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Dept. taking away Leather Helmets PLEASE HELP!!!

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  • #61
    Originally posted by mcwops View Post
    What is the point of having a forum for people to ask questions if all you are going to do is get snotty with them and send them somewhere else?
    The point of a fourm is to supplement research you might do on your own -- not do it for you.

    if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything.
    Guess what? The world doesn't operate under Disney rules.
    "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"
    sigpic
    The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

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    • #62
      Originally posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
      The point of a fourm is to supplement research you might do on your own -- not do it for you.
      If you don't want to help, then why waste your time repeatedly posting here? I hope none of my questions I will ever ask won't waste you time.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by mcwops View Post
        If you don't want to help, then why waste your time repeatedly posting here? I hope none of my questions I will ever ask won't waste you time.
        Hopefully you ask any stupid questions that are tantamount to asking someone else to do your homework for you.
        "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"
        sigpic
        The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by mcwops View Post
          What is the point of having a forum for people to ask questions if all you are going to do is get snotty with them and send them somewhere else? Your answer could cover almost every thread in the forum. Just like momma always said, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything.
          Was I snotty?

          I am so very sorry about that. Snotty was not on my list of attitudes this week. I will update the list so I can include it in my report.



          We tried to help the poor lad, but his problem was with his reading comprehension.

          Momma also said when someone tries to kick your dog, unchain the dog.


          I started out respectful and made a few suggestions, as others also did. It became clear that he had boxed himself into a position he was not going to win. He could not accept that and assumed that I and others were against leather helmets.

          With all of the collective knowledge and talent around here, don't you think that if there was a definitive study that proved his point, someone would have rescued him?

          How can I or anyone pull something out of thin air when it does not exist. It comes down to opinions and policy. That has been my position from the beginning.

          Just as this issue had finally died... you come on here and post your opinion. But your concerned about the guy that created the issue. I do not understand this at all.


          Listen Sonny... why don't you find the answer for him. I really don't have time to cover this crap again.


          To answer your question:

          What is the point of having a forum for people to ask questions if all you are going to do is get snotty with them and send them somewhere else?
          He received answers and suggestions.... he just didn't like them. That was not anyones fault but his own.

          I do have to give you some points for taking up his losing cause. It shows you have some sand. I'd just be careful where you use it in the future.

          (sand=guts)

          -------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Fyred: I wore leather for many years and I never had one last more than 3 to 5 years. Like you, when the dept didn't want to buy leather anymore, I didn't think the cost was worth it to me. But I sure like them. I wish I had kept the last one.


          ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          WEBTEAM: This topic has outlived its usefulness. Please lock or delete.
          Last edited by PaladinKnight; 08-27-2010, 11:49 PM.
          HAVE PLAN.............WILL TRAVEL

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          • #65
            Originally posted by PaladinKnight View Post

            He received answers and suggestions.... he just didn't like them. That was not anyones fault but his own.
            I will admit, after reading the first couple pages and seeing the direction the discussion was heading (POV lights anyone, ), I just scanned the rest so I may have missed some of the details.

            And just to keep on topic, we wear department issued leathers, if for no other reason than 130+ years of tradition. Always have, always will.
            Last edited by mcwops; 08-27-2010, 11:49 PM.

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            • #66
              Originally posted by mcwops
              I will admit, after reading the first couple pages and seeing the direction the discussion was heading...

              You are a scholar and gentleman sir... and have restored my faith in the ages. Thank you!



              And just to keep on topic, we wear department issued leathers, if for no other reason than 130+ years of tradition. Always have, always will.
              Tradition is a wonderful thing. I have no issue if your department has the funding and makes the decision to carry on.
              HAVE PLAN.............WILL TRAVEL

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              • #67
                Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                Really? A properly cared for leather helmet will last an AVERAGE firefighter's career? You mean like cleaning it and keeping the bare spots touched up with paint? Golly, I did that, and my 2 Sam Houston N6A's fell apart on the back brim at about 5 years old each. Just for the record, NO, I did not heat them and bend the brim. I used them on my volly FD and as an instructor at the tech college. I sure loved wearing them but replacing a leather helmet every 5 years in just plain insane, as well as costly.

                Not all tradition is bad, and for damn sure, not all tradition is good. Justifying wearing a helmet because of tradition just doesn't cut it.
                Dunno what to tell you Brother Fyred. Guess I bought mine PRE-junk. I have TWO N6's as one gets beat up I rotate it to repaint and back again. Sometime I'll look at the build date and post it. Both are still in good shape. And NO,they aren't as good as they once were,maybe it's that California cow leather.You know,the happy cow stuff. T.C.

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by Deluge059 View Post
                  Its pretty sad that many of you don't support Leather Lids.
                  I don't have an opinion either way except I'd never put out money for a helmet.

