worked harder and took more of a beating as a rookie. But with experince, the veterans learn how to do things easier and still get more done. They work smarter, not harder.

    Chicago, Boston, New York, all aggresive departments. Tactics and training and experince will help keep you from getting burned. When was the last drill you went to where the instructor said "Now you can go right into the fire, it looks like it will flash, but don't worry you have bunker pants on!"?

    It's like saying if we went into burning buildings handcuffed to each other, no one would ever get lost.

    Dave

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    I'll have to agree with Bfd1071.

    I have been inside well over 1,000 building fires and had a very close call back in 1988 due to new gear. Hose streams reach 50' but we insist on going right up to the damn fire..

    Give me my 3/4 boots back. the things u call bunker gear we called night pants...we only wore them after going to bed. I'll agree that too many firemen go to very few fires, but effective training is the answer to that.

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    That is correct, in San Francisco we are not required to wear our turn-out pants at all. We still wear wool pants during the day, but wear our turn-out pants at night due to the ease of getting into them. I'm sure this sounds crazy to many other fireman, but I feel fortunate to have the option of wearing my wool pants. I would hate to have to wear the bunker gear we have been issued all day. I find it too restrictive and cumbersome, particularly while on a peaked roof. I can understand how a person can overheat and dehydrate themselves. I am sure there are better products out there. As far as safety, I have, unfortunately, been caught in a flashover while wearing my wool pants and they protected me very well. It wasn't luck because I did get burned, but not on my legs. The wool did what it has done for so long. I'm sure there is bunker gear out there that is much better than the stuff I have, but no thanks. I'll wear my wool pants until they are no longer an option.

    Stay Safe!

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    For the record, I wear full bunker gear on every fire run: 7.5 oz. PBI/Kevlar w/ quilted Nomex liner, leather Pro boots, leather helmet, NFPA gloves and Nomex hood. This is mandatory in my department. There have been many times when I needed and appreciated having that level of protection. I can also say that after a dozen or so runs on the shift, and especially in the summer months it leaves me feeling pretty worn out and longing for the days of the 3/4 boots.
    Oh, and by the way, to those who "look to the west" for their firefighting ideals...check out the San Francisco Fire Department some time. You'll most likely see a SFFD fireman wearing a leather helmet, coat, FR uniform pants and work boots, no hood. They usually wear bunker pants only at night. SFFD has some very busy companies who see a lot of work and get the job done. So, that makes San Fran, Chicago and Boston among the major departments that don't wear full bunker gear all the time. I'm not saying any of these departments are right or wrong, we, or our own departments, should obviously make these decisions for ourselves...just some food for thought.

    [This message has been edited by NozzleHog (edited 01-23-2001).]

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Okay, i have to agree with bfd. these guys fight a hell of a lot more fires than most do. i have been a ff in the south for ten years and have never fought more than three major structures a year. Most guys are whipped after a single fire, the bunker gear definately adds to the physical exhaustion of these firefighters. The chance these guys are going to fight another major structure that day is slim...and that is a good thing. Philly did testing with climbing stair with and without gear. now they bring their work boots on all calls and carry their fire boots up to a staging area if the situation requires it. We fight wiland fires in our gear which is not what it is designed for. Hot temps, high humitidity, fire, and bunker gear don't mix well. I feel that the need for tradition in the fire department have prevented u.s. ff with getting the best gear necessary to best accomplish their missions. I love my helmet, but the design is obviously antiquated and our need of comm and therman imaging (to be fucnt must be hands free) are ackwardly retrofitted to the existing gear. we need to evolve. I walked in toa house that was full of white smoke from a a.c. fire. i had my jacket open and my nomex around my neck. I had become complacent responding to so many false alarms. After a primary search we located no fire orderred then fans to vent. with that fire ripped through the roof and i watched the attack scuttle door be sucked into it and saw a see a fire. we had no hoseline. Lucky the fire vented through the roof and we fought the fire with very little heat from the fire. my chief was next to me in jeans and a tee shirt. we could have fought it literally that way. but shouldn't we gone expecting the worse? i think so. always wear your gear, but more important make sure it is clean and you properly fasten it. So it is the trade off, if i had to fight three to five fires on my one shift, i might require lighter gear to reduce the wear on my body.

    Leave a comment:

300x600 Ad Unit (In-View)

Collapse

Upper 300x250

Collapse

Taboola

Collapse

Leader

Collapse
Working...
X