Who's talking now?

[DeputyChiefGonzo]

From Urbanfirefighter.com

Who's Talking Now?
Posted on 1/16/2011

Who’s Talking Now?

By Ray McCormack

Watch your step. Be careful. Be safe, indeed – and watch what you read. Today the fire service critic lives in a protected area: the internet – and is not required to have any fire experience to draw upon. Like birds awaiting Momma’s feeding, fire service critics sit with mouths’ open, ready to chew on whatever mistake or omission is provided them. How does that happen? How do we collectively know it is wrong and still allow it to exist? Does outrage serve as amusement? Is it the accident we cannot look away from that draws us in? A senior firefighter once remarked upon being interrupted: “The Firefighters are talking now.”

[tny1771]

A-fricking-men.

A deep drive to center field.....back, back, back, going, going, GONE!

McCormack hits another one out of the ballpark. This should be a "sticky" for FH.com I need to incorporate part of this article in a new sig.

[TNFF319]

Now if we can get the webteam to read this.

[LaFireEducator]

A deep drive to center field.....back, back, back, going, going, GONE!

McCormack hits another one out of the ballpark. This should be a "sticky" for FH.com I need to incorporate part of this article in a new sig.

Sorta looks like a foul pop to the third base side.

Caught by Schmidt.

Inning over.

[DeputyChiefGonzo]

Sorta looks like a foul pop to the third base side.

Caught by Schmidt.

Inning over.

The only thing "foul" is you... or should that be "fowl"....

[FyredUp]

Sorta looks like a foul pop to the third base side.

Caught by Schmidt.

Inning over.

The meaningless, out of touch, minority, when faced with overwhelming proof that they are such have no recourse but to attack a nationally recognized fire service leader.

Thanks LA, once again you have sunk to another new low.

[LaFireEducator]

The meaningless, out of touch, minority, when faced with overwhelming proof that they are such have no recourse but to attack a nationally recognized fire service leader.

Thanks LA, once again you have sunk to another new low.

I disagreed with a statement by a nationally recognized figure.

Maybe to you he is a leader, but there are many of us who do not consider him as such.

In addition, there is a big difference between attacking the man and disagreeing his statements. Again, in his world, he may have both the need and the resources to put aggressiveness ahead of safety. In the world of the majority of the firefighters in the US, that need seldom exists and often the resources exist even more seldom.

In my combo world, the need rarely exists but the resources are often sufficient for the scale of incidents we respond to. It's simply a matter of taking the risks only when there is a measurable gain, not just because "it's our job" like the LT seems to feel should be the case.

I disagree. Risk should be taken when there is a reason, not just because we're the fire department

In my volunteer world, often extinguishment before safety is downright dangerous.

[SPFDRum]

I disagreed with a statement by a nationally recognized figure.

No, your exact quote;

"not on what cracked LT from the FDNY says."

That was more like a baseless attack.

[DeputyChiefGonzo]

Channeling the late Johnny Carson as Karnak the Magnificent...

"That was another thread and doesn't count here"

Question: what phrase will LA Bobby use to backpedal from this thread!

[mtg55]

I disagreed with a statement by a nationally recognized figure.

Maybe to you he is a leader, but there are many of us who do not consider him as such.

In addition, there is a big difference between attacking the man and disagreeing his statements. Again, in his world, he may have both the need and the resources to put aggressiveness ahead of safety. In the world of the majority of the firefighters in the US, that need seldom exists and often the resources exist even more seldom.

In my combo world, the need rarely exists but the resources are often sufficient for the scale of incidents we respond to. It's simply a matter of taking the risks only when there is a measurable gain, not just because "it's our job" like the LT seems to feel should be the case.

I disagree. Risk should be taken when there is a reason, not just because we're the fire department

In my volunteer world, often extinguishment before safety is downright dangerous.

LA, for the love of god, just shut up. If you have nothing constructive to say, go play in traffic. I've attempted to support you here and there and have done nothing but made a fool of my self for my efforts. Your post here in this thread, along with most others and as far as i can tell your mindset has no bearing or relevance on anything discussed IN THIS THREAD. Don't go away mad, just go away.

[ChiefKN]

Its a firefighter thing, you wouldn't understand.

[LaFireEducator]

LA, for the love of god, just shut up. If you have nothing constructive to say, go play in traffic. I've attempted to support you here and there and have done nothing but made a fool of my self for my efforts. Your post here in this thread, along with most others and as far as i can tell your mindset has no bearing or relevance on anything discussed IN THIS THREAD. Don't go away mad, just go away.

But that is why I do post.

There seems to be a mindset among some of the posters here that unless a firefighter operates in a way that they feel a firefighter should operate, they don't recognize them as a "firefighter". Unfortunately McCormack's attitude of aggressiveness and extinguishment before safety seems to be the mantra for this group.

The fact is there are many firefighters in this country that as just as "real" as "McCormacks's firefighters" who will rarely if ever operate interior, and should get the same respect for that they do, and have the exact same title, without question, as any other firefighter in this country.

That last line of his quote sums up the disrespect they seem to get from him, as well as some of the posters here.

[Rescue101]

I disagreed with a statement by a nationally recognized figure.

Maybe to you he is a leader, but there are many of us who do not consider him as such.

In addition, there is a big difference between attacking the man and disagreeing his statements. Again, in his world, he may have both the need and the resources to put aggressiveness ahead of safety. In the world of the majority of the firefighters in the US, that need seldom exists and often the resources exist even more seldom.

In my combo world, the need rarely exists but the resources are often sufficient for the scale of incidents we respond to. It's simply a matter of taking the risks only when there is a measurable gain, not just because "it's our job" like the LT seems to feel should be the case.

I disagree. Risk should be taken when there is a reason, not just because we're the fire department

In my volunteer world, often extinguishment before safety is downright dangerous.

"MANY" of us? How about a VERY SMALL FEW? Like YOU? Like I said EARLIER,could you be bothered to attend one of Ray's classes you MIGHT just LEARN something. The man is FAR from suicidal. But he KNOWS how to deal with FIRE. T.C.

[LaFireEducator]

"MANY" of us? How about a VERY SMALL FEW? Like YOU? Like I said EARLIER,could you be bothered to attend one of Ray's classes you MIGHT just LEARN something. The man is FAR from suicidal. But he KNOWS how to deal with FIRE. T.C.

Never said he was suicidal.

The fact is however his world is very different from my world, in terms of occupancies and hazards, resources, averafe training and experience and water supply.

He is operating in a world with different parameters, therefore his idea of accepatable risk and an attackable fire is much different from mine, and certainly most of the departments in this area of the state.

Whikle there may be things I could learn from him, there is very little that would apply to either my combo, or especially my volunteer operations. Without that relevance, attending a class of his would likely be pointless.

[LaFireEducator]

Channeling the late Johnny Carson as Karnak the Magnificent...

"That was another thread and doesn't count here"

Question: what phrase will LA Bobby use to backpedal from this thread!

Did I call him cracked? Yes. And I will admit that may have been over the top.

But my point remains as he seems to be saying that unless you are aggressive, you are a wimp. He does not seem to recognize the conditions that exist outside of the NYC area that legitimatly prevent departmens from being aggressive.

Maybe out of touch with rural realities would have been a better choice of words.