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  • #16
    Originally posted by truckedup133 View Post
    Why would they raise a ladder and try it again? They both listed their preference, which would tend towards me thinking THAT THIS IS HOW THEY CHOOSE TO DO IT IN THE FIELD. All this would accomplish is arguing outside as opposed to in. All he was asking for was a consensus. Opinions. That is all....And he couldnt even get that. Surely, we all agree that what is right for me might not be right for you and likewise, the other way around. Perhaps they just wanted the data....just to see for their own amusement. Wtf.

    It's fitting I took a class today called firehouse excellence. In it, among a series of ways to be the fireman and person you should want to be, they discussed how we treat our brothers. I don't know the man who asked this question. So, instead of insinuating he is a "wannabe instructor", or lazy or dumb....I just answered his question. Gave him the respect to answer a question without ridicule. A courtesy that has been offered to me all week so far at FDIC.

    What I should not have done was made such a mockery of this board and been so cynical. If I was true to what stuff I studied today I would not have done that. But sometimes it is unbearable to read a board that I used to enjoy that has been reduced to a collection of the guys just like those who I consistently try to ignore within my own department. ( I should say that its not all of you )

    Just the other day I asked a simple question and got just as sh*tty a return as this guy. And its just pointless to be like that. So go ahead and call me thin-skinned....Everyone's all time arguement.

    If I had to keep telling people they are too thin skinned, I might, eventually begin to think...."hey, maybe I'm the assh0le." There is a difference in firehouse joking and razzing and not giving two sh1ts enough about somebody to help them out. And frankly I would say this board is toeing that line.

    If just answering this simple question helped this bro out well then cool, glad I helped. If he is just lazy, dumb and a wannabe well then what am I really out by typing 12 words? Nothing. And maybe because of my answer he went out and threw a ladder and decided for himself what he liked. If that happened well thats one good thing I did for a fellow firefighter. And perhaps they are just sitting and laughing at all the crap they stirred, and if so...no biggie. I still did for him what I would have wanted if I had been asking. So I am good with it.

    Accept my surrender?

    You can keep your acceptance sir.
    Tl;dr lolololol.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by truckedup133 View Post
      Why would they raise a ladder and try it again? They both listed their preference, which would tend towards me thinking THAT THIS IS HOW THEY CHOOSE TO DO IT IN THE FIELD. All this would accomplish is arguing outside as opposed to in. All he was asking for was a consensus. Opinions. That is all....And he couldnt even get that. Surely, we all agree that what is right for me might not be right for you and likewise, the other way around. Perhaps they just wanted the data....just to see for their own amusement. Wtf.

      It's fitting I took a class today called firehouse excellence. In it, among a series of ways to be the fireman and person you should want to be, they discussed how we treat our brothers. I don't know the man who asked this question. So, instead of insinuating he is a "wannabe instructor", or lazy or dumb....I just answered his question. Gave him the respect to answer a question without ridicule. A courtesy that has been offered to me all week so far at FDIC.

      What I should not have done was made such a mockery of this board and been so cynical. If I was true to what stuff I studied today I would not have done that. But sometimes it is unbearable to read a board that I used to enjoy that has been reduced to a collection of the guys just like those who I consistently try to ignore within my own department. ( I should say that its not all of you )

      Just the other day I asked a simple question and got just as sh*tty a return as this guy. And its just pointless to be like that. So go ahead and call me thin-skinned....Everyone's all time arguement.

      If I had to keep telling people they are too thin skinned, I might, eventually begin to think...."hey, maybe I'm the assh0le." There is a difference in firehouse joking and razzing and not giving two sh1ts enough about somebody to help them out. And frankly I would say this board is toeing that line.

      If just answering this simple question helped this bro out well then cool, glad I helped. If he is just lazy, dumb and a wannabe well then what am I really out by typing 12 words? Nothing. And maybe because of my answer he went out and threw a ladder and decided for himself what he liked. If that happened well thats one good thing I did for a fellow firefighter. And perhaps they are just sitting and laughing at all the crap they stirred, and if so...no biggie. I still did for him what I would have wanted if I had been asking. So I am good with it.

      Accept my surrender?

      You can keep your acceptance sir.
      Okay, now this was tl;dr.

      I did read the last sentence, and it makes no sense. In cases of surrender, one keeps his acceptance. This was proven by Einstein. It's science.
      Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by MemphisE34a View Post
        There is one key point that this topic should bring to the table.....

        The correct way to do several things, in this case stepping off a ladder, is any manner in which you are comfortable and can do it without busting your a s s - espacially if there are cameras around.

        End of discussion. Seriously. No one else needs to waste their time or bandwidth answering.
        Thank you!! The voice of reason and experience.

