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  • Catch22
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain Easyrider View Post
    Well Catch were going to have to agree to disagree. It is obvious to me that being from an urban dept. somehow upsets you.
    You can make up any scenarios to focus this discussion to your viewpoint. As I have said before cameras that are used for the proper purpose are fine, but In my experience someone will take that snapshot in time and twist it to their liking.
    PEACE
    I have no problem with urban departments, except when people try to use their employment at one as some form of stature.

    Leave a comment:


  • Captain Easyrider
    replied
    Originally posted by Catch22 View Post
    Good for you and your urban city. I'm willing to bet there are still instances where a 20 year driver can intimidate a brand new officer and is able to violatte the rules. At the same time, I'm willing to bet there are instances when even a seasoned captain looks the other way. It's the nature of the beast, and can be expected. One of the benefits of a camera system such is this is that it backs up the officer and gives him some reinforcement when he says "slow down".
    Well Catch were going to have to agree to disagree. It is obvious to me that being from an urban dept. somehow upsets you.
    You can make up any scenarios to focus this discussion to your viewpoint. As I have said before cameras that are used for the proper purpose are fine, but In my experience someone will take that snapshot in time and twist it to their liking.
    PEACE

    Leave a comment:


  • Catch22
    replied
    Originally posted by NakedTillerman25 View Post
    Camera's= BAD JUJU in the Firehouse or the Firetruck. PG Put them in all county owned units and any newer Volunteer Owned units a while back....I like to hit the panic button on them and give a one-fingered salute to the Management of the PGFEMSD
    And there is a prime example of the immaturity and irresponsibility that leads to cameras being used for enforcement of policy.

    Leave a comment:


  • Catch22
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain Easyrider View Post
    Firemedic and catch22 I must be missing something here. from what I see here you have no confidence in your officers. That is truly sad. Where I am from many things are taken care of at the company level, and does not move up the chain of command unnesecarily, which in the world of documenting you can not do, once it's documented it moves up the chain.
    I'll let firemedic handle his own, but at no time have I said such a thing. Cameras just ensure that the officer is doing their job. If they are doing their job, it also helps them when it hits the fan, particularly if there's voice. Recordings like the one mentioned before, or on a video I use in driver training of an ambulance of a guy telling his driver several times "red light" reinforce the officer was trying to do his job and takes the liability off of them.

    Regardless, the very fact that there are any number of apparatus accidents, particularly in apparatus owned by career departments where there's typically an officer in the front right seat, shows that there are officers and drivers out there not doing their job by ensuring the safety of both their crew and the public.

    I have been an fortunate to be an officer for a long time in a large urban city. I would not say our drivers are better than where you are from, but I will say as fact that most problems are taken care of before you are even certified to drive.
    Now if you look back, I have never stated that cameras are bad if they are used properly and for the right reasons. look back at my post on the gps debacle I was in.
    PEACE
    Good for you and your urban city. I'm willing to bet there are still instances where a 20 year driver can intimidate a brand new officer and is able to violatte the rules. At the same time, I'm willing to bet there are instances when even a seasoned captain looks the other way. It's the nature of the beast, and can be expected. One of the benefits of a camera system such is this is that it backs up the officer and gives him some reinforcement when he says "slow down".

    Leave a comment:


  • BoxAlarm187
    replied
    Originally posted by NakedTillerman25 View Post
    BoxAlarm187, I see you are from Virginia....are you part of a COG Jurisdiction?
    Nope, south of there. Spend a lot of time in 'em though. Hell, I was in gorgeous Prince George's today in fact.

    Leave a comment:


  • L-Webb
    replied
    Originally posted by NakedTillerman25 View Post
    Yeah, I like to think so...if I am going to be treated like a Child that needs to be babysat all the time, I might as well act like one. BoxAlarm187, I see you are from Virginia....are you part of a COG Jurisdiction?
    I'm glad we have guys like you to set the example for the rest of us.

    Leave a comment:


  • Acklan
    replied
    Originally posted by NakedTillerman25 View Post
    Yeah, I like to think so...if I am going to be treated like a Child that needs to be babysat all the time, I might as well act like one. BoxAlarm187, I see you are from Virginia....are you part of a COG Jurisdiction?
    Or maybe your being treated like a child because you act like one.

