Shopping for Quints, E-one vs. Pierce, which do you prefer and why?

[joejoe33]

Our fire-rescue organization is shopping for a 75ft.,single axle quint. There is an apparatus committee that is looking at the Pierce Quantum with rear steering and a E-one single axle quint, both with aerial master stream capabilities.
Sutphen is not in the running because of our cities past negative experience with Sutphen. I'm not sure if Seagrave makes a single axle quint. I don't think Ferrara is in the running either. Does any organization out there have a Pierce Quantum with the rear steering assistance and what are your pros and cons?
If any organization utilizes a E-One single axle 75ft. quint what are your pros or cons?
I am not on this committee and am impartial. I only seek to be more informed and pass on any significant pros or cons to the powers that be.

Thanks Brothers and God Bless,

[fireman_387]

Seagrave makes a great single axle quint called the "Meanstick". It has a 75 ft aerial on a rescue style pumper compartments with up to 500 gallons and a WB 0f 195". It is a tilt cab, allowing for extra room for the FF's in the back. Give them a call.

[patrickharper]

What kind of area does your department cover? Is it rural, urban, suburban? What is your run load like? I have worked with both E-One and Pierce. But I would like to know more about your department before I comment.

[SFDE12]

Pierce, is all I have to say. My suburban department runs six Engines, 1 55' Quint and 1 100' Platform, from Pierce, we've had great luck.

[Medic129]

Pierce is the way to go. My dept was a Pierce dept until a new chief. He was an E-One fanatic, so we've got one now. Really watch the electrical problems on the E-One. They seem to run rampant. Also, you'll find that you'll have a lot more little nit-picky problems on the E-One than on the Pierce. E-One's a good truck, but for the money and hassle, you're better off with a Pierce. Good luck.

[Truckman22122]

Why is your department looking at a quint? Quints are not worth the time or effort. Talk to Richmond VA about them. Keep the Engine and Ladder separate and your fireground ops will go easier.

But anyways Pierce makes high quality apparatus. E-One is Junk. It has too many electrical problems and it'll rust out from underneath you.

[LACAPT]

We purchased a 75' E-One a year ago, and have had a few problems but nothing great. The rig we purchased is one of only 5 that E-One has produced, it has 2 man pods on the end of the stick and can be fully controlled from up top. Sound scary, not at all once you get the feel for it, it is quite easy and smooth to run. One of the problems we have encountered and are in the process of fixing is that there is a viabration in the drive train on exelleration and at certain speeds. It appears to be a drive shaft that is not aligned properly they say, and this problem is on a number of other units including pumpers that E-One has made. Overall we are happy with the rig, the good thing about E-One for us is that we have a fantastic service centre only an hour away from us, you call they are there for you.
We have a Pierce pumper that is 10 yrs old and is still an exceptionaly good pumper.

[EONESUX]

Just buy reading the past reply's, enough said.

[fireman_387]

Once again the old faithful one rears his head !!!

[gunnyv]

We have 3 Pierce engines and 2 ladders. You can call the ladders Quints, they have a pump and tank. The old (86) platform is falling apart, but it has been overused. The 1992 75' HD ladder is the best rig we've ever had, rides like a Caddy and has over 40k miles on it. Not good as an engine (too little hose and water), but we don't use it that way. We bought 2 ALF pumpers a couple of years ago, they are junk. Building a new Pierce now.
I will admit I have no experience with E-one, but we have had good luck with Pierce.
I think St Louis's first group of Quints came from Pierce, give them a call.

[the7tower]

For the record, we had a compete Pierce fleet, now we run 7 - 75' E-One CAF quints. We are in the same state as you, come on down. The basic rig works fine. They are total race cars, turn good, lay hose very well, have lots of storage. Ours will see 3 to 4000 calls a year. No electrical problems. Fort Worth is right down the street from you, they run a mess of quints.

Hmmm, seems performance isn't a topic hear, so I'll suggest it.

Meanstick, there are what a dozen ever made versus hundreds of Pierce and E-Ones. Why do research for a vendor?

I doubt it matters if your area is rural or suburban, if the rig is designed right, not overloaded it will be sitting on the same drive train components as the other guy is using.

E-One, never had an aerial failure. Pierce has.

You can actually lay 5" hose with an E-One, good luck with a Pierce. We carry 1400 to 1800 feet of 5 inch per rig.