                  There is no real advantage either way. Both will protect your noggin.

                  As for "tradition"... I don't buy it. Literally, in this case.
                  I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

                  "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

                  "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Rescue101 View Post
                    Why don't we throw out the Constitution while we're at it.We're making a pretty good start. T.C.
                    T.C....

                    Is a leather helmet really that critical? I mean, to relate it to throwing away the constitution?

                    It's not like they are making you wear an SCBA or anything.

                    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

                    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

                    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      I think the longevity depends on exposure. Everything is relevant.

                      I worked on both busy Truck and Engine Companies over the years. They didn't seem to last more than 3 to 5 years. Perhaps that was my fault, perhaps it wasn't. Perhaps it was just the way it was. Not trying to make a call on that. Part of it might be what I consider safe for me, versus what some else may accept. I lost a good part of my scalp, so I guess I became a bit picky.

                      If I had one today, it would last until the end of time since the exposure is... limited.

                      I guess I am too tight with my money, and the budget as well.
                      HAVE PLAN.............WILL TRAVEL

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                        Really? A properly cared for leather helmet will last an AVERAGE firefighter's career? You mean like cleaning it and keeping the bare spots touched up with paint? Golly, I did that, and my 2 Sam Houston N6A's fell apart on the back brim at about 5 years old each. Just for the record, NO, I did not heat them and bend the brim. I used them on my volly FD and as an instructor at the tech college. I sure loved wearing them but replacing a leather helmet every 5 years in just plain insane, as well as costly.

                        Not all tradition is bad, and for damn sure, not all tradition is good. Justifying wearing a helmet because of tradition just doesn't cut it.
                        Repeatedly teaching live fire does not fall under the "average firefighter's" career IMO. Burn buildings kill leather helmets. Most of us around here who have done any instructing have one plastic helmet that we use just for burns. After a while you get tired of buying leather shields and tetrahedrons.
                        Career Firefighter
                        Volunteer Captain

                        -Professional in Either Role-

                        Originally posted by Rescue101
                        I don't mind fire rolling over my head. I just don't like it rolling UNDER my a**.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by GTRider245 View Post
                          Repeatedly teaching live fire does not fall under the "average firefighter's" career IMO. Burn buildings kill leather helmets. Most of us around here who have done any instructing have one plastic helmet that we use just for burns. After a while you get tired of buying leather shields and tetrahedrons.
                          Well, you know what you just did for any argument that leather is better don't you? You shot it all to hell. A leather helmet can't stand the heat of repeated burn building usage without being damaged or destroyed but a plastic helmet is just fine. Funny thing is I can back that concept up too. My leathers fell apart and my Chieftan plastic traditional look a like has done fine for 10 years and I expect it to last to my retirement.
                          Crazy, but that's how it goes
                          Millions of people living as foes
                          Maybe it's not too late
                          To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                            Well, you know what you just did for any argument that leather is better don't you? You shot it all to hell. A leather helmet can't stand the heat of repeated burn building usage without being damaged or destroyed but a plastic helmet is just fine.
                            I think it has more to do with the relative price. I'd rather burn up the department's plastic helmets than my leather helmet...
                            Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

                            Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by ChiefKN View Post
                              T.C....

                              Is a leather helmet really that critical? I mean, to relate it to throwing away the constitution?

                              It's not like they are making you wear an SCBA or anything.

                              Nope Ken, it isn't. I LOVE Paladin responses but I don't mind cranking on him(or you)if I think I can get a rise or make a point. So I'll make a point. Not all Tradition is Good. But IF you don't study it and apply the lessons,that's BAD. A Leather isn't going to change anything there. Fact is,to some of us,the Leather represents a culture;One that is fading in a lot of places for any number of reasons. I FULLY intend to be in a Leather for the rest of my career. Does it make me a better FF? Nope,but to me(and mine) it stands for something:being the best we can be at what we do and honoring those that went before us. Most of "my" kids are in plastic,it's the Old dogs that are still in cow. And we will be until we retire. It's the LAST bit of the "Old School" that we're allowed to keep. I guess you could call it sentimental. When WE go(retire)the Helmet goes with us(we own them) and sits on the mantel until we both go to our final resting place. Just that simple. T.C.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by FyredUp View Post
                                Well, you know what you just did for any argument that leather is better don't you? You shot it all to hell. A leather helmet can't stand the heat of repeated burn building usage without being damaged or destroyed but a plastic helmet is just fine. Funny thing is I can back that concept up too. My leathers fell apart and my Chieftan plastic traditional look a like has done fine for 10 years and I expect it to last to my retirement.
                                I've yet to see ANY helmet that LIKES burn buildings. Or lasts long in that enviornent. T.C.

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