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RIT Training props

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  • RIT Training props

    Howdy everyone!

    I am looking for some innovative RIT training props. Does anyone have any designs they would like to share?

    I have already built the Denver prop designed by Dale Pekel from Wauwatosa Fire as seen on Youtube. I also have a restricted passage prop, and I am building the box entanglement prop. .
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

  • #2
    Originally posted by fire5555
    borrow a real empty real building to train in? set up what ever?
    I like your idea and I have run RIT training in acquired houses before we burned them.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

    Comment


    • #3
      I'd like to see the wall prop taller above the window to allow the use of a ground ladder as a high point to hoist a victim out of the window.
      I looked at some of those youtube ladder prop videos but most seemed to focus on self rescue.

      All of the videos seem to focus on using this technique for second floor rescues, but it works just as well on ground floor.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pp4zoVtv7Uo

      Easy and quick to set up, and allows relatively easy removal using an engine company on the outside and only 2 rescuers inside. For a ground floor rescue a roof ladder is usually adequate.

      I went through a ladder rescue course a number of years ago, and from my experience many firefighters are lacking outside the box experience using ladders as a rescue tool.

      We practiced the high point technique in a condemned building, using narrow high windows, and confined interior spaces as well as more typical situations, it works really well and with a little practice is very quick to set up.

      With some variations it can also often be used to retrieve a firefighter from a below grade opening as well.

      Comment


      • #4
        Our guys just completed a month of shift training and rills on RIT. The instructors combined the use of multiple props (entanglement box, confined space box (wooden prop like a catch basin with multiple opening configurations) and a few culverts. Last drill utilized all props in an acquired structure to provide a challenging rescue scenario.

        I like the suggestion above. Over and over guys work on the Denver Drill and find while its doable with the right knowledge and skills, the high point is far less physically taxing using the same number of personnel. But without a doubt all of these options need to be in the toolbox, as situations are rarely if ever identical. We need problem solvers.

        Comment


        • #5
          A thought about building a higher Denver prop wall to allow use of a ladder and FEPS came to mind. How about positioning the Denver prop in the station apparatus doorway and using the wall of the station as an extension of the prop to allow use of the ladder and FEPS to remove a firefighter from the window?
          Last edited by FyredUp; 05-01-2016, 11:51 AM.
          Crazy, but that's how it goes
          Millions of people living as foes
          Maybe it's not too late
          To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

          Comment


          • #6
            FEPS? Not familiar with that acronym. But using the Denver prop in a bay door makes sense to allow for the highpoint rescue evolution. On a non-related but still FS note: Rick Lasky was brought to town yesterday by our Co. training group and it was great to hear him also complaining about putting the "I" in VES.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by RFDACM02 View Post
              FEPS? Not familiar with that acronym. But using the Denver prop in a bay door makes sense to allow for the highpoint rescue evolution. On a non-related but still FS note: Rick Lasky was brought to town yesterday by our Co. training group and it was great to hear him also complaining about putting the "I" in VES.
              My Captain Dale Pekel called the rope and pulley system the FEPS: Firefighter Extraction Pulley System.

              Here's a video from him on youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOADsy3AN9Q
              Crazy, but that's how it goes
              Millions of people living as foes
              Maybe it's not too late
              To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

              Comment


              • #8
                We built some wall props for the Denver drill but made them portable. Every now and then we borrow a flatbed from a local lumber yard and put the prop on the bed, forces ladder use for the drill.
                "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

                Comment


                • #9
                  My Denver prop is portable too. It breaks down into 4 pieces.
                  Crazy, but that's how it goes
                  Millions of people living as foes
                  Maybe it's not too late
                  To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Not a big prop guy for rapis intervention and self rescue. I'm more of "I'll come up with something that they have never seen before" kind of a guy.

                    Why? Because props are generally predictable. After they have run through them a couple of times, they know what to expect and know what to do. Now, I'm not saying that it's a bad thing, and they certainly do have their place in building some basic self-rescue and RIT skills, but given the energy required to develop and build them especially in small department I'm just not sure if it's worth the energy.

                    I do use them as my VFD has a couple made up. They were stored in the open where the members could see them before they were used, but now they are locked up. Most of the members have never seen them and that's the way I like it. They'll be a surprise for most when we do go to use them.

                    I'm more of a dropping a few hundred feet of 3" hose, cargo net or chain link fence on them while crawling around doing a search or hose advancement drill kind of guy. Random. Unexpected. Unannounced. And yes. kinda dirty. But it catches them off guard and I believe, truly tests their ability to react to the unexpected.

                    Just my take on things.
                    Train to fight the fires you fight.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      No offense, LaFire, but for RIT/FAST training....your not the guy I'd be looking for to lead it. Hose or netting while on hose advancement is pretty standard training for all firefighters. Hose advancement is not even part of our RIT/FAST.
                      "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Bones42 View Post
                        No offense, LaFire, but for RIT/FAST training....your not the guy I'd be looking for to lead it. Hose or netting while on hose advancement is pretty standard training for all firefighters. Hose advancement is not even part of our RIT/FAST.
                        True hose advancement is not.

