Junior Members Sleeping in the firehouse

[Truckie465]

My chief has been doing me a big favor...in our bylaws it states that junoir members shall not bunk at the firehouse...that has been the case until resently. My chief has been letting me and and another junior member sleep at the firehouse when we don't have school the next day and as long as the duty offuicer knows and there is a regular member stay in the firehouse tooo. Many regular members are bothered by this. And say that is is against the rules and I shouldn't be sleeping there. the 2 junior members sleeping at the firehouse are the 2 most active junior members in the Department. know what we can and cannot do on the scene. What should i do...should I stop?...the Chief says that he is going to bring it up at the next board meeting.

[PAVolunteer]

Rules are rules, right? What happens when the trouble-making junior wants to sleep at the firehouse? What happens when when a junior gets hurt and the lawyer says, "Your Honor, it states right here in the fire company by-laws that no juniors are allowed to sleep at the firehouse."

Another thing to consider is child-labor laws. Does simply being at the firehouse count as work? If it does, then juniors are limited to the number of hours they can "work" (be at the firehouse). There is too much to consider. This is certainly not just, "the Chief is doing me a favor." Either follow the rules, or go through the stated procedure to try to change them.

Stay Safe

[TruckCo133]

I would have to say your going to have to stick with the rules on this one. I am also a junior firefighter and am always running into problems with child labor laws. The truth is there is nothing you can really do to change a law. My best piece of advice is to just keep on counting the days untill you turn 18 like I am. Sorry

[MFD]

see lately i was thinking about starting a jr firefighter club at our dept but i got mixed emmotions. the good side (we REALLY need recruits) and hopefully once most of them turn 18 they'd join up. but on the bad side you get little issues like this on that bother normal members. I remembered when i was that age (15-16) so edger to get on the F.D. the guys said just hold up a little while. so i came back it was near the end of my end of my senior year(i was 18 then) then they said i want you to wait and graduate and start college before you join. So at the start of my Freshman year in college i joined. now a year and half later. still the rookie and still getting picked on.

[JuniorFireFight1]

I am also a Junior Fireman. We have the rules of spending some amount of hours at the firehouse. We have a choice if we want to spend the night when there isn't school the next day. The Paid or Volunteers dont care as long as we don't sleep where they sleep. So to me I would wait until your chief says something because you said it is in the laws.

[Fitguy51]

If its in the by-laws then you have to live by that. The chief has no authority to override the by-laws.

[NFD270]

It is at times like these that I like living where I do... I can work full shifts on days I don't have school, as long as I have the shift captain's permission... However, while up there I am expected to do everything a regular firefighter is expected to do from daily chores to calls.... with the usual exceptions of no interior attack and stuff like that...

[Truckie465]

The Chief...help right the bylaws...do you know what the by-laws are??? They state what you can and cannot do in the fire house....the by-laws in any department are sbject to change...and The Chief if he wanted to could eliminate the board of Directors and then he would be the only one in charge of the by-laws...and as for the junior members getting hurt....We couldn't be there if we weren't under the insurance...the insureance doesn't say that between the hours of 11:00pm-5:00am no junior member under 18 can't be in the firehouse...that is a departmental by-law...so there couldn't be any law suits.

[Truckie465]

And as for the trouble making Juniors...there are not aloud to stay at the fire house...It's just me and one ther junior....Just us under special permission

[PAVolunteer]

Truckie465 said:
"We couldn't be there if we weren't under the insurance...the insureance doesn't say that between the hours of 11:00pm-5:00am no junior member under 18 can't be in the firehouse...that is a departmental by-law...so there couldn't be any law suits."

I understand that you're under 18, so I'll try to go easy on you. First of all, anyone, at anytime, can sue anyone, for anything. Secondly, we're not talking about insurance here. Junior FF Billy, who is at the station, sleeping overnight, which is against documented FD policy, sneaks out of the bunkroom while everyone else is asleep, and cuts his arm off playing w/ the sawzall. You'd better believe that there would be a law suit coming out of that.

Truckie 465 said:
"And as for the trouble making Juniors...there are not aloud to stay at the fire house...It's just me and one ther junior....Just us under special permission"

Ah yes, the chief picking favorites ... I think this has led to more firehouse brawls, fights, you name it, than anything else. That seems fair, we'll just let the chief pick and choose who can stay overnight. That's just opening up a whole world of problems.

Stay Safe

[Adze39]

So what rules are you willing to break next?

[PyroSlayer]

Sorry guy, but rules are rules. You may think that your chief is doing you a favor, but I believe he is doing you a disservice along with the rest of the department. How do the other juniors who are not getting special treatment from the chief feel about your being allowed to break the rules. This is sometimes the sort of thing that sparks resentment among individuals. I can already hear the other Jr FFs calling you and your bud the chief's pet. Truth be known, the adult staff is probably not crazy about the rules being broken for you either. They may not mind your presence at the station, but I doubt they are too happy about the rules being broken for you or your friend. Someone has already asked the question, what rules are you willing to break next.

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FTM-PTB-RFB

[ 01-04-2002: Message edited by: PyroSlayer ]

[Fitguy51]

Truckie - Can I assume that this is a Volunteer FD that you are involved with? Next question is how does your chief become chief? We elect ours very year and if he did what your s is doing he would not be elected ever again. If he does not treat everyone the same he is open for a discrimination suit and the ACLU just love these things.

[Brian Dunlap]

Rules are Rules I'm afraid and until and if they are changed you and the other junior need to follow them. The Chief can not control the By-Laws with out the membership and he can't "Just change the rules" I have to admire the juniors wanting to "Sleep-In" but until those rules change there can be sticky messes you guys can get into if god for-bid something happens. ~ Hell, consider yourselves lucky the Juniors in my department aren't allowed to respond after 10pm on school nights and 11pm on weekends because of boro curfew

[distchief60b]

Get the rules changed... Until then, stop doing it. If the rules are established, the Chief should not break them either. Is the rule in writing? If so then get it changed. If it has just ben an unwritten accepted policy, then work to re-condition people.

I do not have a problem with you staying as long as you know your limits and what you can and cant do. But....agree with other...rules are rules..