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EAST COAST vs WEST COAST!

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  • EAST COAST vs WEST COAST!

    Hello all,
    Just looking for some quick help! I am presenting a class on differences between east coast and west coast departments...and no, not just smooth vs fog! More or less operational/tactical differences...please post any sites or anything that can help me out! i need as soon as possible..thanks again!

  • #2
    Here's one......

    The West Coast has Actors who think they are Governors.

    The East Coast has Governors who think they are Actors

    Stay Safe....
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
    In memory of
    Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

    IACOJ Budget Analyst

    I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

    www.gdvfd18.com

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    • #3
      If you do a search at Firehouse.com's forums, you'll see it discussed in the past. Possibly use "East West Coast" as your search terms.

      One difference is the basis of tradition in the fire departments. Not to say that West Coast FDs don't follow any traditions, but you have East Coast FDs that are older than some or all of the West Coast states.
      IACOJ Agitator
      Fightin' Da Man Since '78!

      Comment


      • #4
        2 cents...

        Originally posted by Adze39
        If you do a search at Firehouse.com's forums, you'll see it discussed in the past. Possibly use "East West Coast" as your search terms.

        One difference is the basis of tradition in the fire departments. Not to say that West Coast FDs don't follow any traditions, but you have East Coast FDs that are older than some or all of the West Coast states.

        Want to make it clear that West Coast does follow traditions.
        But, I think you will see more West Coast department being
        as progressive as possible. Where the East deals with ice
        rescues, etc, we have week long fire storms, flooding and
        major riots.

        Also look at the ISO ratings. There are more Class 1
        departments in California. Does NOT make them better. They
        might be stronger in the areas of personnel, water supply
        and equipment. Some of the West Coast Class 1 departments
        in CA are Long Beach, Vernon, Glendale, Torrance, Anaheim,
        Santa Ana and LA city. Nevada- Las Vegas, Clark County and
        Fallon-Churchhill.

        Hope that helps out...

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: 2 cents...

          Originally posted by CALFFBOU

          Also look at the ISO ratings. There are more Class 1
          departments in California. Does NOT make them better. They
          might be stronger in the areas of personnel, water supply
          and equipment. Some of the West Coast Class 1 departments
          in CA are Long Beach, Vernon, Glendale, Torrance, Anaheim,
          Santa Ana and LA city. Nevada- Las Vegas, Clark County and
          Fallon-Churchhill.
          Yeah, but most departments I know out here don't care about their ISO rating. You have a lot of 3 to 5 departments out here that are really good departments, but they don't give a crap about improving their ISO rating.

          I guess those Class 1 FDs in CA have more hooks and cans on their engine than my FD! LOL Oh God, I can see an ISO battle coming up!!
          IACOJ Agitator
          Fightin' Da Man Since '78!

          Comment


          • #6
            No battle bro...

            Adze...come on now bro...I was just trying to
            throw out some mutual information to compare.

            I didnt say so-and-so was better then them or
            us, etc. No battle please.

            Just trying to give the guy something to go on...

            Comment


            • #7
              East= Leather
              West=Wildland Fire

              Tust me West coast is very progressive, East coast stays with the tried and true tactics
              AKA: Mr. Whoo-Whoo

              IAFF Local 3900

              IACOJ-The Crusty Glow Worm

              ENGINE 302 - The Fire Rats

              F.A.N.T.A.M FOOLS FTM-PTB

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              • #8
                MIDWEST

                ...Look to the left... Look to the right...Shake our heads and let out a hearty laugh..
                IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

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                • #9
                  California...It's a state of mind...

                  I object *strongly* to the phrase the West Coast tends to be more "progressive." We like leather helmets, LA just doesn't seem to be able to part with Tillers or Wood ladders, things long gone from even a congested East city like Boston. You see just as much knuckleheadness on both coasts, probably just fewer examples on the West.