        Good lord, do we need to teach everything as if it is truly black or white, no exceptions? Isn't this a dynamic business where there are far more variables than are readily processed at any given moment in time? Maybe some of you are spending years fighting the same exact fire on the same power point presentation?

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by RFDACM02 View Post
          Thank you!! The voice of reason and experience.

          Good lord, do we need to teach everything as if it is truly black or white, no exceptions? Isn't this a dynamic business where there are far more variables than are readily processed at any given moment in time? Maybe some of you are spending years fighting the same exact fire on the same power point presentation?
          Apparently TODAY,YES! A problem I struggle with everyday. I like it the OLD way,Competent officers and everyone had a job and KNEW it even the guy with the proby under his wing. NOW,it's loose leaf procedure manuals,vests, and a whiteboard. WTF!!? T.C.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by truckedup133 View Post
            Surely, we all agree that what is right for me might not be right for you and likewise, the other way around.
            If there's one thing I've learned on this board, it's that there's only one way to do things, and that's (the editorial) "MY" way. Everybody else is wrong.
            Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

            Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by mcwops View Post
              This sounds like one of those "deep" discussions that comes up after a case of beer.
              I know they're called fingers, but I've never seen them fing....

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Rescue101 View Post
                Apparently TODAY,YES! A problem I struggle with everyday. I like it the OLD way,Competent officers and everyone had a job and KNEW it even the guy with the proby under his wing. NOW,it's loose leaf procedure manuals,vests, and a whiteboard. WTF!!? T.C.


                Right on target Chief!

                What we did years back must have been so fouled, that the youngster's now days, had to reinvent the complete fire service and the wheel!!


                Throw the correct ladder, climb same. Tie it in. Place a roof ladder hooks over the peak, climb upon and do your mission.



                Stay Safe and Well Out There....

                Always remembering 9-11-2001 and 343+ Brothers

                Comment


                • #23
                  I just got done teaching this on sat, ladder to roof you should not step above roof line- 3 to 5 rungs past roof or 10 clicks on a 35' ladder. Roof ladder you should not step past roof line. This is how your trained but real life is a different story. Sorry guys I just had to answer it was fresh in my head.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    My only rule about stepping from the ladder to the roof is don't fall, it's too much paperwork nowadays.
                    I can't believe they actually pay me to do this!!!

                    One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
                    "The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
                    -from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by IronsMan53 View Post
                      My only rule about stepping from the ladder to the roof is don't fall, it's too much paperwork nowadays.
                      True dat!!!!
                      ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
                      Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Holy Crap

                        Thanks to the one or two who gave answers based on their experience and what they taught.

                        The reason this question came up is the two of us, both instructors, but from different training schools and backgrounds were teaching the same class about ladder work. We had different groups and one group mentioned that we had different views on the accepted method of transferring from a ground ladder to a roof ladder. After discussing the issue, in a friendly and civilised manner we both agreed to disagree, with the other instructor taking a position that stepping off a rung at or above the roofline was a safety issue. Trying to be somewhat decent instructors and to provide a consensus opinion so as to provide the best and most accurate information to the recruits, we agreed to research and come up with a unified opinion.

                        So, with that idea in mind, we looked through text books and other forms of fire service material, and lo, I thought to myself, why not ask a question on a forum where firefighters gather to discuss all sorts of interesting ideas and concepts, including POV lights, volunteer vs. POC vs. career, which flashlight is best, and any other really incredibly beneficial topics.

                        Well, thanks guys, thanks for showing what a bunch of whiny, self-important, boorish forum bullies you all can be. I thought it was a relatively decent question deserving at least an informed opinion and answer that could be backed up with if not facts but the experiences of others who do the job maybe more frequently than the lazy dumb *** instructor wannabee that I am.

                        Yes, agreed that you do what works, but lets face it, sometimes what works doesnt always work everytime and sometimes its not the safest or easiest. IMHO stepping off and onto the rung at or above the roofline is safer and easier for transition purposes, and yes, ive done it that way my whole career, but if there are others who have had safety issues or have seen actual problems arising from said method, hell, I'd love to hear it. I'd welcome differing opinions, isn't that what forums are about. Because believe it or not, I don't always think i'm right 100% of the time, I can actually allow that there are others who have more experience and training than me.

                        So, again, sorry to the majority for posting a now as I look back at it stupid and insensitive question, really my bad... in fact let me make it up to you all and post a new one...

                        "I'm thinking about taking photo's of victims at a car wreck, I was just wondering what film speed would you recommend that wouldn't interfere with the reflection of my DOT approved safety vest and the flashing L.E.D.s from my uber charged Chevy Pinto... oh and anyone know of a good facebook app where I can publish said pictures under the guise of training info"

                        Flame away ******s
                        Last edited by Fawlty; 03-23-2011, 03:39 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Fawlty View Post
                          Thanks to the one or two who gave answers based on their experience and what they taught.

