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Ladder length for a QUINT
What would you classify as an adequate length aerial ladder for a quint? 75' 85' 100'? We are purchasing one and we will be running it frontline to approx. 2000 runs annually per station. Will this truck handle the abuse? I appreciate any input.
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Our dept. says 105'.
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Most Quints that I have Seen Run between 55' and 75' -- Those are common in my particular area
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"S.F.C. Home of the New Jersey State Fire Firemen's Association Convention Champions 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, and 2000Comment
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I think that 75 feet long is a good length to start with it provides a decent reach.
I have seen a 105 foot Pierce. Now that's an impressive piece. Now that's what I would call a quint. I loved it there was a great deal of space for equipment. It was definitely something that when you pulled in to a fire you could really get the job done. Even FDNY had some. A friend of mine told me about the American LaFrance/ LTI Towers Ladders that had the 1,500 GPM pumps on them. I don't think any are left in front line service any more though. I believe they've all been replaced by Aerial scopes. They most of been an experiment like the Mack/LTI rear mount ladder Trucks. I believe there were only two of them. One was Ladder 132 out of Brooklyn and the other was Ladder 30 out of Harlem.Comment
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Go with a ladder size that fits the area you service. We run a 1997 Pierce Quantum Quintwith a 1500gpm pump, 750gal. tank, 75ft aerial, and tons of compartment space. Our tallest building is a GM plant and the 75ft stick reaches the roof no problem with length to spare. So take a look around your first due and second due areas find the smallest building you would use it on and the tallest or biggest building you would use it on and decide from there. Look at water towers and other odd objects in the area also. Why buy a 105' ladder when you never extend the 4th fly section on a job. Just my thoughts on the subject.Comment
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FFPFAFF,
Like the other brothers said, it depends on your response area requirements. But as a truckie I recommend, if you have the water system, a 2000 GPM pump. The 1500's I've seen are fine, but the bigger pump, like I said if you have the water, can come in handy. As far as the height, I would also recommend that you not only look at the average height of your tallest buildings. But the occupancy, (hotels, chemical plants, etc.) but also in your residential areas, how far are some homes set back off the road. With truss roofs today, we make every attempt to perform peaked roof ventilation off a aerial device. Of course this isn't always possible being most of our service lines are still on poles, and Murphy always being around, the fire building right behind them. Plus, you may want to take into account where your response area is going as far as development. Are they building high rises or commercial buildings. Even though we are like the rest, with budgeting, we are finally getting through that with some equipment its better to have and not need then need and not have.
Remember, if you have that feeling that the last hydrant you passed was the last one before the fire, that's because it was. LOl
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The above is my opinion only and doesn't reflect that of any dept./agency I work for, am a member of, or deal with.
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Like everyone has mentioned above, what you buy now depends on whats currently in your district and the future development of it. I've seen aerials ranging from 75' to 105', with pumps from 1000 GPM to 2000 GPM. My personal feelings are that anything below 75' should be considered a tele-squirt.Comment
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FFPFAFF,
I just wanted to add after reading FF194's post, is that if I remember correctly, Buffalo, NY bought several Quints with 1000 Gpm pumps on them. After only taken delivery of a few of them, they halted further delivery. You can research it more but if I remember correctly the 1000 Gpm pump wasn't adequate enough for what they wanted/needed. Good posts guys!!
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The above is my thoughts/opinions only and doesn't reflect that of any dept./agency I work for, am a member of, or deal with.
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The city I work for has 3 75' quints and 1 105' quint. There are good/bad qualities about both of them. Two of our 75' quints run on fire and EMS calls and on some of our streets it gets really tight w/ those trucks. Our 105' comes is great to have when we really need it, but can be a major pain in the butt to drive around for anything other than fire calls.
All of our quints (especially the ones running on fire and EMS calls) tend to have more wear and tear problems than our engines do. Brakes tend to wear out fast so two of our 75' quints were retrofitted w/ Telma brakes. The bearings on the back wheels have worn out on the quints w/out a tandem axle.Comment
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It all depends on what you area needs. I suggest getting a few demo's with different lengths (regardless of manufacturer for this part) and see what best works. If you worried about ladder length then quint or truck will do for this. I my personal opinion is 75' or greater. There are a lot of options out there. Good luck.
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Keep Safe!Comment
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Some good responses here. I don't know much about Quints but there is a good, honest article in this month's Fire Engineering from a Richmond, VA guy. It sounds like it might be Jake who is a poster on this forum.
Seems to me like Quints are at best, a compromise...the bigger the ladder, the smaller the pump and booster tank can be and vice versa. The response district will typically dictate how the rig ends up being speced.Comment
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A quints a comprise or is it the people writting the specs are making compromises? Low spec equals low performance. I'm sure the pump on our quints is bigger than 99.9% of the engines in the US. I know our water tank is bigger than 99.9% of the engines in the US. I bet we have more attack line probably four times more, far more 5 inch supply line, nozzles, foam, seats, storage, ground ladders, extrication gear, larger drop tank, salvage covers, hooks, more master streams, blowers, more hard suction hose, etc. than the average engine company. I can't think of much if anything we lack from a dedicated truck company or engine. We can load our supply hose without laying the ladder, we can lay dual 5 inch supply lines, it is a great engine and a wonderful truck, heck it even goes off road on wildland fires. Our main ladder is plenty long for whatever we will face.
Contrast that with the off the shelf rigs Richmond bought and most others own and I can see why they complain.
BigPaulie said once we got more water flowing in 3 minutes with four guys than he'd ever seen two rigs make in twice the time with twice the crew.
Is it the rig or the people specing the rig that makes it a compromise?Comment
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My Department run a 1992 Pierce quint. It is 105' We do not have any big building in our local except 3 church's, and some tall houses. We went with the 105' for the extra reach when needed. We have a 1500 gmp pump and 200 gallons on board. Granted the water goes fast and furious, if that could be a problem look into CAFS. Anyway look at how far you have to go to reach that one story house in your district, how close can you get out of town arriving after other piece's are already there, like everyone said look and think about what kind of reach you need. Then get demo's in to drive around.Comment
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My Department run a 1992 Pierce quint. It is 105' We do not have any big building in our local except 3 church's, and some tall houses. We went with the 105' for the extra reach when needed. We have a 1500 gmp pump and 200 gallons on board. Granted the water goes fast and furious, if that could be a problem look into CAFS. Anyway look at how far you have to go to reach that one story house in your district, how close can you get out of town arriving after other piece's are already there, like everyone said look and think about what kind of reach you need. Then get demo's in to drive around.
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Norwood Fire Co. No. 1
http://www.nfco1.freeservers.comComment
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LHS:
If only we could all be as perfect as you Larry.
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