E-One air conitioning rules!

The stability factor is better on an E-One, has less jack spread too.

Richmond, runs Pierces had a nightmare so far, why??? Crappy specs. They bought for the most part off the shelf Pierce's. They never had problems with the single axle Ferrera quint they bought. Suppose it was the specs, the 2nd axle, no thought at all wet into their fleet? Every problem they faced was predictable. Gee 200 gallon tank and now they run out of water, DUH? All their supply hose has to do is make three 90 degree turns and come out of a chute, guess what it doesn't work, DUH, nor had it for anyone else who owns that arrangement. Angle of departure is twice what it used to be so the back end hangs up, DUH. Some rigs were too high and wouldn't fit in the fire station, DUH. Some rigs were too long to make the turn into the fire station, DUH. Pierce offered the ALL Steer but the FD didn't want to pay for it. Obviously, there are no professionals associated with their apparatus purchasing. Well, they were in such a hurry to buy, they didn't research anything, in 15 years they get an all new fleet though.

The E-One ladder is wider than the Pierce.

Faster setup with an E-One, better side hill, etc.

Rust? E-One has the best warantee of the two. Aluminum rusts huh?

If I had a choice, I would suggest the 70' Sutphen tower. Better tip load dry and wet, better water flow, it has a huge platform not a ladder, one outrigger per side, midship mount more flexible than a rear mount, lays hose well, side mount ladders so it doesn't matter if someone parks behind you. Much smaller rear axle than the other two. As far as past problems with Sutphens, I think the Sutphen long term customers are the most loyal of any apparatus, Syracuse, Detroit, Cleveland, Fort Worth, Orlando, etc. Some are in decade three with Sutphens.

Lets compare:

E-One Pierce Sutphen
Tip Load 500 500 750
Tip wet 250 250 750
Guns 1 1 2
Good Hose bed Y N Y
Body alloy alloy stainless
Tank 500 500 500
Compartments good poor best
Cab good good best

Whatever you spec, it better be an outstanding pumper first or you are in for problems from day one. All Steer? Get ready to buy lots of tires, (tire scrub issues) hope it really works for you, seems to be hit or miss.

Oh, watch out for all this advice from people who don't run the make of apparatus you are asking for, especially if it is not a quint.

[3genff]

Pierce builds and excent truck but they do tend to be heavy, watch your front axel weight may limit the number of people in the cabb. As far as the rear steer it is a nice feture but does require a change in the drivers habbits. You don't swing wide in turns because that back end will kick out. I department came to assit on mutual aid and managed to hit three things with theirs. And it was not a new driver behind the wheel. Just make sure you try it on the streets and not a parking lot.

As for e-one again great truck, super strong, and easy to operate. They have the best warranties in the business.

A one fire mech. said " they are all junk or I would not have a job"
Remeber they pre-delivery trip is to look at the truck with a fine tooth comb not play golf and drink beer.


Be Safe

[berger3447]

We've had nothing but trouble with our E-Ones, mostly electrical. One thing you may need to consider if you're thinking of All-steer is the overall weight of the truck. Aerials are going to be a lot heavier than a comparable pumper, and the all-steers that I've seen were tandem axles. The steering axles can't be dual wheels, so in order to have 4 rear wheels on the ground, there must be two axles.

[Captain 12]

THEY BOTH ARE BAD, NO REALLLLY BAAAD
E-ONE, PEIRSE, TONKA ALL KIDS TOYS

AT LEAST SOME PEOPLE LIKE TONKA


GO BACK TO SUTPHEN

[ 11-23-2001: Message edited by: Captain 12 ]

[the7tower]

Lots of electrical problems? I just got off the phone with Frank at the Houston shops, He says there is not a single open shop order for an electrical problem on any pumper or ladder, 73 total in the fire department.

Are you telling us E-One will not honor their warantee? DoesE-Oneknow about it? Do you have a legal department? Did yo notifiy FEMSA? Could it be the dealer made modifications to the rig after you picked it up? Could it be you never did a proper delivery inspection at the factory before taking ownership? Do you have fleetwide defect language in your purchase contract?

hisisn't another one of those unfunded BROKEN FRAMES in HOUSTON things is t like last time E ONE SUX SPOKE???

Hey man, you still selling Pierces for Leon?

[ 11-23-2001: Message edited by: the7tower ]