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CAFS is it worth it?

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  • mike021
    Guest replied
    well hopefully our new CAFS makes our guys swell with pride and get new people to join!!

    ------------------
    Norwood Fire Co. No. 1
    http://www.nfco1.freeservers.com

    Leave a comment:


  • d308
    Guest replied
    Firehose, Thanks alot that is the info I was looking for.

    Again, Thanks D308

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  • Firehose
    Guest replied
    D308

    Our community situation was very much like yours. To increase water storage, it cost us about $2.09 per gallon for additional elevated storage.
    This along with some other things all went to improving the rating. This is now complete and we are waiting on a review.

    We also purchased a new pumper equiped with CAFS. The CAFS portion of the new pumper did nothing for our rating. BUT, It has been priceless for effectiveness. With CAFS, we are much more effective in fast knockdown, greatly reduced water damage, as well as increasing the effective use of manpower. However, one the greatest advantages we have discovered is not included in the above. It has increased department pride much beyond conceivable expetations. Our firefighters all swell with pride when CAFS is mentioned. this increase in pride has ment an increase in new recrutes in the department.

    That alone is worth the money!

    Good Luck,
    Firehose

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  • jemar
    Guest replied
    IN MANY SITUATION THIS CAN BE A GREAT TOOL!B-U-T THEIR ARE SOME SITUATIONS THAT REQUIRE A LOT OF COOLING,THEN WATER AND A LOT OF WATER IS THE WAY TO GO.

    Leave a comment:


  • d308
    Guest replied
    Just so everybody is aware we are looking at an additional tank of 100,000 gallons and a additional pumper. The ideas that I have may seem wierd to some but we must keep in mind that we respond on 1 sturucture fire every 5 years if that and that we respond on 50 to 100 groundcover fires a year so we do put some money into that as well. And also the water storage problem cannot be fixed with more storage because the main lines are 4" to 6". so the 100,000 gallon tank we are looking at would be set to fill the tankers at a very fast rate and would be for fire use only. These are just some of the ideas that where working on since about 1996 and are close to realizing most of them. The CAFS is part of the plan to reduce damage to the few sturucture fires we have and to help in preventing the groundcover fires from spreading across roads and highways.

    Anyway just some info to help clear some of the confusion.

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  • KEA
    Guest replied
    LHS: Thanks for adding all the additional information to bring your original one-line post to a better understanding of what you meant. Sorry I was so stupid that I couldnt figure out what you meant from your one line statement.

    Thanks

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  • LHS*
    Guest replied
    //Sorry for my confusion Larry, but if this is your position why would you promote CAFS as yo have done in other forums?

    Gee, it all depends doesn't it? If you don't have turnouts or air packs should his FD buy an imager? If they don't have any people would buying two trucks make sense?

    IN his case, they've only got 65,000 gallons of water in the town's water system, what does that leave you to fight fire with in the summer? A couple thousand gallons at max.

    I'm sure if you've read his other posts and my replies that I've explained to this gentleman who asks the question how to afford all the things he needs. Now if he takes action he will be able to afford CAFS or whatever apparatus he desires one day very very soon, but with no bullets for his guns what is the purpose of buying more guns.

    Making his water system match the pump capacity of his largest fire engine and a little hose will bring him $40,000 a year forever. Buying CAFS will bring him in zero dollars. Which would you choose?

    Leave a comment:


  • KEA
    Guest replied
    LHS:
    /I'd buy water storage before I'd spend money on CAFS./

    Sorry for my confusion Larry, but if this is your position why would you promote CAFS as yo have done in other forums?

    Just Curious. Maybe I missunderstood your post?



    ------------------
    Kirk Allen
    First Strike Technologies, Inc

    Leave a comment:


  • LHS*
    Guest replied
    .

    [This message has been edited by LHS* (edited 05-18-2001).]

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  • LHS*
    Guest replied
    I'd buy water storage before I'd spend money on CAFS.

    Leave a comment:


  • d308
    Guest replied
    Thank for the info and KEEP IT COMEIN! Just as some insight to my ditrict we are a town of 150 people. We have 65,000 gallons of storage in the city water system and are looking at some more. we run 1 engine 4 grassfire/tanker trucks one tanker and a minipumper/automotive rescue truck, along with a ILS/ACLS ambulance. Our first response area is 400 sq. miles with mutual aid to a area probably 10 to 15 times that big(no bull).

    Thanks for the info

    Leave a comment:


  • Truckman
    Guest replied
    Hi Capt. Lou

    You answered your own question. If the system makes water more efficient then dealing with a limited water supply will make the water on hand more efficient, so you should be able to the same with less.

    Now I'm not about to argue with you on the usefulness of these systems that was not my point. I'm only pointing out the fact that departments, all over, often make equipment and apparatus purchases that are only based on the fact that it is "the new and improved do all thing." They don't understand how, when or where to use them and therefore it becomes a show piece that never gets used.

    I know the difference between class A and B foams, I've used both. I'm not claiming to be an expert on CAFS, I'm just pointing out, "If you buy it use it." I just so happens that my department has chose not to.

    Be safe

    [This message has been edited by Truckman (edited 05-18-2001).]

    [This message has been edited by Truckman (edited 05-18-2001).]

    Leave a comment:


  • CAPTAIN WHO
    Guest replied
    LHS:

    Not a CAFS issue but a good question.

    As you know you require a pressure differential for the feecon system I believe its around 50-60 psi.

    You need to restrict the hydrant pressure coming in. This can be done by gating down the hydrant to control the amount of intake pressure.

    The idea being the same as the restricter plates you used on your discharges. And yes this will also reduce the flow into the pump.

    But again as you increase discharge flow the pressure differential will increase also between the inlet and discharge. As the differential increases you can reduce the amount of gate on the inlet to increase flows into the pump.

    It becomes quite a dance manually. However I am hearing that recently there was a valve released that will automatically gate the inlet to maintain the correct differential. I'll post when I get more on it.

    You can also direct connect the hydrant to a direct tank fill and use an automatic tank valve.

    The valve will open and close to maintain tank levels and you simply draft of your tank.


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  • iresq
    Guest replied
    I heard a quote from Chief Brunacini that went something like, "I was talking to God and she said all fire engines were to be red and have CASF"

    ------------------
    Negative, I am a meat popsicle.

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  • Capt. Lou
    Guest replied
    Hi Truckman,

    I read your comments and I have some questions that I would like to ask you, so that I may better understand your point of view.


    Do you know what CAFS is?
    Do you understand how CAFS works?
    Do you know the difference between Class "A" and Class "B" foam?
    Do you know and understand how to properly use and apply Class "A" & "B" foam?
    What does limited water supply have to do with CAFS?

    CAFS IS NOT a "toy". It is a tactical advantage for any department that has and utilizes it. The advantages far out weigh the costs of a CAFS system. The problem is usually that not enough or no training and education on a CAFS system is provided when a department purchases one.

    CAFS make water much more efficient, reduces stress and fatigue to firefighters and reduces water damage to the structure in which there is a fire. It also has superior exposure protection as well.

    CAFS is a different and much better way of extinguishing a fire. Regardless if it is a structure or a brush fire. It works great!

    Capt. Lou
    Got Foam!

    Leave a comment:

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