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  • #16
    One of the NFPA standards states the apparatus should leave the station within one minute of the alarm bell (for the paid guys)....now we all know we are not sitting around in our bunker gear and it takes 1.5 minutes or so to pack up w/SCBA but I have yet to see someone pack up completely wearing a seatbelt.....So how do you reolve the conflicting standards?

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    • #17
      The guys leaving from the station usually have jump seats with the SCBA built in, right? They can don the SCBA on the way and only need to take care of dressing before getting on the apparatus.

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      • #18
        Here in NC it's a minute and a half from street clothes

        BUT

        We don't emphasize speed--we emphasize correctness!

        want the newguys learning how to do it right and they will get speed with practice (repetition).
        "When you are safe at home, you wish you were having an adventure-when you're having an adventure, you wish you were safe at home"

        --Thornton Wilder

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        • #19
          Originally posted by engine23ccvfd
          ...So how do you reolve the conflicting standards?
          Usually SCBA are either in seats of in high side compartments and are donned at the scene. The only issue is to get into your bunkers before jumping in the truck.
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          • #20
            Back in 1976 I held the record of 28 seconds from box to donned and functioning. (All safety checks included)

            This, of course, was the old style Scott, breast clip, un-connected dragonfly facepiece, chest mounted regulator, threaded waist strap.

            Even the boxes were made of some prehistoric material...not plastic, with metal clips and everything.

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            • #21
              So how do you reolve [SP] the conflicting standards?
              Adapt and overcome!

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              • #22
                210 I wasnt saying that the one minute was wrong .........I had no idea that a state had a standard .........how fascinating ! and I think that some of your expertise had something to do with it !
                IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
                Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
                ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
                RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
                LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
                I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
                "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
                http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

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                • #23
                  Artie dating himself

                  229,that space age material was called fibreboard.Had real metal corners and metal buckle latches too.When I started we had 2,yes 2 of them.Scott 1's with steel bottles.My how far we've come.I'd like to see some of todays generation do what we've done in them.A different time and place,but a truly educational and caring time.Many things have changed,not necessarily for the better.45" coats and 3/4 boots too,summers were much more comfortable.NAP's and 1.5 no where near the knockdown of todays 2".You do bring back the memories!T.C.

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                  • #24
                    SCBA Donning Times

                    We do these time drills also, but practically speaking they're kind of ridiculous. From street clothes to bunker gear on, breathing air just doesen't happen for us. Most of the time you throw your bunker gear on, or most of the way on, jump in the engine(jump seats), get all your pack straps on and bottle on, do a quick function check, and your good to go.

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                    • #25
                      Well we also practice what we call a Chinese fire drill.On a smoke training evolution put a team "down"activate the RIT and draw another team from rehab.You best be getting dressed in under 2 here,your brothers are "down"!How's that helping the practicality of getting dressed quick.It's a valuable lesson and a good drill.If you hold your people to the standard you will find that once learned,they will pretty much stay on speed and accuracy thru repetition.Doesn't have a place?I guess we're not in agreement on that one.Practicing against the clock as long as it's done safely,can do nothing but improve your operation.We got away from it for several years(we used to pit co.against co.)and operational efficiency suffered.Jump seats are a wonderful thing but I won't see mine for another year.So "quick packing"is a critical performance item here.T.C.

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                      • #26
                        Regarding speedy donning

                        My conversations with our state fire marshal's office kinda went along the same lines as those of you who state it's better to get the unit on and ready to go to work correctly than just plain fast.

                        The SFM wants that time on recruits for three reasons:

                        1) It demonstrates thorough familiarity with the unit. If you can put it on and be breathing in 60 seconds, you know that thing reasonably well. Remember, it's not just a case of jump into the thing and slap it on; it is a REQUIREMENT of the instructors to ensure that unit is donned correctly: all straps tight, nomex hood in place, no skin showing, PASS activated, no leakys.

                        2) In the event of a RIT evolution, where you are coming in from rehab, you better be able to get your pack on right now.

                        3) While packing up en route, you might not have more than a minute or two to get the unit on from a seated position. If you can meet that one minute standard, you shouldn't have a problem getting ready to go to work bouncing down the road.

                        Again, this is a training standard. Nothing more. We don't expect people to pack up that quickly as a "normal" evolution on a scene. But you never know when they may need to.....


                        (P.S. weruj, I was hip to your point.)
                        Last edited by jaybird210; 09-26-2003, 09:16 AM.
                        Omnis Cedo Domus

                        www.hinckleyfd.org

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                        • #27
                          Don't know about other states, but here in VA, we have two
                          minutes from street clothes to breathing air, hands on your
                          head. Thus the "2 minute drill" that your training officer
                          or instructor can call out while you're in the midst of
                          doing whatever while you're at the station.
                          That is to pass the Commonwealth's standard for FFI also.

                          Our SCBA's are all seat-mounted though, so it's just for
                          practice once you're certified. We just gear up in our
                          bunkers and jump on. We can strap on our Scotts while we're
                          rolling down the street.

                          I never timed him, but our Master Tech is insanely fast!
                          He'd call out "Two minutes!," get geared up and be standing
                          there tapping his foot while you're still getting geared
                          up. A bit embarrassing, but impressive! :-)

                          J
                          HazMat
                          ---
                          We gotta be nuts...we're running in when the rats & roaches are running out!

                          Let No Victim's Ghost Say That We Didn't Try
                          ---
                          Disclaimer:
                          These are my opinions, and only mine, and do not reflect the views of my department.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Artie dating himself

                            When I used to shoot competition rifle and pistol my instructor always pounded into me "accuracy makes speed." In other words, if you are accurate you will get faster with practice. If you are just rushing you will make mistakes and fail the test. It is always more important to be on target than fast, but the ablity to combine both shows a level of competancy which can only be gained with practice. As I have gotten older I have found this to be true with most skills such as knot tying, typing, wood working...


                            Originally posted by Rescue101
                            When I started we had... Scott 1's with steel bottles.
                            Wow, you are old! LOL Did you use leather hose too? Hehe...
                            ________________________________________________
                            If you are new to posting please CLICK HERE for an essential lesson
                            ________________________________________________
                            A bad day in the boat is better than a good day in the office. And in my case the office is a boat!

                            IACOJ Fire Boat 1

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                            • #29
                              I remember steel bottles too, and I can say I don't miss 'em!

                              As for the donning times. I think they are good, and they usually don't start trying to time folks until they already have a good amount of practice with the turnouts and SCBA's. It's something my Dept does in the academy too. I don't remember what time they have to do it in though. But, we just put it on in the jumpseat anyway. In fact, we do a lot of our dressing in the cab these days, not all, but some. I know we should be seatbelted, and not dresssing, but I'm just telling you how it really is. There are plenty of times that we are fully dressed before we roll.
                              http://www.sanantoniofire.org

                              IACOJ
                              Got Crust?

                              We lucky few, ... we band of brothers

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                              • #30
                                I feel that speed is not the thing to worry about I would rather see someone take a few extra seconds and do it right so when its time too work we are not pulling our brother or sister out cause they screwed up......

                                I have done the timed pack test when I was using an MSA it took me around 45 seconds to be breathing air witht he 10 sec seal check....


                                My new department has survive air and I have never tried those...
                                Jonesy
                                Fail to plan. Plan to fail.

                                FL EMT-B
                                FL State Firefighter
                                Pro Board Firefighter
                                Career Firefighter
                                Local 2103

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