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A No No on the May Cover

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  • #16
    I usually just read the posts on here and refrain from answering but I could't hold back on this one. Come on guys. I can't beleive some of the things I read on here that go on out there. Going on air while your still enroute??? As was mentioned, what if you really need that 2 or 3 minutes you sucked down after becoming lost/disoriented within that structure? The facepiece will also limit your visibility while pulling the line and getting to your entry point increasing your trip/fall hazard. As Dal90 mentioned, how long does it take to don your respiratory protection before entering? 10 seconds? We all need to remember the BIG picture on the fireground and not just the moment at hand....

    As for the cover pic, good job on the Engine work guys. Excellent pic and great aggressive firefighting in my opinion. I can't tell you how many times the fire has lit up on us during entry. It happens.......

    Jim Crawford
    Pittsburgh Bureau of Fire
    Truck Co. #33

    [This message has been edited by PBFTRK33 (edited 05-30-2001).]

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    • #17
      Well, I don't know about the rest of you, but I have always been taught to have everything on before you step off of the apparatus. That includes donning a face piece and having your hood and helmet on.
      PBFTRK33 metioned that having your face piece on can limit your visibility, this may be true, but what if you needed to make entry right away for a rescue? Now you have to take those extra seconds to don your equipment, when you could have already made entry, making your way to the victim.

      Just my 2 cents worth....

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      • #18
        As Mongo and others have stated previously...one cannot judge the operations at a fire by looking at just one photograph. What you are looking at is a fraction of a second of time, depending on the shutter speed on the camera, speed of the film, lens aperture, type of lens used, camera angle and a host of other factors.

        FD111: sometimes taking a few extra seconds to put on the facepiece before going in can make a differendce in the outcome of a fire attack. We tend to "tunnelvision" on getting in right away. Sometimes we have to take a second to look at the big picture...get orders from the IC and company officer and ensure our safety.

        ------------------
        Firefighters: Today's heroes protecting everyone's tomorrows!
        Captain Gonzo

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        • #19
          Yeah, that's right. An air mask does obscure some vision. That is a fact. and untill they make a mask that doesn't, we have to deal with it! Besides vision, how about the other senses you need to do your personal size-up upon arrival? How about the nose? You can't smell what is burning with a mask on, right? How important is it to get a few good snootfuls of the smoke? (Not full smoke, burn your lungs, die in the burn ward, snootfuls, but a good sniff of the air!)Tells you what is burning, doesn't it? I find it hard to believe the Vegas Brothers would be on air in the rig.(you sure he didnt mean mask on only, no air?) Anyway, back to the picture....does the guy in front look like he is about to light up or what? It appears he is smoking pretty good! Now there is an ad for a turnout gear company!!!!!Good Job to the Photog!!!

          ------------------
          FTM - PTB

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          • #20
            FD111
            As Captain Gonzo mentions, you have to take those extra seconds and take a look at the big picture before commiting yourself into the structure. A sizeup by ALL firefighters and officers is essential in maintaining individual and crew safety. You MUST look at as much of the burning structure as you can possibly see BEFORE commiting yourself into the building. You absolutely will not get a second chance if you become lost/disoriented in the structure. You will wish you did when your facepiece starts to collapse onto your face with your last breaths. Gentlemen, brothers, and sisters, believe me when I say that you do not ever want to experience a firefighter fatality fire. I've walked the walk. The 1995 Pittsburgh Bricelyn Street fire is a place I will never want to walk again. We all need to SLOW down and evaluate the entire situation. You can't do that with a fogged up mask on your face that already limits your visibility. If you are rushing off your rig and tunnel visioning straight into the structure you are on a collision course for a firefighter funeral. Remember guys, WE COME FIRST... TAKE AN EXTRA FEW SECONDS AND REALLY LOOK AT WHAT YOU ARE GETTING YOURSELF INTO. Conserve your air supply as much as possible and connect up immediately prior to entering the IDLH atmosphere. Trust me guys, it will make for a much better day....

            Jim Crawford
            Pittsburgh Bureau of Fire
            Truck Co. #33

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            • #21
              From what it looks like in the picture its just the way all the lighting from the fire is making it look like he just has a good on..its hard to tell but it pretty much looks like he has his helmet but that is just my opinion...its hard to tell do to them wearing turtle shell helmets..

              ------------------
              Andrew
              South Amboy, New Jersey
              Explorer Engine 6 So. Amboy Fire Dept & Cadet Morgan FAS
              "EMTS DON'T DIE THEY JUST STABILIZE"
              http://engine058.boltpages.com/southamboyfiredepartmentexplorerpost6/

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              • #22
                Just wondering, why didn't we shoot down the April cover?