    Leave a comment:


  • NakedTillerman25
    replied
    Yeah, I like to think so...if I am going to be treated like a Child that needs to be babysat all the time, I might as well act like one. BoxAlarm187, I see you are from Virginia....are you part of a COG Jurisdiction?

    Leave a comment:


  • BoxAlarm187
    replied
    Originally posted by NakedTillerman25 View Post
    Camera's= BAD JUJU in the Firehouse or the Firetruck. PG Put them in all county owned units and any newer Volunteer Owned units a while back....I like to hit the panic button on them and give a one-fingered salute to the Management of the PGFEMSD
    Nice. Very mature of you.

    Leave a comment:


  • Acklan
    replied
    Originally posted by NakedTillerman25 View Post
    Camera's= BAD JUJU in the Firehouse or the Firetruck. PG Put them in all county owned units and any newer Volunteer Owned units a while back....I like to hit the panic button on them and give a one-fingered salute to the Management of the PGFEMSD
    And you wonder why they install the cameras to start with?

    Leave a comment:


  • NakedTillerman25
    replied
    Camera's= BAD JUJU in the Firehouse or the Firetruck. PG Put them in all county owned units and any newer Volunteer Owned units a while back....I like to hit the panic button on them and give a one-fingered salute to the Management of the PGFEMSD

    Leave a comment:


  • Rescue101
    replied
    Originally posted by The nots so new FNG View Post
    What is sad - you could probably benefit from having them to *prove* you aren't at fault at incidents.

    I see no issues with them - however they are mounted. Cmon, they can be mounted to window visors, the deck of the dash or any number of places. As an engineer - I would mount to a hardpoint and NOT to the glass. Its a better long term mount than a suction cup to make sure it stays where I want it.
    If I'm going to "benefit" from a camera,it will be a REAR vision version. We're not currently running over enough cars or having enough near misses to even begin thinking about EVENT cameras. That will be the NEXT Bosses job. Not needed HERE. T.C.

    Leave a comment:


  • FireMedic049
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain Easyrider View Post
    Firemedic and catch22 I must be missing something here. from what I see here you have no confidence in your officers. That is truly sad.
    Yeah, I think something is missing in translation. No, it's really not a confidence issue in my officers, in part because we're a small career department and we frequently don't have an actual officer on one or both apparatus.

    Where I am from many things are taken care of at the company level, and does not move up the chain of command unnesecarily, which in the world of documenting you can not do, once it's documented it moves up the chain.
    And that's where a lot of it should be taken care of. I was originally discussing the assertion that the cameras (specifically the drivecam style) somehow less the officer's role regarding the operation of the apparatus.

    I think what they do is pretty much the opposite. The officer should still be handling these driving "issues", however with video documentation that presumably is reviewed outside the company, the officer's accountability for handling the situation should be increased. The officer would no longer be in the position to "ignore" the problem because doing so would put them in a position to be "disciplined" if they didn't address it. Without the camera documentation, the brass may not know that a driving issue isn't being addressed - hence the increased accountability.


    Now if you look back, I have never stated that cameras are bad if they are used properly and for the right reasons. look back at my post on the gps debacle I was in.
    PEACE
    That's fine and I wasn't debating your view on the cameras themselves.

    Leave a comment:


  • DarkStarr
    replied
    Video? Sure. Sound? Nooope.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dickey
    replied
    Originally posted by rm1524 View Post
    I personally don't have a problem with a camera being on the truck. As far as I'm concerned it could be recording all the time. I don't have a problem with it for two reasons.

    1. The administration is wanting to protect their investment.

    2. Training. As an ex-captain I have had a talk with a engineer about his driving and he said could not remember or see a problem with how he was driving. With a camera on all that you have to do is download it and then you and the driver are not having to try and remember a certain part of the trip. As an engineer now I would like to be able to watch and see if there is anything I could be doing to be a better operator of the truck.

    I will be honest, the idea of having sound on a video is something that I would not like to see or hear. We talk about just about anything in the cab and what is talked about stays in the cab. It's kinda like a confessional.
    My thoughts exactly. I will add a 3rd....to keep the driver and crew honest with their actions.

    Leave a comment:

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