guliani

[truck12tillerman]

Is it just me, or is anyone else feel sick to their stomach watching this facist mayor praise and laud the Firefighters of the city then turn around and scoop up their fallen brothers with backhoes and arrest their union leaders....I am glad that the whole world can finally see how this fraud really is.

[codeblue81]

I kinda agree with you on that. I personally thought he was doing a great job....up until last week. He has just really screwed up his public image, if you ask me.

code_blue81

[oldE6man]

Facist...wow, that's a UC-Berkeley word that we don't often hear on the east coast these days.

I don't know all of the details, but it seems unreasonable to send him from the penthouse to the outhouse in such short order. It MAY ultimately be the appropriate response, but let's not rush to judgement.

If the brothers working at Ground Zero are volunteering, as several FDNY members have posted here, then money is not the issue for either the city or the brothers. Maybe the focus of the city really IS scene safety. I hope that the city and my brothers in the FDNY can work this out, if for no other reason than the peace of mind of the fallen heroes' families.

Ground Zero is a funeral pyre of unimaginable proportions. Until the other day, the mayor had repeatedly demonstrated his respect for the sacrifice made by the heroes of the FDNY. Let's give him a chance to demonstrate that respect again.

[NozzleHog]

Well said, oldE6man.

[Diane E]

I have to bend the other direction just a little bit. It is a safety issue and how many people are now sick or will become sick years down the road from resp. problems?? Who's going to pay for their recovery, their benefits, their medications?? That's a hefty bill.

And I heard from a city FF that the fight lasted all of 15 seconds -- just long enough for the media to snap a few pictures and blow the whole thing out of proportion. Did anyone else hear that?

[fyrfoto]

i am working in a building right at ground zero, had front row seats for this and it was over pretty quickly. The rank and file cops didn't seem too eager to arrest these guys, but then it started getting ugly. Unfortunately, I think everybody involved knew how it was going to end before it even started.

[truck12tillerman]

I would to hear what the line firemen think of this whole situation, and whether is just a stunt for TV or not. BTW I did graduate from UC Bezerkely, but I am a Registered Republican, so don't think I am some liberal wackjob trying to make this Idiot look like a facist, I just happen to really think he is...

[ffs_littlegirl]

I understand that there is a health issue, but I also understand that there is a human issue. How can a nation, much less a city, heal when there are still so many people missing? How can you turn your back, not only on the FF's and other civil servants, but the civilians who were simply at the wrong place at the wrong time?

The only thing that I can say as a government major, Guliani's career is over. Today he made for an excellent discussion of what NOT to do in politics.

[oldE6man]

T-12-T, you can't disguise your origins. I always knew that facist may not have been the first word in the UC-Berkeley student handbook, but it was certainly on the first page.

Being a registered Republican is not the worst sin in the world. My father told me many years ago (he quoted from somewhere-I wish I could properly attribute it) that anyone who is not a Democrat at 20 has no heart, and anyone who is not a Republican by 40 has no brain.

I'm a conservative Democrat, for the record.

[acunn1]

I have to agree with one previous comment about the Mayor doing a good job until last week. When he wanted to limit the amounrt of FF's on site to recover bodies and because of that a torso was shipped to the landfill site, this should have been enough for him to change his mind. The brave members of NYFD live with danger everyday of their lives and would not be on site if it was not for the recovery effort. They are not on the clock and are doing it out of the dedication that comes with the job. LET THEM RECOVER THE BODIES OF THEIR FALLEN BROTHERS WITH DIGNITY Mr Mayor !!!!

[Mtetreault]

I think the Mayor is looking at this more objectively thant the Unions. Not that I don't understand the Union's position. There are many things to consider like critiacal incident stress. How healthy can it be mentally for teh firefighters working at ground zero. The long term physical concerns must also be a factor, and finally this site is still dangerous. Haven't we lost enogh lifes already. Is the mayor being too conservative, perhaps but it does not appear to me that everyone involved can look at this operation as objectively as they could. No body ( and I would venture to say the mayor) wants anyone dishonored.

[Firebear230]

Just a thought. Did anyone see the bit on CNN about the "secret" CIA office in WTC? It aired right before the whole issue about limiting the number of firefighters at the site. Maybe CIA has something they don't want everyday grunts like us seeing.

I can appreciate the concern for safety, but, I really believe that the FDNY firefighters need to recover their own. I'm sure if all parties really wanted to , some alternative could be reached so that work could proceed, but, body recovery could also continue.

We are with you FDNY, stay safe.

[Rescue101]

E229 correct me if I'm wrong here but with the level of destruction in these buildings and the method of destruction(200 ton aircraft + fuel)the very grim reality is that many people were vaporized and will NEVER be recovered.That by no means excuses the proper means of scene management,but being from the "sticks" I have no idea how or at what point you "call it".I think it should be left to the Brothers of FDNY and those who know the City to determine the best course of action.The buildings I have to deal with aren't as tall as the "pile".I do know that the Brothers won't rest until they bring everybody home.We need to support them where ever we can in the closure of this tragic incident, T.C.

[ 11-08-2001: Message edited by: Rescue 101 ]

[MetalMedic]

Is there any truth to the rumor that the contractors "awarded" the job of removing the debris of the World Trade Center have a $300K bonus coming to them if they finish the task ahead of schedule? Is it also true that the torso taken to the landfill was seen being removed from the debris and when the safety workers pointed that out to the construction workers to not remove the body, the response was for them to go to the landfill if they wanted their body?

I also understand that FDNY has a tradition of NEVER leaving the scene without first removing all bodies that are there. While I realize that there certainly will be bodies that will never be found, shouldn't it be the call of FDNY as to when they feel that have done all they could and not the decision of the contractors or the politicians?

[ 11-08-2001: Message edited by: MetalMedic ]

[ENG6511]

WOW,METAL MEDIC, where did you hear this stuff?