Gays in Fire Service?

[Gill]

I would expect the topic to come up some time. I thought the firehouse was a second home. The home away from home. I don't know what the other poster's fire station life is like, but at my firehouse we view each other (and treat each other) as a family. And like most families, we are close and talk about deep subjects, bypassing the layer of B.S. that a lot of other people front with their co-workers at their respective jobs. One of these topics being our views on homosexuality. We don't all have to agree with each other. In fact we don't. But we still respect each other and have a closeness that a lot of people don't have the priveledge of having at work.

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I LOVE THIS JOB!

[BucksEng91]

Mongo, Mongo, Mongo...couldn'a said it better myself, brother, so I'm not gonna try.

Actually, I sometimes like the fact that conservatives are viewed as the 'radicals' these days, rather than the other way around. Gives one the feeling of what it was like to fight for the ideals of liberty, justice, truth, and freedom back when those precious commodities were in short supply - say, around the 1700s or so.

Besides, it's irresistably fun (and almost unbearably easy!) to tear apart liberal groupthink.

Hey, I don't know if you've seen this before (I think I posted it once before), but I think you'll like it:

In order to be a liberal today, you have to believe...

That trial lawyers are selfless heroes, but doctors are overpaid;

That the AIDS virus is spread by a lack of funding;

That global temperatures are affected more by Yuppies driving SUV’s than by cyclical, documented changes in the brilliance of the sun;

That guns in the hands of law-abiding Americans are more of a threat than nuclear weapons in the hands of the Red Chinese;

That businesses create oppression and governments create prosperity;

That self-esteem is more important than doing anything to earn it;

That there was no art before federal funding;

That the NRA is bad, because it stands up for certain parts of the Constitution, but the ACLU is good, because it stands up for certain parts of the Constitution;

That taxes are too low, but ATM fees are too high;

That Bobby Seale, Cesar Chavez, and Gloria Steinem are more important to an understanding of American history than Thomas Jefferson, Robert E. Lee and Thomas Edison;

That the most troubling thing you can find in a public school is children praying;

That standardized tests are racist, but racial quotas aren’t;

That any change in the weather is proof of global warming;

That national wealth is determined by what we consume, not by what we produce;

That the only wars in which America should become involved are those in which the national security is not at risk;

That perjury and obstruction of justice are impeachable crimes if a Republican president like Richard Nixon commits them, but harmless private matters if a Democratic president like Bill Clinton commits them;

That the way to end racism is to give people special treatment on the basis of their skin color;

That we can have a strong military without spending any money on it;

That the way to improve public schools is to give more money and power to people who have misused it in the past;

That a mother can be trusted to decide whether to terminate the life of her baby, but cannot be trusted to choose her child’s school;

That second-hand smoke is more dangerous than HIV;

That hunters and fisherman don’t care about nature, but pasty-faced activists who rarely leave the Upper West Side of Manhattan do;

That a bureaucrat living in Washington can make better decisions about how your money should be spent than you can;

That Hillary Clinton is a strong example for young women of feminist independence because everything she’s gotten in her life is a result of her marriage to her husband;

That being a movie star makes you qualified to speak out on public policy;

That a clerk in a government-owned liquor store is a selfless tribune of the people, but a clerk in a privately owned liquor store is a vile oppressor of the masses, even though prices are lower and hours are longer in the private store;

That cigarette and liquor advertising must be banned, because it causes kids to smoke and drink, but we don’t need to worry about sex and violence in television programming because kids aren’t influenced by what happens between the commercials;

That passing new laws is a better way to prevent crime than enforcing existing ones;

That the only reason socialism hasn’t worked anywhere it has been tried is because people like you haven’t been in charge.

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J. Black

The opinions expressed are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of any organization with which I am associated.

[mongofire_99]

That perjury and obstruction of justice are impeachable crimes if a Republican president like Richard Nixon commits them, but harmless private matters if a Democratic president like Bill Clinton commits them;

Pointing out the absurdity with more absurdity!

Here's one I heard today that tags along these lines - libs are ****ed that Ashcroft is praying in private in his office.

So add this one:

That it's OK for a democrat President to have sex with a subordinate intern in the Oval Office as it is a harmless private matter, but the prayers offered by the attorney general in his office are not allowed.

Oops, stupid me i forgot about that made up guarantee in the US Constitution of the seperation of church and state, and to be fair, nowhere in there does it say the Pres. can't have his way with younger women in the Oval Office.

What was I thinking?.....

(Side note to MetalMedic/Engine69 if he's reading this - i didn't get killed as a result of the Hoople of the Yeasr forum, did you?)

[HOTDOG]

Bucks,

Although you have called me a liberal in the past, I COULD NOT AGREE with you more, especially the list. Loved it!

As far as the question at hand, who gives a rat's [email protected]#?? I don't.

Begin with the end in mind!!
Be safe out there!!

[BucksEng91]

Hey there HOTDOG...sorry if I offended you by calling you a liberal. I'd be pretty ****ed if someone called me that.

Mongo - good one...I'm surprised I missed that, since that was the first thing I thought when I heard about the Ashcroft brouhaha. On a serious note, it doesn't bother me one bit that an Attorney General of the United States (for a change) is informed by a moral tradition and ethical code like Christianity. Janet Reno would have benefitted from some Bible study, I think.

The First Amendment states, in part, " Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." I don't see how the AG conducting a Bible study violates this amendment. Ooops, there I go again, actually reading the Constitution. Silly me.

Stay safe, guys.

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J. Black

The opinions expressed are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of any organization with which I am associated.

