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  • engine vs. truck

    you have a working fire and the engine and the truck roll out together..which should go first.the engine to establish a water supply..or the truck to utilize the front of the fire building..in your opinion's which would be more important...the truck getting the front and possibly blocking out a hydrant were the engine cant see it..or the engine securing a water supply and the truck possibly getting screwed out of the front..just looking for feed back and maybe some personal experience on these situations..

  • #2
    It is just my humble opinion, but....

    When responding together, the engine should let the truck company arrive at the fire building first. Now granted- a ladder has never put out a fire; but placement of the apparatus is paramount. You can always stretch another length of hose, but you can't stretch that ladder one bit.

    The chauffer of the Engine co. has to know the capabilities of the ladders that normally respond in his first due area as well. he may be able to occupy the front of the building, if it has little or no setback, and it is known that the ladder will be operating at angles greater than 45 degrees (but remember- now you are parked in the collapse zone )

    I feel that there is no definite answer to your question. All fires are different, and the conditions encountered may dictate who goes where...
    That having been said - I'd let the ladder get in there first. It is a specific length - and can't be stretched
    Marc

    "In Omnia Paratus"

    Member - IACOJ
    "Got Crust?"

    -- The opinions presented here are my own; and are not those of any organization that I belong to, or work for.

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    • #3
      engine always !!! on our narrow streets engine pulls up in frount of the house the FF's pull the line off the back engine takes off to find a working hyd. (not many still work after this summer of kids turning them on for fun) The truck pulls right in frount of the house to set up the aerial or ground ladders ect.

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      • #4
        I'm a Truck guy, and even I'm going to say the engine should go first. Engine goes and determines what the best water supply is. They have to decide whether to lay in or to have the 2nd engine lay in to them or reverse lay out from them. All this has to be done to leave side 1 for the truck, along with a way in for the truck. I would much rather be on the truck, but I also feel that the engine needs to get there first. Now, who's going to be the first Quint guy to join the discussion????

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        • #5
          The engine should go first..pull past the fire building and get a 3 sided view of involvement. The truck should get the address...aka the front of the building. You can always pull more hose...you can't stretch the stick!

          If the truck is responding and gets there first, for example, coming back from another call...they should still take the address and the truck company officer should let the incoming engine companies know if they have a hydrant nearby that may be blocked from view by the truck.
          ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
          Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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          • #6
            The engine should roll first, but it should also be sure to pull past ans leave room for the truck. However if you are running second due where the engine out of your station will be water supply, then the truck should roll first. This way the pumper picking up the hydrant will not block the truck from its position. but the truck also has to be sure not to block the hydrant.

            general rule that I follow when it comes to arriving on scene and response order is:

            engine (1st attack)
            truck (side one)
            engine (1st water supply)
            engine (2nd attack)
            truck (side 3)
            engine (2nd water supply)

            squad fits anywhere in the run list but must stay out of the way.

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            • #7
              I will agree with Gonzo. The engine should go first and lay their line accros the front og the building. Like Capt. Gonzo said, this gives the co on the engine a view of three sides of the building and leaves the front free for the truck. You can always pull a horzt. standpipe if you need more hose.
              Alan Romania, CEP
              God bless America and those who stand with us
              God have mercy on those who stand against us.

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              • #8
                The engine should definitely go in first, but they need to remember (even if it has to be pounded into them) that they must leave room for the truck.
                I can think of no more stirring symbol of man's humanity to man than a fire engine.

                --Kurt Vonnegut

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                • #9
                  I've got to agree with Capt. Gonzo engine goes first, but truck, tower, quint, or anything with a stick gets the address.

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                  • #10
                    Yea i agree the engine should get their first but if the truck does get their first one of two thing should happen. Either the truck should pull past so it doesnt block the hydrant of the engine officer should know where his water supply is and inform the truck to stay clear of the hydrant if possible, also the first in Engine should be the attack piece and the second engine should be water supply.
                    If you cant take the heat then stay out of my way.

                    These are my opinions and dont reflect the view of my company.

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                    • #11
                      Depends if it's your first due. I like the truck to be the second arriving apparatus when possible, allowing the engine to be working a fast attack, water supply, whatever they need, as long as they leave the aerial room to stage where they need to. So, if it's your first due, pull the engine, otherwist pull the truck. If it's a coin toss, I'd probably pull the engine.
                      These are my opinions and not those of the organizations for which I work and/or volunteer.

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                      • #12
                        FIRST ONE OUT THE DOOR WINS.
                        And that would ALWAYS be the ENGINE in my case. If your company is ready to hit the street and the other is a little slow getting out the door for whatever reason (someone in the crapper,in the shower,sleeping heavy,etc.),don't wait for them, go.
                        As far as the positioning thing, there are different ways/considerations. No right or wrong. I agree with all the others that the truck should be infront. However, the truck must also look for a clear spot to throw the aerial which may or may not be directly infront.
                        Here are some ideas/ways that I do, hope it helps you out.
                        Engine first - engine stops at hydrant,lays a line,pulls past the front, Truck straddles hose goes to front.(hoping not to park on the supply line)
                        Engine first - engine stops at hydrant, truck passes engine if street is wide enough to permit,truck goes to front, engine lays a line, pulls and behind truck (engine must also allow room for ground ladders to be pulled from truck if ladders come off rear. Engine may have to pull a longer attack line than normal in this situation and might be postioned a far distance from the front.
                        Engine first - engine stops at hydrant,truck passes engine if street is wide enough,truck goes to front,Engine lays a line and pulls alongside of Truck or pulls around Truck if street is wide enough.
                        Engine and Truck take different running routes, one comes in from one end of the block and the other from the other end, and we nose in with eachother. The Engine just stops a little short.This way both pieces are in the front. The benefits of this way are, the Truck doesn't have to to stop behind the Engine and WAIT while we pull a supply line off, the Truck doesn't have to worry about dealing with hose. The Engine doesn't have to leave that much room for the Truck, doesn't have to worry about the Truck parking on the supply line,and doesn't have to worry about leaving room for the Trucks ground ladders to be removed from the rear. I do it this way whenever I can. It works very good.

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                        • #13

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                          • #14
                            Engine first, establish water supply and leave room for the truck, if possible. Our second due engine lets the second truck in the block.

                            BTW, trumpeter75, I have that very quote by Vonnegut hanging in front of me, written and signed by him.

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                            • #15
                              thanks for the replies everyone

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