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Video Shot by Ga. Firefighter Angers Crash Victim's Family

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  • Video Shot by Ga. Firefighter Angers Crash Victim's Family

    http://www.firehouse.com/news/top-he...victims-family

    Is this another wake up call and yet another reason to ban any pictures and videos taken at scenes? Hopefully the firefighter did violate a written policy so he can be FIRED. And what a disgrace the other members are for passing this video around at a local bar, which ended up being sent to the victim's family.

  • #2
    Wow, this is really sad for the parents and to think that someday her children might see it. It's nothing new though...reminiscent of all the bloody, gory footage from driver education courses.
    Last edited by Lisa2000GT; 10-18-2010, 01:13 PM.
    All Pit Bulls are not bad dogs. All bad dogs are not Pit Bulls.

    Resist ignorance. Educate - Inspire.
    www.badrap.org

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    • #3
      Originally posted by erics99 View Post
      http://www.firehouse.com/news/top-he...victims-family

      Is this another wake up call and yet another reason to ban any pictures and videos taken at scenes? Hopefully the firefighter did violate a written policy so he can be FIRED. And what a disgrace the other members are for passing this video around at a local bar, which ended up being sent to the victim's family.
      Immediate dismissal of both firefighters. The one who originally shot the video and the one who shared it in the bar.

      I think a case could easily be made for a violation of patient privacy, maybe even a HIPPA violation since they shared pictures and dicscussed the victim with others besides emergency responders.

      The behvaior of these 2 firefighters is despicable.
      Last edited by FyredUp; 11-01-2010, 02:11 PM.
      Crazy, but that's how it goes
      Millions of people living as foes
      Maybe it's not too late
      To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Lisa2000GT View Post
        Wow, this is really sad for the parents and to think that someday her children might see it. It's nothing new though...reminiscent of all the bloody, gory footage from driver education courses.
        Really? You see this as a comparison to that? A local firefighter takes a video of a dead local victim and then shares it with people and you see that no differently than a driver's ed video?

        If I were her parents I would be looking for a VERY GOOD lawyer and suing those firefighters and the fire department and the county for invasion of privacy and a possible HIPPA violation.

        There is simply no excuse for this behavior. There is no practical training usage of it and if that was their excuse it is entirely blown when they share it with the public.
        Crazy, but that's how it goes
        Millions of people living as foes
        Maybe it's not too late
        To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

        Comment


        • #5
          Taking that video for critique and training, fine. Sending it out to all your buddies and exhibitting at the local bar, totally unacceptable and I'd punch him myself for being such a idiot. If you can't control your SEND button, then keep the phone in your pocket.
          Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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          • #6
            Well, this is totaly out of line. We do in fact have written policies against using cell phones on scene to take pictures or video.

            That being said, I don't know if it could be a HIPPA violation. The article didn't mention if they said her name or any other personal info in the video.
            Career Firefighter
            Volunteer Captain

            -Professional in Either Role-

            Originally posted by Rescue101
            I don't mind fire rolling over my head. I just don't like it rolling UNDER my a**.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by nmfire View Post
              Taking that video for critique and training, fine. Sending it out to all your buddies and exhibitting at the local bar, totally unacceptable and I'd punch him myself for being such a idiot. If you can't control your SEND button, then keep the phone in your pocket.
              I hear you on the training video, but disagree.

              We don't need to video or shoot any fatal scenes.

              The jokers that did this should be dismissed. I only wish there was a criminal violation that covered this activity... official misconduct??? Something.
              I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

              "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

              "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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              • #8
                Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                Really? You see this as a comparison to that? A local firefighter takes a video of a dead local victim and then shares it with people and you see that no differently than a driver's ed video?

                If I were her parents I would be looking for a VERY GOOD lawyer and suing those firefighters and the fire department and the county for invasion of privacy and a possible HIPPA violation.

                There is simply no excuse for this behavior. There is no practical training usage of it and if that was their excuse it is entirely blown when they share it with the public.
                Yes and no. I am in no way excusing the actions of those firefighters. I don't advocate what they did. But taking footage at crash or fire scenes is nothing new, that's all I stated. I understand from the necessity to document for investigation, for anything further I don't like. I don't know that the 'dead' victims from the 1960s in "Mechanized Death" and such 'shock' documentaries have been any more or less disrespected than this victim, just that stuff gets around a lot more and a lot faster in today's technology.

                Passing such video around at a bar...insensitive, stupid, crass, unprofessional, ...you name it...just plain WRONG, I agree. Apparently, according to news reports, not illegal.
                Last edited by Lisa2000GT; 10-18-2010, 02:28 PM.
                All Pit Bulls are not bad dogs. All bad dogs are not Pit Bulls.

