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Video Shot by Ga. Firefighter Angers Crash Victim's Family

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  • #16
    That's a common misconception. For HIPAA to apply you must:

    1. Bill patients...
    2. ...through insurance companies or insurance clearinghouses...
    3. ...and you must do it electronically (that doesn't include fax, BTW)

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    • #17
      Here Is more info on who is actually covered by HIPAA.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by blaster668 View Post
        That's a common misconception. For HIPAA to apply you must:

        1. Bill patients...
        2. ...through insurance companies or insurance clearinghouses...
        3. ...and you must do it electronically (that doesn't include fax, BTW)
        Ok, looks like you got me. Down here 99.9% of fire departments run EMS transport so we are all governed by HIPPA, sometimes I forget no everyone does it to!
        If your going to cry about doing the job you signed up for do us all a favor and quit, there are plenty of dedicated people standing in line for the best job in the world.

        Lieutenant

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        • #19
          A local news site here solicits input from its followers - especially photos. If the guy who runs the site is on the ball, a picture of an event may be on line before responders even arrive.

          For a while, providers seemed to be sending some MVA pictures in, but the novelty mostly wore off. It was also pointed out to responders (as well as the news) that in many cases the victims may not have been pictured, but other identifying factors (including license plate numbers) were usually visible. That meant that a family member may receive "notification" that their loved one was involved in an accident before officials (or other family members) could contact them.

          With a heavily deployed military base in the area, the problem became that much larger, as deployed members could be seeing such images.

          If I have the time, I might shoot stuff for later reference in training, but you're not going to see it in a bar, or even on the web. That's what the news people do.
          Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

          Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

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          • #20
            I couldn't find my last posting concerning HIPAA and video/picture taking. But to reiterate, it is against HIPAA's laws to record, or take pictures, of an individual without written permission. This also includes the deceased.

            Everybody pretty much has the basic HIPAA rules concerning the treatment of patient records according to their law. But, there is another law, a simple law.

            RIGHT OF PRIVACY !!!!!

            HIPAA is one of the laws that I would think you guys would respect and appreciate as it protects the rights of the individual’s privacy. Essentially, the law asserts that a patient’s right to privacy is still protected even if they are receiving emergency medical care in a public place. The patient’s right to privacy trumps the public’s right to videotape or take pictures. Just because you can’t find the text of the law that states that you cannot, then go ahead, by all means. Hopefully you have some deep pockets to pay the fines.

            Is it really that hard to remember it is "HIPAA", and not "HIPPA"???

            FM1
            I'm the one Fire and Rescue calls, when they need to be Rescued.

            Originally posted by EastKyFF
            "Firemens gets antsies. Theys wants to goes to fires. Sometimeses they haves to waits."

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            • #21
              This makes me very mad. Like said before, it is very sad to think we actually have to have policies against behavior like this. Like putting the words "CAUTION, HOT" on the side of a McDonalds coffee cup.

              The firefighter who took the pictures should be fired. The firefighter who spread the pictures to everyone should be just shy of being fired like suspension for several days.

              This is not only illegal but highly morally wrong and against everything a firefighter stands for.
              Jason Knecht
              Firefighter/EMT
              Township Fire Dept., Inc.
              Eau Claire, WI

              IACOJ - Director of Cheese and Whine
              http://www.cheddarvision.tv/
              EAT CHEESE OR DIE!!

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              • #22
                Originally posted by FIREMECH1 View Post
                I couldn't find my last posting concerning HIPAA and video/picture taking. But to reiterate, it is against HIPAA's laws to record, or take pictures, of an individual without written permission. This also includes the deceased.

                Everybody pretty much has the basic HIPAA rules concerning the treatment of patient records according to their law. But, there is another law, a simple law.

                RIGHT OF PRIVACY !!!!!

                HIPAA is one of the laws that I would think you guys would respect and appreciate as it protects the rights of the individual’s privacy. Essentially, the law asserts that a patient’s right to privacy is still protected even if they are receiving emergency medical care in a public place. The patient’s right to privacy trumps the public’s right to videotape or take pictures. Just because you can’t find the text of the law that states that you cannot, then go ahead, by all means. Hopefully you have some deep pockets to pay the fines.