[Firelover]

I'm only a volunteer, but at my "day" job, I work with 3 gay guys. They are the funniest people to work with. The only question that have as well is "Would you save a life if you knew that the life was gay?" Why would sexuality even be in your mind when your fighting a fire. The way I see it, it shouldn't even be a thought. If your uncomfortable with the fact, maybe you should look for something else to do.....

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Joel

If you sent us to HELL, WE'D PUT IT OUT!!

**And of course these are only my opinion and only mine. Don't take it out on anyone else but me.**

[BucksEng91]

You know, I have a real problem with all the hand-wringing that this topic is causing. The short answer is that this is a non-issue, and the brain surgeon that posted the original message OBVIOUSLY has a problem with the issue, despite his protestations to the contrary.

What I'm trying to say, I guess, is that if it doesn't matter to you, o enlightened and politically correct original poster, then why did you feel a burning need to ask the question here in the first place? To demonstrate how wonderfully sensitive you are? I mean, really. What was the purpose? This reminds me of the old ladies in my former church who would pray loudly and publicly so everyone could see how Godly they are.

What, are you looking for us to congratulate you because you "don't mind" working with gay firefighters? Come on. Let's talk about something that actually has some relevance to the fire service.

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J. Black

The opinions expressed are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of any organization with which I am associated.

[This message has been edited by BucksEng91 (edited 05-17-2001).]

[RADFIRE]

I haven't read the whole length of the thread, however, I feel that if you do the job well then you belong here. Black, white, turqouse, gay, straight, asexual, male, female, blonde, redhead, brunette.....

You get the point.
But if you don't do the job well....learn quick .....or get out.
My humble $0.02.

[Althea Forhan]

Hey, Bucks,

The most disturbing thing you'll find in public schools; Peaceful protest (We demand equal celebration of X-day!)

Another thing-the pastyest skinned environmentalists you see don't live in Manhatten, they live here in Humboldt. They're truly disturbing. In the course of a day the same baby will be seen with ten different "Parents" who are either using it to beg, or as pepper spay deterent at protests.

Althea

[Dr. Law]

I was going to make a reply to this post, but being a conservative, straight, male, Caucasian, middle-aged, and of course, Republican, I knew that anybody who read it would know I am an evil, homophobic, female-hormone challenged (possibly a wife-beater), slave-owning minority oppressor, out-of-touch with the problems of youth and seniors, and part of a vast right-winged conspiracy. Therefore, I knew nothing I had to say would be taken seriously.

(sigh)

[mongofire_99]

Nobody would take anything you had to say seriously becuase you forgot to tell us you wanted to starve children and let old people die without meds.

So....

[daysleeper47]

There we go...Dr. Law has finally described conservatives to a "T".

(Ok, mongo, I was kidding...try not to beat me up again. I don't really want to have to research my A*S off to keep up with you on this pretty stupid topic.)

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Joe
Daysleeper47
"When the bell goes ding-ding, its time to get on the woo-woo."
"Dusting desire - starting to learn. Walking through fire with out a burn..."
Youngstown Fire Department

[mongofire_99]

Awww, Daysleeper47, you take all the fun out of it.

But let me ask you this anyway.

Conservatives are generally regarded as intolerant, anti-gay, minority, pro life and the list goes on. Yet our ranks - including our politicians - are made up of people that include out gays, minorities and pro-choice and the list goes on.

On the otherhand, liberals are generally regarded as tolerant and do not accept, appreciate, give due regard too, or claim anyone that does not accept out and vocal gays, minorities and pro-choice.

Considering that, and putting my bigotry statements aside from earlier, who's really more intolerant?

No research needed unless you want, just an opinion...

[daysleeper47]

Well mongo, it comes down to the fact that I really don't care what the rest of us fine liberals think or who's intolerant, who is loving and warm and fuzzy inside, or who is blue, red, gay, or straight. I don't represent every liberal here so far be it for me to speak for everyone. I know where I stand and thats the important thing. I can accept whatever lifestyle people choose to live(for the most part). Forget what others think...now hows that for a tolerant liberal?

[BucksEng91]

That's pretty good for a lib, daysleeper...

Personally, I don't subscribe to the "I'm OK, you're OK" school of thought. If I have a problem with you, I'll straight out tell you and we can work it out whatever way seems appropriate, you know? The problem, davsleeper, is that when "everyone's OK", then there is no objective truth. When Johnny says 2+2=5, and he gets a gold star because he "tried", or worse because "we don't want to squash his self esteem", that's a problem. And liberal thinking is to blame - sorry to wake you up to that, but that's the simple and ridiculous truth.

Actually, what mongo is talking about (conservative = evil, white, old-people killers) is fairly widespread. I have to hand it to the left on this one - they've been able to demonize conservatives pretty damn well, and control the political language (can you say "politically correct"?), BUT...they've been unable to eradicate conservatism, and in fact have *increased* its appeal because they don't argue facts, historical truths, or objective reality. Liberal thinking is an emotional basket case...a rhetorical house of cards that blows over when hit with even a light conservative wind. Liberal arguments simply don't stand up to the light of facts and reasoned arguments, plain and simple. Case in point the "2+2=5" argument above.

This is the principle reason why I went off like a cornered coon in my last post. The original poster of this thread obviously wants everyone to congratulate him for not hating gay people...as if that's something worthy of congratulation! That should be a normal, everyday thing. Only in our liberal-ified way of thinking could we make a hero out of someone simply because they don't hate another person. As I said, COME ON!!! Stop with the self-congratulation and hand-wringing and be a man. Do your damn job, and I'll do mine. Let's talk about something that's relevant to the fire service. What's next - we sit down, hold hands, and sing "Kumbaya"?

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J. Black

The opinions expressed are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of any organization with which I am associated.