                  And that's one of the major differences -- the East Coast developed many small communities. Especially in New England & Mid-Atlantic, you don't see a clear line between "city" and "country" -- my town has a few villages, then houses scattered at a pretty regular rate. Go out to California, you go tight-packed-houses to farm field instantly. Yeah, that's a broad characterization, but for the most part it holds true. Places I've been in California that resemble New England in development, suddenly start to get much more like New England in their fire service deployment (San Lorenzo Valley, parts of the Gold Country come to mind).

                  That pattern affects FD staffing and deployment. You have fewer but bigger towns, more likely to be paid, and also having developed at a time people where more likely to want to pay for municipal services.

                  There are definite cultural differences -- the West is more "let's get out of town" recreation oriented, so you don't have people as interested in staying home on the weekends i.e. less time to volunteer; you also have a generally fitter population and that carries through to a generally fitter fire service, too.

                  I really think the differences largely come down to not tactics & tools, but staffing & deployment to make up for different geography and historical development trends. East Coast tends to be very congested big cities and lots of low density suburbs/rural areas; West Coast tends to be much more moderate in the cities don't get quite as congested, the 'burbs aren't as spread out, and rural is *rural*.
                  IACOJ Canine Officer
                  20/50

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                  • #10
                    Re: No battle bro...

                    Originally posted by CALFFBOU
                    Adze...come on now bro...I was just trying to
                    throw out some mutual information to compare.

                    I didnt say so-and-so was better then them or
                    us, etc. No battle please.

                    Just trying to give the guy something to go on...
                    Brett,

                    I know you weren't trying to say that, I was just trying to make the point clear.
                    IACOJ Agitator
                    Fightin' Da Man Since '78!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I know if you say you need a tanker on the west side of the country you will see people look up and run for cover.

                      If you ask for a tender on the eastern side, people look at you funny!

                      I don't think it's just the coasts that are different, here in Missouri, you have the east side of the state calling for pumpers and the west side calling for engines.
                      ftm-ptb
                      leather forever
                      gateway fools

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Let us not forget the West Coast has Cheffie.


                        Dal
                        You see just as much knuckleheadness on both coasts, probably just fewer examples on the West.
                        That's because they keep hiding in the governor's office.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 4bugles
                          I know if you say you need a tanker on the west side of the country you will see people look up and run for cover.

                          If you ask for a tender on the eastern side, people look at you funny!

                          I don't think it's just the coasts that are different, here in Missouri, you have the east side of the state calling for pumpers and the west side calling for engines.
                          Amen to all points there Brother. Even "up here" we run into similar terminalogy hicups. This happens in particular if we are working with Forestry on a fire, then terms really get jumbled up. As you say "tanker" has double meanings. They duck, we drive. LOL
                          If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)

                          "I may be slow, but my work is poor." Chief Dave Balding, MVFD

                          "Its not Rocket Science. Just use a LITTLE imagination." (Me)

                          Get it up. Get it on. Get it done!

                          impossible solved cotidie. miracles postulo viginti - quattuor hora animadverto

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by 4bugles
                            I know if you say you need a tanker on the west side of the country you will see people look up and run for cover.

                            If you ask for a tender on the eastern side, people look at you funny!

                            I don't think it's just the coasts that are different, here in Missouri, you have the east side of the state calling for pumpers and the west side calling for engines.
                            LOL, over the years I have worked with 4 kinds of "mud", a term that can mean many different things depending on where you are at.

                            Good old wet dirt mud.

                            Grey concrete mud.

                            Smelly foul oil drilling mud (diesel fuel, bentinite and other ingreedients).

                            And red mud that falls from the sky...

                            Slurry is by far my favorite kind of mud, but it is also more expensive...
                            -Brotherhood: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
                            -Mistakes: It could be that the purpose of you life is to serve as a warning to others.

                            -Adversity: That which does not kill me postpones the inevitable.

                            -Despair: Its always darkest before it goes Pitch Black.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Why can't people compare apples to apples - and oranges to oranges?

                              All you need to do is look at a map.

                              The State of California is one of 3 states on the west coast, and the east coast is comprised of 12 states. Already a major difference in land area.

                              Now - looking closer - the state of California occupies a swath of land that is roughly equivalent to New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia (not equal in total land area of the whole state- just in generally looking at the map).