                Seven guys on the roof with fire showing

                No roof ladder

                Three guys standing at the cut

                No hose line

                No hoods

                Two for sure not masked - one by the saw w/o eye protection

                Two without gloves - one is operating the saw

                Two saws making the same hole

                One without the waist of the SCBA buckled

                And those salad bowl helmets all around

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                • #23
                  I can only agree with ONE point on your last post, Mongo, about the April cover. The salad bowls have to go!

                  As far as the most recent issue, those who commented that it is only one frame that captures a fraction of a second were correct. It is very difficult to judge anything from such a narrow view. Take what you can from the pic, but let's give them the benefit of the doubt.

                  Stay Safe!

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                  • #24
                    I can't tell if he has a helmet on or not. Let's change the argument we beat the helmet thing to death. I might have had to pull a 2&1/2 for that one.

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                    • #25
                      The salad bowls have to go!

                      Man, I love the guys (uh, not in that way) and gals that wear those things, but where in the world do they get them lids?

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        On air coming off the truck?

                        My safety comes first, as I have a family to feed just like most of you do.

                        So, the situation is:

                        You pull in on the Engine, mask on, breathing air, jump off the truck, grab the line and straight into the building?

                        Those days are gone for me. Yes, there was a time when I did that, and I have a pair of underwear to prove it. I have went through a floor, not completely, but too the point that I was wedged between the floor joists of a burned out floor, and the feeling of the room temperature rapidly changing in a exposure that I nor the 2 firefighters with me realized the fire had gotten too. Thanks to my fellow firefighters, I was not injured, was pulled out of the floor, and where did we go? Right back out of the building, sized the place up, while talking to command, and then went ahead with our duties. If I "We" would have taken the extra time to sizeup the fire building, I "we" would have known the exposure we were going in had the potential to be on fire. No-one, and I mean no-one knew this until that happend to me. The fire just didnt seem that bad to us. There was no smoke in the exposure, and no signs of fire, with the exception of a little heat, because it was attached to the fire building "Commercial 3 story business district" and when I realized that most of the livingroom (Lamps, TV, Thermostat) etc were melted, then I realized what could have been, but wasnt.

                        The fire was so intense in the main fire building, that it twisted the steel beams that supported the upper floors like a pretzel. The beams were 1" thick. The fire was estimated at burning near 2200+ degrees. We figured out that a back porch "Cement" that connected to the exposure we had entered had gotten so hot, that it burned out the floor on the inside, thus being the reason I dropped 2 1/2' in about 1 second. I never checked the floor, as I didnt feel a need to. I learned my lessons of tunnel vision, and everytime I jump of the Engine/Truck/Rescue, whatever I am on, I get as much information as possible and then go about my duties as a firefighter. A injured/trapped/missing firefighter will not do the scene any good.

                        And dont forget to have the RIT Team on the scene. : )

                        Awesome cover pic. Looks familiar I must say.


                        Before any comments are made, let me say that yes, being attached to the fire building is enough evidence to say, yea, the possibility is there for the exposure to be in danger. But, to be on this scene, hardly -0- and I mean -0- fire visible, I over looked this, and it could have cost me or any one else in the situation a life(s).

                        The fire was a complete loss, and was a Multi Million Dollar Loss. Allegheny County/ATF has not given a cause of the fire, as it has been ruled undetermined and/or suspicious. This fire was I believe summer of 94 give or take a year. hehe



                        ------------------
                        John Williams
                        NRFF1/EMT

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                        • #27
                          Yes i did see that on the April Cover but there is a forum for that topic. This topic is for the May cover!!

                          Stay Safe,
                          JRFIREFIGHTER43

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                          • #28
                            I looked at it last night and,well, does it look like his hood is on fire to anybody else? Might just be an illusion.

                            Althea

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by mongofire_99:
                              The salad bowls have to go!

                              Man, I love the guys (uh, not in that way) and gals that wear those things, but where in the world do they get them lids?
                              God, I wish we could get traditional helmets out here.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                First of all, I agree that one pix does not tell it all but think of this. Why do f/fs consistently put on their gear right at the door or entrance to the building? I dont agree with putting the mask before stepping off but I do think this happens many times because we do not want someone else grabbing the line from us. Right? Shouldn't we learn something from divers? Step a couple of feet away from the door and check each others gear. Example: Air on? Check! Hood on? Check! Radio on the right frequency? Check! Lets go team. The days of running in without thinking are over. Rooms flashover quicker, ceilings collapse quicker, and explosions can occur easier.

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