                          The reason this question came up is the two of us, both instructors, but from different training schools and backgrounds were teaching the same class about ladder work. We had different groups and one group mentioned that we had different views on the accepted method of transferring from a ground ladder to a roof ladder. After discussing the issue, in a friendly and civilised manner we both agreed to disagree, with the other instructor taking a position that stepping off a rung at or above the roofline was a safety issue. Trying to be somewhat decent instructors and to provide a consensus opinion so as to provide the best and most accurate information to the recruits, we agreed to research and come up with a unified opinion.

                          So, with that idea in mind, we looked through text books and other forms of fire service material, and lo, I thought to myself, why not ask a question on a forum where firefighters gather to discuss all sorts of interesting ideas and concepts, including POV lights, volunteer vs. POC vs. career, which flashlight is best, and any other really incredibly beneficial topics.

                          Well, thanks guys, thanks for showing what a bunch of whiny, self-important, boorish forum bullies you all can be. I thought it was a relatively decent question deserving at least an informed opinion and answer that could be backed up with if not facts but the experiences of others who do the job maybe more frequently than the lazy dumb *** instructor wannabee that I am.

                          Yes, agreed that you do what works, but lets face it, sometimes what works doesnt always work everytime and sometimes its not the safest or easiest. IMHO stepping off and onto the rung at or above the roofline is safer and easier for transition purposes, and yes, ive done it that way my whole career, but if there are others who have had safety issues or have seen actual problems arising from said method, hell, I'd love to hear it. I'd welcome differing opinions, isn't that what forums are about. Because believe it or not, I don't always think i'm right 100% of the time, I can actually allow that there are others who have more experience and training than me.

                          So, again, sorry to the majority for posting a now as I look back at it stupid and insensitive question, really my bad... in fact let me make it up to you all and post a new one...

                          "I'm thinking about taking photo's of victims at a car wreck, I was just wondering what film speed would you recommend that wouldn't interfere with the reflection of my DOT approved safety vest and the flashing L.E.D.s from my uber charged Chevy Pinto... oh and anyone know of a good facebook app where I can publish said pictures under the guise of training info"

                          Flame away ******s

                          Did you just write a novel crying about a response to your post on the interwebs?
                          Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Fawlty View Post
                            Thanks to the one or two who gave answers based on their experience and what they taught.

                            The reason this question came up is the two of us, both instructors, but from different training schools and backgrounds were teaching the same class about ladder work. We had different groups and one group mentioned that we had different views on the accepted method of transferring from a ground ladder to a roof ladder. After discussing the issue, in a friendly and civilised manner we both agreed to disagree, with the other instructor taking a position that stepping off a rung at or above the roofline was a safety issue. Trying to be somewhat decent instructors and to provide a consensus opinion so as to provide the best and most accurate information to the recruits, we agreed to research and come up with a unified opinion.

                            So, with that idea in mind, we looked through text books and other forms of fire service material, and lo, I thought to myself, why not ask a question on a forum where firefighters gather to discuss all sorts of interesting ideas and concepts, including POV lights, volunteer vs. POC vs. career, which flashlight is best, and any other really incredibly beneficial topics.

                            Well, thanks guys, thanks for showing what a bunch of whiny, self-important, boorish forum bullies you all can be. I thought it was a relatively decent question deserving at least an informed opinion and answer that could be backed up with if not facts but the experiences of others who do the job maybe more frequently than the lazy dumb *** instructor wannabee that I am.

                            Yes, agreed that you do what works, but lets face it, sometimes what works doesnt always work everytime and sometimes its not the safest or easiest. IMHO stepping off and onto the rung at or above the roofline is safer and easier for transition purposes, and yes, ive done it that way my whole career, but if there are others who have had safety issues or have seen actual problems arising from said method, hell, I'd love to hear it. I'd welcome differing opinions, isn't that what forums are about. Because believe it or not, I don't always think i'm right 100% of the time, I can actually allow that there are others who have more experience and training than me.

                            So, again, sorry to the majority for posting a now as I look back at it stupid and insensitive question, really my bad... in fact let me make it up to you all and post a new one...

                            "I'm thinking about taking photo's of victims at a car wreck, I was just wondering what film speed would you recommend that wouldn't interfere with the reflection of my DOT approved safety vest and the flashing L.E.D.s from my uber charged Chevy Pinto... oh and anyone know of a good facebook app where I can publish said pictures under the guise of training info"

                            Flame away ******s
                            Lighten up, Francis.
                            "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by FWDbuff View Post
                              Lighten up, Francis.
                              Frig, what's the name of that movie? The dad was retired FDNY, but for the life of me I can't remember the name.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by firefightinirish217 View Post
                                Frig, what's the name of that movie? The dad was retired FDNY, but for the life of me I can't remember the name.
                                The movie was Twilight.
                                Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

                                Comment

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