                              Now - lets look at all of the fire departments that are ISO Class 1.

                              St. Louis, Missouri Pre 1964
                              Baton Rouge, Louisiana 5/1/79
                              Santa Ana, California 1/1/84
                              Stockton, California 1/1/84
                              Macon, Georgia 5/1/86
                              Hialeah, Florida 5/1/86
                              East Side FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              Lake Springfield FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              North Side FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              South Lawn FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              South Oak Knolls FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              South Side FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              Springfield, Illinois 9/1/88
                              Woodside FD, Illinois 9/1/88
                              Anaheim, California 11/1/88
                              Beverly Hills, California 11/1/89
                              Las Vegas, Nevada 5/1/90
                              Vernon, California 11/1/90
                              Greensboro, North Carolina 2/1/92
                              Coral Gables, Florida 2/1/92
                              Glendale, California 11/1/92
                              Oak Lawn, Illinois 3/1/93
                              Areadia, California 8/1/93
                              Lisle-Woodridge FD, Illinois 12/1/93
                              Clark-Co FD (Metro), Nevada 2/1/94
                              Hartford, Connecticut 7/1/94
                              Culver City, California 2/1/95
                              Skokie, Illinois 9/1/95
                              E. Bank Consol. FD, Louisiana 9/5/95
                              Torrance, California 5/1/96
                              Hoboken, New Jersey 7/1/96
                              Fallon, Nevada 8/1/97
                              Arlington Heights, Illinois 9/1/97
                              Syracuse, New York 1/1/98
                              Pembroke Pines, Florida 2/1/98
                              Carleston, South Carolina 6/1/98
                              Shreveport, Louisiana 7/6/98
                              DuBois, Pennsylvania 10/1/98
                              Plano, Texas 10/1/98
                              Cambridge, Massachusetts 7/1/99
                              Frisco, Texas 11/1/00
                              Bossier City, Louisiana 12/11/00
                              Milford, Connecticut 2/01/01
                              E. Baton Rouge Parish FD, Louisiana 4/09/01

                              A total of 43 departments are ISO Class 1, out of thousands. And 9 are from California. Woo Hoo -- what do you want a parade?
                              ISO is a 'nicety' it's something that is nice to have, and it is of a great benefit to those that live in your response area - for it lowers their insurance premiums - but it does not equate- across the board to an effective firefighting force.

                              From the Torrance CA website ( http://www.tfd.torrnet.com/iso.htm )Fire alarms
                              Ten percent of the overall grading is based on how well the fire department receives fire alarms and dispatches its fire-fighting resources
                              Engine companies
                              Fifty percent of the overall grading is based on the number of engine companies and the amount of water a community needs to fight a fire. ISO reviews the distribution of fire companies throughout the area and checks that the fire department tests its pumps regularly and inventories each engine company's nozzles, hoses, breathing apparatus, and other equipment.

                              ISO also reviews the fire-company records to determine:
                              -type and extent of training provided to fire-company personnel
                              -number of people who participate in training
                              -firefighter response to emergencies
                              -maintenance and testing of the fire department's equipment

                              Water Supply
                              Forty percent of the grading is based on the community's water supply. This part of the survey focuses on whether the community has sufficient water supply for fire suppression beyond daily maximum consumption. ISO surveys all components of the water supply system, including pumps, storage, and filtration. To determine the rate of flow the water mains provide, we observe fire-flow tests at representative locations in the community. Finally, we evaluate the distribution of fire hydrants.


                              10 percent is how you are dispatched
                              50 percent is actually based upon the FD
                              40 percent is based upon water supply

                              Only half is the burden of the FD - the other half is on the shoulders of your water dept/utility - and the entity that dispatches you.

                              I don't see that as a 'grade' of how progressive a FD is.

                              We had a saying in the Marine Corps -
                              "No combat ready unit has ever passed inspection; and no inspection ready unit has ever passed combat."

                              Just my .02 cents ......
                              Marc

                              "In Omnia Paratus"

                              Member - IACOJ
                              "Got Crust?"

                              -- The opinions presented here are my own; and are not those of any organization that I belong to, or work for.

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