                Is it really that hard to remember it is "HIPAA", and not "HIPPA"???

                FM1
                Please cite the law that prohibits a "non electronic billing" entity from taking pictures or releasing ANY patient information when in the public. I'm not saying it is moral or ethical, just in most cases it is not illegal. Now in a persons home, it is a very different situation.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by blaster668 View Post
                  Please cite the law that prohibits a "non electronic billing" entity from taking pictures or releasing ANY patient information when in the public. I'm not saying it is moral or ethical, just in most cases it is not illegal. Now in a persons home, it is a very different situation.
                  You do have me wondering how all this 'melds' with "no reasonable expectation of privacy" when something occurs in public.
                  All Pit Bulls are not bad dogs. All bad dogs are not Pit Bulls.

                  Resist ignorance. Educate - Inspire.
                  www.badrap.org

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Firemedic 61 View Post
                    Ok, looks like you got me. Down here 99.9% of fire departments run EMS transport so we are all governed by HIPPA, sometimes I forget no everyone does it to!
                    Im fairly sure that statistic is very inaccurate unless my departments and many I think of are in the .1%!

                    Edit- I re-read your post and apologize I first read it without the "down here"

                    That may be the case, but I still don't think it applies to HIPAA. Regardless of whether it does or not, swift actions from the department need to happen to both firefighters. As other firefighters and officers we need to be aware that many of our members now have this capability whether it be video on a cell phone or pictures on facebook and work to make sure this does not wind up continuing to happen!
                    Last edited by SRLFD448; 10-19-2010, 03:36 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      And yet the article plainly states:

                      While investigators don't believe recording the video or sharing it broke any laws.....
                      Is it distasteful? Sure, but fire someone for being distasteful and you'd have to fire the entire department.

                      Sure, the parents are ****ed off, but anything that can be viewed from a public place can be photographed. Car crashes happen in public places.

                      Not necessarily condoning this particular event, but that is the legality of it.
                      Last edited by MemphisE34a; 10-19-2010, 06:39 PM.
                      RK
                      cell #901-494-9437

                      Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

                      "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


                      Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

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                      • #26
                        Made Nancy grace tonight 10/19
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZdEH...e_gdata_player

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by fire49 View Post
                          Made Nancy grace tonight 10/19
                          I just came across it on the show. She's a wackjob, and they are throwing all kinds of extra drama into the situation. Actually aired the audio from the video that was taken.
                          Career Firefighter
                          Volunteer Captain

                          -Professional in Either Role-

                          Originally posted by Rescue101
                          I don't mind fire rolling over my head. I just don't like it rolling UNDER my a**.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by MemphisE34a View Post
                            Is it distasteful? Sure, but fire someone for being distasteful and you'd have to fire the entire department.

                            Sure, the parents are ****ed off, but anything that can be viewed from a public place can be photographed. Car crashes happen in public places.

                            Not necessarily condoning this particular event, but that is the legality of it.
                            I think this incident goes way beyond distasteful.

                            I can't speak to the laws in that state. Hell, I won't claim to be knowledgable about the laws in my state...

                            However, I'm sure this was a crime scene. Certainly, an active police investigation.

                            These firefighters were acting in an official capacity and acted inappropriately by sharing these videos. Maybe even filming them.

                            I'd like to see a prosecutor make an attempt in this case.
                            I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

                            "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

                            "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by ChiefKN View Post

                              I'd like to see a prosecutor make an attempt in this case.
                              Again, please cite ANY law that was broken in this case? I'm not saying there isn't a violation of some law in the state that this occurred, but you can not have prosecutors "make an attempt" if there is no violation. Possibly a audio recording law was broken, as in many states it's illegal to record audio without consent.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by ChiefKN View Post
                                I can't speak to the laws in that state. Hell, I won't claim to be knowledgable about the laws in my state...

                                However, I'm sure this was a crime scene.
                                And there in lies the problem. No offense Chief, but it sounds like your line between reality and CSI Miami is getting a little blurred.
                                RK
                                cell #901-494-9437

                                Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

                                "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


                                Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

                                Comment

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