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  • cozmosis
    replied
    I wanna tell the world!

    Originally posted by len1582 View Post
    If I get a call from my Bn Chief telling me to do something like mentioned here, I will call the dispatcher and get a ticket for a service call. It will be a run and I will have the company out of service for the duration.
    It's rare for us be out of service for anything. I've left man a hoseman at a minor medical call to avoid abandonment & wait for the ambulance while two guys and the engine respond to a second run. So, we're definitely not going OOS for a service call.

    Anytime my company does work, it's a run. Why? Lots of reasons. Like Len, it covers the guys in case of injury. Also, it's necessary to paint a picture of the work the FD does for the community. It's nothing for 5-6% of our annual runs to be lift assists and other miscellaneous service calls. Some folks say those aren't "real" incidents. Wrong. They're all times when the city's investment in equipment and manpower were put to use to benefit the citizens. You don't want to keep that a secret.

    I can't speak for the larger cities... But the cops is most smaller cities and towns seem to record EVERYTHING as an incident -- including those drive-bys to investigate barking dog complaints. We should do no different. If the personnel or equipment go to work, it should be recorded and tracked so it can be shared with the citizens & elected officials. This is one of those areas where firefighters can be their own worst enemy because they keep everything they do a secret.

    Leave a comment:


  • snowball
    replied
    Originally posted by TheresOnlyone2 View Post
    Tenderloin, Since you didn't mind dropping SFFD's name in this thread, would you mind telling us which department YOU worked for and how they would handle the same situation ? Just curious.
    TheresOnlyone2
    I'd be interested to know that.

    Oh, and by the way. When did this forum adopt the "You don't ask those kinds of questions, you're a newbie" attitude. Really? Oh I better listen to that guy, he has a lot of posts in here. C'mon.

    Leave a comment:


  • Weruj1
    replied
    Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
    In service, delayed response, due to a PR event.
    yep thats us !!!!!!!!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • TheresOnlyone2
    replied
    Tenderloin, Since you didn't mind dropping SFFD's name in this thread, would you mind telling us which department YOU worked for and how they would handle the same situation ? Just curious.
    TheresOnlyone2

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    We don't designate it anything... if its got a crew, they will take the ladder down and respond.

    If it doesn't have a crew (operator hanging xmas lights at the library for the Kiwanis club..etc). Then it will go back to the firehouse and crew up.

    This is a really stupid topic, I have to say.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Originally posted by nyckftbl View Post
    when the hell did I hit 2000 posts? lol
    You can always tell the guys who aren't allowed to talk at home....

    Leave a comment:


  • Rescue101
    replied
    Originally posted by Tenderloin View Post
    You've asked why I think it is crazy to have Independent fire stations within a big City F.D. from carrying out good will actions without the knowledge of a central authority?

    "As long as they're in district and in service, what's crazy about it?"

    On several of the comments above, firefighters have said that they check around with nearby units to see what's going on before they would raise an aerial in a non-emergency situation.

    A wise practice.

    Potentially, with all this good will going on in Frisco, and no central approval, two or three neigboring units could have a delayed response of three-five minutes, perhaps two of them in the same district.

    You not understanding that is as mystifying to me as you not understanding my failure to understand "in the district what's the problem" theory.

    I'm not claiming this is issue # 1 in America today. I am saying that professional firefighting isn't just about attacking the seat of the fire; it is also about what is taking place before the fire breaks out. Like training;
    care of equipment; maintaining first alarm assignments; none of that is
    headline material but it is important in the overall effectiveness of a F.D.
    I'm sure we can cordially agree to disagree.
    Can't speak for SFFD. Around here ALL apparatus movements and details are radioed in to Dispatch. The Bosses USUALLY have prior notification of routine requests for service or details. Line officers CAN make emergency arrangements as needed to accomodate the rare "emergency" detail. worked well here for many,many years. T.c.

    Leave a comment:


  • emt161
    replied
    At the department in my hometown, the fire alarm line crew bucket truck does it....

    Leave a comment:


  • len1582
    replied
    Originally posted by Tenderloin View Post
    A member of the Truck Co crew was also a member of the Church. The entire deal was facilitated only by the Truck Co.

    The SFFD says "We are known for our emergency responses but are always willing to help our neighbors in any way. Many times these requests are done through the local Fire Stations."
    We'll also assist with local issues from within the house or battalion. I have no problem with that. I'll call our dispatcher and tell him to give up a ticket for a Service Call. It's the other stuff that annoys me. Like getting sent to a block party that actually turns out to be a rally for some council person running for re-election.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tenderloin
    replied
    In Service Out

    Deputy:

    Would you mind telling me the response goals of the Fire Department you are most familiar with?

    The City of San Jose, CA has over a million people. It's a big City.

    There stated response goal:
    "We would put ourselves out of service. From the time of alarm, our goal is to have a response time of 5 minutes 90% of the time."

