Question on Airpacks

[Pastor Dawn]

Our department has just formed a Task Force on Air packs and my duty is to analyse the difference between high pressure vs. low pressure and 45 min packs vs. 30 min packs. We are currently looking at Survive Air and Scott. I would like to know if anyone has been through this process, or is going through the process; and what your problems were or the positive things that occured during the process. Any help that I can be given would be greatly appreciated.

Let's all stay safe out there!
Rev. Dawn

[ADSNWFLD]

If you have the ability to fill them then I'd go with a 4500 psi model.
Because the 4500 bottle is smaller, the unit will be lighter. Also you can have 1 hr bottles available for haz mat or other specialty uses.
As for a Scott VS Survive air debate. A town near me had Survive Air for years and had several packs that couldn't be used together because survive air loves to change things. We use Scott and I love them. It is easy to use and maintain, reliable, and the new air pack 50 is probably one of the best airpacks I have seen.

Just my $ .02

[distchief60b]

Most 4500 PSI 45 minute bottles are the same size as the 30 Minute low pressure bottles.

Scott is good...the other you mention...no comment.

Contact ISI in reference to the VIKING. It is ahead of the upcoming standards with the latest in digital readouts that is predicted to be a requirement. They have high or low pressure and 30/45/1 hour duration.

Contact 800-235-7677 and ask for your regional representative or dealer. They will bring out SCBA for you to look at and provide test units for evaluation if you are serious.

[Firefighter513]

MSA!!! All the way..

[SFD13]

Check with your neighbouring fire depts to see what they are using, especially if you have lots of mutual aid calls. High pressure is the way to go if you have the capability. Never used Suvive Air. We use Scott and have had no problems with them. Most suppliers will let you "test drive" a pack for a couple of weeks.

[Pastor Dawn]

Thank you for all of your input. If any of you can think of anything else, please let me know. I will definitely use the 800 number given to me and research other manufacturers. We next meet again on Sept.30th and I know that this will be a fairly long and intense process; but I am taking this very seriously so if any of you wish to contact me via e-mail with your insights, please feel free to do so. [/LIST]

[mongofire_99]

Ask each rep for one to try out for at least a month. Get your people on the line to use it, play with it and generally become familiar with each one. Let them decide what they want to wear and then get those.

As far as the 30 or 45 minute cylinders, again let the firefighters decide. In the vast majority of cases, you're not going to gain the 15 extra minutes anyway.

[blackb16]

I agree with MOngo, try each one and month and then ask them how many major cities use your air packs. Then verify it. Ask what ppercentage of the market they each have. Then ask how many times they've had major revisions to their air packs. SOme have changed so many times in a decade you can't interchange or recognize the unit.

Finally when it is all done, it will be MSA and Scott. Do you want to buy any other make that mioght not be around in the future?

It will be hard not to choose Scott based on the above questions you've asked.

[LACAPT]

For me its ISI. The new viking that is on the market is ahead if it's time like Capstanm1 eluded to. We have the older ISI 4500 packs a little heavy but they work great. I won't BS you and say we havn't had problems with ISI but when we identify the problem to them( and I mean Them by going right to the factory o/s Atlanta) they have responded fairly positivly. The one BIG advantage to ISI is that you can repair it on the tailboard of a rig with a pair of pliers and an allen wrench. Our repair cost compared to MSA went from enormous to about $300.00/year and we run 28 packs. ISI has some very inovative product accesories that you can add to the Viking making it very much state of the art equipment. NO I am not a salesman for them I just know a good product when I use it!

[NYSmokey]

We use Scott 4.5's with 30 minute bottles and have had very few problems with them. They are lightweight, durable, and easy to use. I guess I'd recommend checking with other departments in your area. Ask them what they use and see how the product works in your climate. Also, it's nice to be able to interchange air bottles at a large incident if needed. Sometimes our supply runs low before the mobile cascade unit can arrive. Good luck!

Stay safe out there everyone!

[LtStick]

Although I prefer Scott because, thats what i've always used and thats what I know I still say way all your options when deciding this issue. Who ever you go with I'd make sure its a company thats going to be around for many years to come. You certainly don't want one that will be gone in a few years. I definetly think the idea of getting one or posibly more than one which would be a better idea and testing each unit for a month is a very good idea. In a month of testing you should know if you've found the air pack for your department. We are currently using Scott 2.2's but I've also used the Scott 50's that have the intagrated PASS alarm which means you don't have to worry about having a PASS alarm for every SCBA.
If you would let us know what the final decision is and the reason or reason's they decided to go with it.

[mongofire_99]

I'd like to add to LtStick on the PASS. Just about everyone has the intigrated PASS now.

I've been doing some research on PASS (because I think its benefits as it stands are simply better than nothing) and found that the Grace Industries T-PASS system that transmits the PASS alarm outside (the Houston LODDs were down about 40 minutes before anyone heard their PASS) the building is about $20 less per unit than the Scott integrated PASS.

With that system, you know who's on scene, and it does a PAR every 30 seconds without bothering your troops.

[Captain 12]

We Have MSA they Stink, NO THEY REALY STINK

SCOTT ALL THE WAY

A 25 YEAR OLD SCOTT'S ARE BETTER THAN A BRAND NEW MSA OR S-AIR

[CLWFWFD]

Have personally used old MSA,new MSA,old Survive Air,New Survive Air,Scott 2.2,and Scott 4.5; like blackb16 stated it comes down to MSA & Scott. Survive Air didn't get the nickname Surprise Air for no reason. For me personally it is the Scott 4.5. As for your mutual aid concerns, get the unit that you like the best, the other departments maybe wanting what you like but keep getting what everyone else has because everyone else has them.

[rcbadabing182]

the scoot air pack has a dual stage transducer and 3 saftey back ups...the scott is currentley in the process of developing a computerized accountability mechinism which can be retrofitted between packs that currently dont have them...low pressure 2.2 is more bulky and not good for doing your profiles....the 4.5 scott is lighter and easier to do your profiles with...