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Bourkes, goggles, face sheild

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  • Bourkes, goggles, face sheild

    What are needed to make a structural firefighting helmet NFPA approved? I need to Know and I would also like it if someone could email the NFPA regulation in pdf form. Thanks
    Everything that I post is my opinion only, none of this should be taken as fact.

  • #2

    I believe the minimum is a faceshield. You can have Bourkes but as long as they have goggles.

    Personally, give me my faceshield any day. I've burned many a face shield but because of the inexpensive shield I've saved many expensive facepieces. I'd rather a fire burn my shield than what's keeping me breathing.


    • #3
      search...............can anyone say search ? is the horse dead yet ? AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !

      now that that is outa my system .........need to have goggles ....no face shield no bourkes need to have goggles. If you do some looking around you will find all tyhe info you need right here in the forums.
      Last edited by Weruj1; 10-13-2003, 08:03 PM.
      IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
      Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
      ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
      RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
      LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
      I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
      "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
      http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115


      • #4
        Gimme a minute

        It's not like the NFPA lets anyone see their codes and standards for free ya know.


        • #5

          Full face shields are still NFPA compliant, or at leats the Firestore is selling the N6A with fullface as NFPA compliant.


          Just changing the eye protection will not bring the helmet into compliance. It must have that little old sticker that says it is. The N5A and N6A leathers have some other differences as well (besides eye protection). Primarily the N6A has additional penetration (hmmm, I wonder if its related to that smoothbore, fog nozzle prenetration thing...er ahh sorry ) protection.

          So its full face or goggles, and if I can find the standard I send it to ya.



          • #6
            Re: Bourkes, goggles, face sheild

            Originally posted by sfdlt5
            What are needed to make a structural firefighting helmet NFPA approved? I need to Know and I would also like it if someone could email the NFPA regulation in pdf form. Thanks
            NFPA is not a regulatory body; it is a standards body. It writes consensus industry standards; these do not carry the weight of a law or regulation (unless adopted as law by a government).

            The document is NFPA 1971. It is copyrighted by NFPA, and thus should be purchased from NFPA directly. NFPA has started making NFPA 1403 (Live Fire Evolutions) available for free on their website.

            Note that most helmets cannot be made NFPA compliant just by adding stuff. In general, they need to be PURCHASED as NFPA compliant. If you have specific questions, feel free to email me:
            [email protected]
            My comments are sometimes educated, sometimes informed and sometimes just blowing smoke...but they are always mine and mine alone and do not reflect upon anyone else (especially my employer).


            • #7
              Re: Bourkes, goggles, face shield

              Originally posted by sfdlt5
              What are needed to make a structural firefighting helmet NFPA approved?
              Interesting question. NFPA Approved to which standard ??

              NFPA 1971 Standard on Protective Ensemble for Structural Fire Fighting, 2000 edition (NFPA 1971-2000)

              4-2.2 Protective Helmet Design Requirements. Helmets for structural fire fighting shall consist of at least the following assembled components:
              (6) Either a face shield, or goggles, or both

              Authors note - That means Bourkes alone are totally out of the picture from an NFPA standpoint.

              1-3.37 Definition: Face shield. The helmet component intended to help protect a portion of the wearer’s face in addition to the eyes, not intended as primary eye protection.

              1-3.50 Definition: Goggles. The helmet component intended to help protect the wearer’s eyes and a portion of the wearer’s face, not intended as primary eye protection.

              However . . .
              NFPA 1500 Fire Department Occupational Safety and Health Program, 1997 edition

              5-10.1 Primary face and eye protection appropriate for a given specific hazard shall be provided and used by members exposed to that specific hazard. Such primary face and eye protection shall meet the requirements of ANSI Z87.1.

              Remember where 1971 just said Face Shields and Goggles are NOT primary Eye protection ???

              Confused yet ?? - You're not alone.

              Here's a link to some very interesting reading (FYI - it's where I got all this info). http://www.essgoggles.com/products/NFPA.html

              Also - from direct personal experience and via e-mail contact with NFPA. Taking a NFPA compliant helmet (with goggles) and switching to another type/brand of NFPA compliant goggles WILL NOT always mean your helmet is still in compliance (even if the helmet is now sold with the goggles you indent to purchase).

              In order to meet NFPA - the helmet & goggles must be tested as a unit to be compliant. Any alterations or replacement that falls outside those parameters are no longer NFPA compliant.

              I'm pretty sure I posted the text of the e-mail in a similar thread a long time ago. If I can find it - I'll hyperlink it in this thread.

              Disclaimer - Since the referenced page was compiled & hosted by ESS I will state for the record that I have no ties to ESS or any Parent or subsidiary company to which they may be related. Nor do I stand to benefit in any way from the sale of their product.
              Take Care - Stay Safe - God Bless


              • #8
                This link may also help to sort things out:

                It also covers the other fire helmet components.

                Good Luck, Stay Safe,
                Mike Richardson

                (I am not endorsing or promoting this product or company by posting this information)
                Mike Richardson
                Captain, Training Officer
                St Matthews FD, Louisville KY
                "aka TIman"
                [email protected]

                TI Training = www.safe-ir.com

                The information and views above are in no way associated with my employer, and are strictly my own.


                • #9
                  The requirement of "full face and eye" protection is vague...but the standard 4" visor makes the helmet compliant as do "approved" goggles. The Bourque Shields DO NOT COMPLY......

                  Can you say....beat a dead horse to death???
                  09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
                  IACOJ Minister of Southern Comfort
                  "Purple Hydrant" Recipient (3 Times)
                  BMI Investigator
                  The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.


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