    _________________
    "Worry about rise in FDNY response time

    BY PAUL H.B. SHIN
    The Fire Department's average response time to building fires in Queens increased by three seconds last year to four minutes and 58 seconds — a backslide that has some anxious Queens residents seeing red.
    But borough-by-borough figures released last week show that Queens trailed the citywide average by 31 seconds — an agonizing eternity when it comes to fighting a blaze.
    ___________________

    Do you think our problem of understanding one another (i.e. agreeing with) is a case of the different standards set, due to the different factors involved between the conditions and availability of equipment, of a large City as compared to a smaller one?

    Leave a comment:


  • DeputyMarshal
    replied
    Originally posted by Tenderloin View Post
    You've asked why I think it is crazy to have Independent fire stations within a big City F.D. from carrying out good will actions without the knowledge of a central authority?
    It's called not micromanaging. The notion that a company should have to ask permission or even notify HQ every time a stick is put in the air is absurd. Companies have officers and SOPs to make those routine local decisions.

    A wise practice.
    An unnecessary practice unless the stick is going to be unavailable for an unusual length of time.

    Potentially, with all this good will going on in Frisco, and no central approval, two or three neigboring units could have a delayed response of three-five minutes, perhaps two of them in the same district.
    There is central approval. That approval apparently permits the local officer's judgement to prevail.

    Potentially, two or three neighboring crews could all decide to take a dump at the same time creating a delayed response. Should they coordinate bowel movements with HQ to insure that the all take turns?

    Leave a comment:


  • Tenderloin
    replied
    In Service Out of Service

    You've asked why I think it is crazy to have Independent fire stations within a big City F.D. from carrying out good will actions without the knowledge of a central authority?

    "As long as they're in district and in service, what's crazy about it?"

    On several of the comments above, firefighters have said that they check around with nearby units to see what's going on before they would raise an aerial in a non-emergency situation.

    A wise practice.

    Potentially, with all this good will going on in Frisco, and no central approval, two or three neigboring units could have a delayed response of three-five minutes, perhaps two of them in the same district.

    You not understanding that is as mystifying to me as you not understanding my failure to understand "in the district what's the problem" theory.

    I'm not claiming this is issue # 1 in America today. I am saying that professional firefighting isn't just about attacking the seat of the fire; it is also about what is taking place before the fire breaks out. Like training;
    care of equipment; maintaining first alarm assignments; none of that is
    headline material but it is important in the overall effectiveness of a F.D.
    I'm sure we can cordially agree to disagree.

    Leave a comment:


  • DeputyMarshal
    replied
    Originally posted by Tenderloin View Post
    Now again, I'm an old goat but that practice of having 35 or 45 firehouses doing good deeds, while a headquarters is in the dark, is just crazy.
    As long as they're in district and in service, what's crazy about it? You still sound like you've got an axe to grind.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tenderloin
    replied
    "In Service Out of Service"

    Len1582 - thanks for this:

    "I also agree. But it's not our responsibility to maintain adequate fire protection to the city. It's the administration's responsibility to maintain sufficient numbers in the field. If we're unavailable for a fire around the corner from my firehouse because we're on some public relations detail, it's not my fault."

    In my example about the banner, would you be surprised that Headquarters
    of the Fire Dept. in San Francisco, was unaware that the Truck Co. was providing this service to the Church. Nor was Dispatch. No written request was needed.

    A member of the Truck Co crew was also a member of the Church. The entire deal was facilitated only by the Truck Co.

    The SFFD says "We are known for our emergency responses but are always willing to help our neighbors in any way. Many times these requests are done through the local Fire Stations."

    Now again, I'm an old goat but that practice of having 35 or 45 firehouses doing good deeds, while a headquarters is in the dark, is just crazy.

    Leave a comment:


  • len1582
    replied
    Originally posted by FIREMECH1 View Post
    I see Tenderloins point. But I don't see where putting it out of service is being responsible to the general public's safety.FM1
    I also agree. But it's not our responsibility to maintain adequate fire protection to the city. It's the administration's responsibility to maintain sufficient numbers in the field. If we're unavailable for a fire around the corner from my firehouse because we're on some public relations detail, it's not my fault.
    Our responsibility is to keep each other safe as possible despite their cuts.

    Originally posted by BoxAlarm187 View Post
    ..... We only have an incident started for, well, incidents....whereas it appears to be commonplace with JCFD.

    Regardless, I'm not taking my company out of service for something like this, nor would my BC approve of such.
    We make it an incident for two main reasons. First, as I mentioned above, is liability. If someone gets hurt I want to ensure there's no issue with someone saying it wasn't an authorized call so we shouldn't have been doing whatever it was when the injury occured. "The business administrator is not your friend". Second, it's showing an additional run. Productivity...sort of.

    As far as the BC. Just about all of these 'requests' go to him from the Deputy Chief who got a call from the Chief of Dept or usually the Directors office (pollitical appointment). As a company officer I have no choice but to eat the crap spooned down to me. All I can do is take care of my guys.
    Last edited by len1582; 10-15-2010, 05:30 PM.

    Leave a comment:

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