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  • Weruj1
    replied
    Albeit after tha fact AT LEAST the vendor removed it from the inventory/website etc. That anymore in this modern day and age almost takes an act of a JUDGE. While it was certainly TOTALLY WRONG to boot leg the patch, at least they had some dignity and removed it, even if threatened with legal action. Ray, I am sorry that your company had to endure something most of us could only watch on TV that day. I am glad you got closure and although curiosity is killing me I think it was a good idea to leave the vendor unnamed at this time, classy move. Also to all of the others who have posted and stepped in here to offer legal assistance, from one FF to another, THANK YOU for keeping it real !

    Leave a comment:


  • RspctFrmCalgary
    replied
    That's great news Ray. I'm really sorry you had to go through it in the first place though. These vultures that make a profit off the victims of September 11th **** me right f'n off. Hopefully you can prevent it from happening again, or at least have the legal stuff in place.

    Leave a comment:


  • SIGNAL99COM
    replied
    Well???

    But I have to do this, I have to do something to let people know what a skell this person is. I wish it did not come to this. THANK YOU. I welcome any and all comments.
    Well, you explained the story but never mentioned the name of the company?

    Leave a comment:


  • FiRsqDvr45
    replied
    Glad to see things panned out for you. Never nice to see someone try to profit from anothers pain.


    On a side note:
    My wife bought me "your" book FIREHOUSE. Thank the members in your house for letting us "inside" for a peek and for the honor of getting to know your fallen brothers more then we had before. May time lessen your pain, but may it never fade your great memories of them.

    Fraternally...

    Jay Ellingson
    Laconia FD
    L1153

    Leave a comment:


  • E40FDNYL35
    replied
    Good News.
    I would like to thank the vendor for finale taking our patch off the website. I hope stuff like this does not happen again.
    See you in Baltimore...
    Last edited by E40FDNYL35; 07-20-2003, 09:17 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • FireResearch
    replied
    P.S.

    So let me know if I can help. I won't contact our NY office about it unless you give me the go-ahead E40. If you do, and someone in that office is willing to take it on without charge, I will have him/her call the firehouse.

    Best,
    Firefighter fan in Mass.

    Leave a comment:


  • FireResearch
    replied
    I am an intellectual property lawyer (patents, copyrights, etc.) who reads these boards sometimes but I have never posted. I would be honored to help 40/35 in any way that I can... My firm has a big office in New York, including a substantial intellectual property practice. I will check to see if anyone there can handle this for you pro bono (i.e., free of charge). If not, I'd be happy to do it myself, at least informally (I am a California, not a New York lawyer).

    One thing that will make a big difference here is whether any written agreement was made between your firehouse and the fellow who designed the patch. If there was no formal contract, then the patch probably does not qualify as a "work for hire." In that case, the artist would still own the copyright and you would need to get him to sue (or to assign his rights to you guys).

    Firefighter fan in Mass.

    Leave a comment:


  • PuffyNPFD
    replied
    Ray, I think this is despicable the making money off the blood of our brothers. I boycott any business that sells unlicensed FDNY or any other dept's products. I would like to know which co. it is so we can boycott it. E-mail me @ [email protected] please to let me know. I am in NYC frequently and it is amazing to see on the streets the amount of vendors selling UNLICENSED FDNY merchandise with all of the proceeds going into their pockets, especially in lower Manhattan around the Trade Center area. It seems that wearing apparel of FDNY and NYPD is in style and people are making a buck of it. BOYCOTT THEM!

    Leave a comment:


  • Epinephrine
    replied
    Let me know if you need any more assistance, I'd be glad to help.

    Oh also... Any patches they have in inventory should become property of your Company too, unless they license the artwork. Given the minimum number of patches most places require you to order, there should be a significant number.

    Leave a comment:


  • firenresq77
    replied
    I say post the website on here. I think everyone should boycot the business. Buy NOTHING from them until they remove your patch from their inventory.....

    Leave a comment:


  • E40FDNYL35
    replied
    Well Epinephrine, Thank you BROTHER. That is a well laid out plan. One in which we will look into further.
    Last edited by E40FDNYL35; 07-22-2003, 08:50 AM.