                Resist ignorance. Educate - Inspire.
                www.badrap.org

                Comment


                • #9
                  This is why, sad as it is, we need to have policies in place before stupid crap like this stuff happens. Short of an official policy, these idiots probably can't be disciplined at the level this calls for.

                  I like something along the lines of this: "Any picture, video, audio or media of anytime recorded at the scene of any incident where the recording member is considered on duty or covered by the city in any manner, including allowance to be within the work zone, is the property of the XXX FD. Any dissemination or showing of this media without the express permission of the Fire Chief is prohibited." Basically you shoot, I own it. If you're anything but a bystander, your video is the property of the Dept. for which you are working. I'd further recommend that dissemination of images and videos of any emergency scene by individuals is potentially grounds for conduct unbecoming. We generally are trusted more the LEO's, this type of BS serves only to diminish the publics' trust.
                  Last edited by RFDACM02; 10-18-2010, 02:35 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by GTRider245 View Post
                    That being said, I don't know if it could be a HIPPA violation. The article didn't mention if they said her name or any other personal info in the video.
                    One of the misconceptions about HIPPA is that a violation has to include a name. The main criteria is the inclusion of ANY personally identifiable information.

                    If the video showed a dead female passenger in her early 20's in a 1995 yellow Ford Mustang (car info purely hypothetical here), then that can easily be enough to be used to clearly identify the victim.

                    Not a legal analysis by any means, but just a thought to keep in mind. It takes a lot less than a name to identify somebody in a picture or a video.
                    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                      Really? You see this as a comparison to that? A local firefighter takes a video of a dead local victim and then shares it with people and you see that no differently than a driver's ed video?

                      If I were her parents I would be looking for a VERY GOOD lawyer and suing those firefighters and the fire department and the county for invasion of privacy and a possible HIPPA violation.

                      There is simply no excuse for this behavior. There is no practical training usage of it and if that was their excuse it is entirely blown when they share it with the public.

                      I am in no way saying that this is acceptable, but I do NOT think this would be a HIPAA violation. Many people have misinterpreted HIPAA, it actually only applies to services that bill insurance companies. So if your fire department does not bill for medical calls, then you are exempt from HIPAA. There very well may be other patient privacy laws in effect in your local though.
                      Last edited by blaster668; 10-18-2010, 03:54 PM.

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                      • #12
                        People never cease to amaze me

                        I've seen plenty of pictures of serious accidents sent between fire & EMS folks just to share the "holy $#%&" factor... but they generally don't include people and they certainly don't involve video of fatalities where the person with the camera solicits help so they can better record the gore that they're looking at!

                        I think someone should drop the hammer on these guys. Even without a department policy against cameras (very hard to enforce in 2010), it is most certainly conduct unbecoming... But even as important as the discipline, I think these guys need counseling.

                        There is a sometimes an emotional disconnect between firemen and the people we serve -- and there has to be (to a certain degree) for our own mental health. But when you have members who are doing their best to get all of the gore recorded on video and then they share with members of the general public -- you're dealing with people who are in a very unhealthy place mentally.
                        sigpic

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                          If I were her parents I would be looking for a VERY GOOD lawyer and suing those firefighters and the fire department and the county for invasion of privacy and a possible HIPPA violation.
                          100% HIPPA violation. A captain at Palm Beach County was fired last year for taking pics of people at a MVC and putting them on, I believe, Facebook.

                          Originally posted by RFDACM02 View Post
                          This is why, sad as it is, we need to have policies in place before stupid crap like this stuff happens. Short of an official policy, these idiots probably can't be disciplined at the level this calls for.
                          The moron who took and then shared the video can be disciplined under HIPPA. He can then be sued civilly by the family. The guy who showed it at the bar will probably just get another piece of paper in his file since he didn't actually take the video.
                          If your going to cry about doing the job you signed up for do us all a favor and quit, there are plenty of dedicated people standing in line for the best job in the world.

                          Lieutenant

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Firemedic 61 View Post
                            100% HIPPA violation. A captain at Palm Beach County was fired last year for taking pics of people at a MVC and putting them on, I believe, Facebook.



                            The moron who took and then shared the video can be disciplined under HIPPA. He can then be sued civilly by the family. The guy who showed it at the bar will probably just get another piece of paper in his file since he didn't actually take the video.
                            I would not say that with certainty..... HIPAA actually does not even apply to most firefighters.
                            Last edited by blaster668; 10-18-2010, 03:51 PM.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by blaster668 View Post
                              I would not say that with certainty..... HIPPA actually does not even apply to most firefighters.
                              It does if they are providing medical care.
                              If your going to cry about doing the job you signed up for do us all a favor and quit, there are plenty of dedicated people standing in line for the best job in the world.

                              Lieutenant

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