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Fire Departments & Rising Energy Costs

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  • yjbrody64
    replied
    Howsabout we equip all of our apparatus with larger tires in the back and smaller tires in the front. That way no matter where we drive, we will always be going downhill. Driving downhill requires less fuel and saving fuel will save money.

    I bet an experienced chauffer could probably coast from the station to the scene or wherever they are having lunch (as long as it's in district of course).

    Done!

    Leave a comment:


  • hwoods
    replied
    Yeaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......... ........

    Originally posted by voyager9 View Post

    Of course, if we could harness all the hot air in these forums all our energy problems would be solved.

    DING! DING! HOLD YOUR CARDS, WE HAVE A BINGO!!!......

    Leave a comment:


  • voyager9
    replied
    Originally posted by Bones42 View Post
    As long as the truck generator is running, the truck has power. As long as the truck has power, the generator can continue running.
    In this house, we obey the laws of thermodynamics!

    Of course, if we could harness all the hot air in these forums all our energy problems would be solved.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bones42
    replied
    Actually, you only need electric service to get the truck started. Once it's running, it's own PTO generator can supply the needed electric to the truck itself. And there you go.....

    As long as the truck generator is running, the truck has power. As long as the truck has power, the generator can continue running.

    Leave a comment:


  • KuhShise
    replied
    Alternative energy sources

    One of the items already touched upon, (control of energy pricing) is quite apparent at the present time. According to nearly all of current economic models, as the amount of a commocity increases, there should be a reduction in price. The current natural gas situation and the huge potential supply discovered in the Marcellus Shale layer is defying the economic model because of manipulation by both our government, (extraction tax threats) and the energy producers. This will be an interesting experiment in extracting $ from your wallet and lining politicians and energy companies bottom lines.
    For those of you blessed with hydranted systems... The great problem with solar energy is that it is only available when the sun shines. Imagine huge elevated water storage reservoirs that get filled during the daylight hours, and are available as energy sources 24 hours a day. Hooking to a hydrant with a 20" main could supply 4,000 gpm at say 50 psi. Running 1/2 of this water through a turbine to drive a high pressure pump for firefighting water would be an easy solution to your percieved problem.

    Leave a comment:


  • nmfire
    replied
    Originally posted by nameless View Post
    thats exactly it, I've never been to a fire. Good observation. Maybe if you're real nice I'll let you smell my gear and you can fantasize about being a fireman.
    ooooh. I'm so hurt. You can call names and point out how special you are all your want. You're still wrong and there isn't a single thing you can say to change that. I and others have explained in great detail why, and you're only digging your hole deeper by continuing to defend it.

    Leave a comment:


  • nameless
    replied
    Originally posted by nmfire View Post
    I stand by my previous comment that you've obviously never actually been to a working fire if you actually think what i said is idiotic. You clearly have no concept of how electricity, electric motors, and power distrobution work. Please stop trying to shoot down logic and fact with "neh neh your an idiot".

    thats exactly it, I've never been to a fire. Good observation. Maybe if you're real nice I'll let you smell my gear and you can fantasize about being a fireman.

    Leave a comment:


  • rm1524
    replied
    Originally posted by engineeremtp View Post
    If cafs can put out fire 5 - 7 x faster with 5 - 7 x less water I would say you would need less engine run time on scene and less tankers shuttling water from scene to fill site. Makes sense to me.
    It works better when you shuttle water from the fill site to the scene. Alot of departments are running trucks that was made long before CAFS was an idea.

    Leave a comment:


  • engineeremtp
    replied
    Cafs

    If cafs can put out fire 5 - 7 x faster with 5 - 7 x less water I would say you would need less engine run time on scene and less tankers shuttling water from scene to fill site. Makes sense to me.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChiefKN
    replied
    Originally posted by nmfire View Post
    Oh please. I had an across-the-chest 120vac 'incident' that I survived (thanks to an attentive classmate that hit the e-stop button) and look at me, I turned out fine! How much worse could a few hundred amps at 480 really be? Wuss.
    "fine".....


    The jury is out on that one.

    Leave a comment:


  • DeputyMarshal
    replied
    Originally posted by tree68 View Post
    Industrial fire pump installations would provide a clue as to the true requirements for such an electric motor.
    Commonly 250+ hp which is equivalent to 200+ kW.

    We might look to the railroads and big earthmovers.
    It's a thought but the turbine/generators used in those examples tend to be efficient only on the very large scale.

    Leave a comment:


  • tree68
    replied
    Originally posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
    FWIW, that's about 225 kilowatts and enough available amperage to run a small factory at 480 volts...

    Maybe instead of outlets on the hydrants we should just use long jumper cables clamped on the overhead high voltage primaries?
    I'm not sure you'd need a 500 HP motor to drive the pump alone. A lot of that is needed to move the ?15 tons of fire truck to the scene.

    Industrial fire pump installations would provide a clue as to the true requirements for such an electric motor. A search for fire pumps shows a 3000 gpm electric dewatering pump at 90HP, and 2000 GPM "temporary" fire pumps at about 100 HP.

    That said, I don't think it's practical today, at least not in the way we're discussing it.

    We might look to the railroads and big earthmovers. "Diesel" locomotives are really big generators that create the electricity that turns the traction motors mounted on each axle. Those huge dump trucks they use at mines operate much the same.
    Last edited by tree68; 09-14-2010, 11:42 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • nmfire
    replied
    Originally posted by downstate_firefighter View Post
    The electrocution issues alone worry me with the power outlet idea.
    Oh please. I had an across-the-chest 120vac 'incident' that I survived (thanks to an attentive classmate that hit the e-stop button) and look at me, I turned out fine! How much worse could a few hundred amps at 480 really be? Wuss.

    Leave a comment:


  • downstate_firefighter
    replied
    The electrocution issues alone worry me with the power outlet idea.

    Leave a comment:


  • DeputyMarshal
    replied
    Originally posted by neiowa View Post
    Figure out the current draw of the motor required to replace a 300hp diesel driving a 1250gpm pump.
    FWIW, that's about 225 kilowatts and enough available amperage to run a small factory at 480 volts...

    Maybe instead of outlets on the hydrants we should just use long jumper cables clamped on the overhead high voltage primaries?

    Leave a comment:

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