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  • Epinephrine
    replied
    Sorry up front for the long winded post...

    Since this is a custom piece of artwork that was created by Pete Campanlli. It is automatically considered to be copyrighted material. Regardless of who the cavemen are, or if your company is selling it, the patch and it's artwork are considered to by copyrighted.

    Sections 201 and 202 of Title 17 of United States Code under Copyright Ownership...

    201 Ownership of a Copyright:
    "Copyright in a work protected under this title vests initially in the author or authors of the work. The authors of a joint work are coowner of copyright in the work."

    202 Ownership of copyright as distinct from ownership of material object:

    "Ownership of a copyright, or of any of the exclusive rights under a copyright, is distinct from ownership of any material object in which the work is embodied. Transfer of ownership of any material object, including the copy or phonorecord in which the work is first fixed, does not of itself convey any rights in the copyrighted work embodied in the object; nor, in the absence of an agreement, does transfer of ownership of a copyright or of any exclusive rights under a copyright convey property rights in any material object."

    This clearly proves that Firfighter Pete Campanlli is the copyright owner of the patch, unless those rights were transfered to your Company.

    So to answer your question of what to do?

    You have several options, most of which you should probably consult a lawyer to persue. Any court would gladly grant an injuction and force the company to stop selling the patch, in addition to paying the copyright holder's actual damages and any additional profits the company made by selling the copyrighted material. Chapter 5 of Title 17 of the United States Code outlines the procedure.

    As a less expensive alternative to getting a lawyer, you may want to talk to the merchant about licensing the artwork to continue selling the patch. You can say that your Company is entitled to X dollars for each patch sold or X% of the profit incurred from selling the patch. There are numerous ways to work this though with out court intervention. Make sure you get everything in writing to enforce any terms settled upon.

    You can also contact the vendors that this company uses to produce the patches and explain that by producing the patches they too are violating the copyright and can also be included in any settlement. This action will usually cause the merchant to negoiate with you as if no one will make the patch for them, they cannot sell it.

    In addition, Chapter 5 also allows the offending party to be liable for any lawyer and court fees...

    If the merchant is unwilling to cooperate, bring in the courts and I'm sure they will gladly rethink their position.
    Last edited by Epinephrine; 07-20-2003, 04:02 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • PFire23
    replied
    Hey Ray, I'm with Capt G on this one. Seek legal council. You have the copyright, the design and name belong to YOUR HOUSE. Sue her, I'd say sue her for every penny that she's profited by using the design illegally and then turn around and give that money to the widow's fund. ..... I'm sorry that you have to go through this crap.

    Leave a comment:


  • E40FDNYL35
    replied
    Wait it's not about the money. It's about doing the RIGHT THING. We are not asking for money. We are asking not to sell out of respect. We have a patch guy who ALWAYS DOES THE RIGHT THING.
    Last edited by E40FDNYL35; 07-22-2003, 08:50 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • FWDbuff
    replied
    MAKE EM' MISERABLE!!!

    POST THEIR COMPANY NAME AND PHONE NUMBER, I SAY!!!!!! Then we, as your brothers and comrades-at-arms, shall let our "Fingers do the walking." Advise the company that:

    1. We think it is despicable that they are selling your patch, memorializing your lost brothers, without your blessing or so much as a small donation to your house fund, the widow's fund, etc etc.

    2. That they will NOT be considered for any future patch purchases by the caller's organization, and additionally, you will advise ALL of your brother firefighters NOT to utilize their services!

    3. You will advise all of your police friends, municipal workers, etc etc etc (ANYONE!) who buys patches, not to utilize their services!

    4. TELL THEM that you learned of their treachery on a nationally (AND INTERNATIONALLY) viewed public firefighting forum! Advise them that every fire station from Maine to Hawaii will have a copy of this forum hanging on their bulletin boards, kitchens, union offices, volunteer fire station dayrooms, etc! Tell them you are probably not the only phone call they will receive!

    DO IT! I am waiting with baited breath and the phone in my hand!

    FTM-PTB-EGH-RFB!

    Leave a comment:

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