                        My point is that I very rarely "schedule" rapid intervention training. Sure, every once in awhile I will when I want to clearly develop a self-rescue/rapid intervention skill or set of skills, and that will be scheduled as such, but in my experience I have found that the best self-rescue or RIT drills occur when I throw in that fireground emergency while they are performing another scheduled task, such as a "scheduled" hose advancement or search drill.

                        The idea that they may run into a situation, have to call a mayday and then will have to perform rapid intervention operations in not in their heads. It forces them to start cold and respond as they likely will have to during an actual event when they are concentrating on fire operations, and not necessarily thinking about self-rescue/rapid intervention as their primary focus.

                        The hose was just one of the things that I have used in the past.
                        Train to fight the fires you fight.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          LA, I could not possibly disagree more with you on your feelings about RIT training. You have to train people in different methods of getting firefighters out of buildings, or entrapments. Things like the Denver Drill using the wall/window prop are an example. if you don't train people on how to move a downed firefighter out of a basement window, or an upper story window, odds are very good you will be unsuccessful when the incident actually occurs. This type of training takes repetition and involves far more than throwing a piece of fence or hose on top of a firefighter.

                          Proficiency with techniques and equipment, like the FEPS, Columbus Kit, using your bailout kit to lower a firefighter out of a window, takes familiarization with the equipment and repetitive trainings until you can't do it wrong.

                          Further you are dragging my simple topic asking for RIT training prop ideas off topic. Neither one of your posts answers the question that I originally posted.
                          Crazy, but that's how it goes
                          Millions of people living as foes
                          Maybe it's not too late
                          To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                            LA, I could not possibly disagree more with you on your feelings about RIT training. You have to train people in different methods of getting firefighters out of buildings, or entrapments. Things like the Denver Drill using the wall/window prop are an example. if you don't train people on how to move a downed firefighter out of a basement window, or an upper story window, odds are very good you will be unsuccessful when the incident actually occurs. This type of training takes repetition and involves far more than throwing a piece of fence or hose on top of a firefighter.

                            Proficiency with techniques and equipment, like the FEPS, Columbus Kit, using your bailout kit to lower a firefighter out of a window, takes familiarization with the equipment and repetitive trainings until you can't do it wrong.

                            Further you are dragging my simple topic asking for RIT training prop ideas off topic. Neither one of your posts answers the question that I originally posted.
                            First of all, I never stated that formal RIT training with props never had it's place. It does as a basic foundation. My point was that the members in both of my departments rarely see "RIT Training" written on the schedule. IT's built into other training. Firefighter emergencies occur without being scheduled and I want them to know that they may encounter and have to deal with a rapid intervention emergency in any training drill that they may be involved with.

                            Just the other night we had a brush fire drill and about 25 minutes in we had a member "go down" after being hit by a snake. The members had to deal with that simulated emergency. Then I had one of the members on the stokes go down with a cardiac event.

                            From the get go I had no intention of completeing this drill as a brush fire drill. From the moment the training was scheduled as a brush fire drill, it was going to be a RIT drill, but nobody knew. They came to the station expecting an easy night and I gave them a very hard night. And it worked.

                            As far as I'm concerned, those situations are all props. Props that they cannot study ahead of time and prepare for. Props that they have not been through before and complete on auto=pilot because they have done it 5 times previously.

                            Yes, formal, scheduled training with props has it's place as a limited part of preparing the guys for emergencies, but IMO, giving them something they have never seen before as a major part of RIT training is far more important. Just my opinion.
                            Train to fight the fires you fight.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by LaFireEducator View Post
                              First of all, I never stated that formal RIT training with props never had it's place. It does as a basic foundation. My point was that the members in both of my departments rarely see "RIT Training" written on the schedule. IT's built into other training. Firefighter emergencies occur without being scheduled and I want them to know that they may encounter and have to deal with a rapid intervention emergency in any training drill that they may be involved with.

                              Just the other night we had a brush fire drill and about 25 minutes in we had a member "go down" after being hit by a snake. The members had to deal with that simulated emergency. Then I had one of the members on the stokes go down with a cardiac event.

                              From the get go I had no intention of completeing this drill as a brush fire drill. From the moment the training was scheduled as a brush fire drill, it was going to be a RIT drill, but nobody knew. They came to the station expecting an easy night and I gave them a very hard night. And it worked.

                              As far as I'm concerned, those situations are all props. Props that they cannot study ahead of time and prepare for. Props that they have not been through before and complete on auto=pilot because they have done it 5 times previously.

                              Yes, formal, scheduled training with props has it's place as a limited part of preparing the guys for emergencies, but IMO, giving them something they have never seen before as a major part of RIT training is far more important. Just my opinion.
                              But again CLEARLY my post asks for ideas on PROPS for RIT training.
                              Crazy, but that's how it goes
                              Millions of people living as foes
                              Maybe it's not too late
                              To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                              Comment

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