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  • DeputyMarshal
    replied
    Originally posted by Blulakr View Post
    That was a part of this drill that I was not comfortable with, leaving a person alone to search a room. While overall it speeds up the primary search process, it breaks the 'buddy rule'.
    This is the part were you excuse yourself from the badly designed drill. Drill like you work and you'll work like you drill. Take stupid shortcuts when you drill and you'll likley take them again when you work.

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  • Blulakr
    replied
    Originally posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
    Just as a point of reference, where was your partner with the TIC while you were crawling around in the room getting disorientated?
    He was across the hall showing another person the layout of another room to be searched.

    That was a part of this drill that I was not comfortable with, leaving a person alone to search a room. While overall it speeds up the primary search process, it breaks the 'buddy rule'.

    When we trained on this in-house later I changed it to keep people in pairs at all times.

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  • DeputyMarshal
    replied
    Just as a point of reference, where was your partner with the TIC while you were crawling around in the room getting disorientated?

    Leave a comment:


  • Blulakr
    replied
    I had another incident where after a fire I cleaned the inside of my mask with tissue. A piece of the tissue must have torn off and remained inside my mask. A couple of weeks later we were at a training burn. Shortly after donning my gear and entering the building, little pieces of tissue started flying around inside my mask. Every time I would breathe in it would swirl around. It got in my eyes and also made me choke. I tuffed it out but by the time we got out of the building I was coughing my head off.

    Never again

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  • jam24u
    replied
    I think this could also be a combination of both Instructor syndrome and SCBA syndrome. Yes it can and often does result in a anxiety attack, along with a lot of other possibilities.

    However there are other factors we have discovered that can contribute to a panic/anxiety attack while wearing SCBA. Some of it is physical. A gain in weight over a couple of years and an increase in blood pressure. High blood pressure generally doesn't knock on your door and say you have to deal with me, but has to be discovered that it is something that has to be dealt with. Then there is actually things like certain pollens in the air at the time that can cause a body chemical release along with an influx of other chemcials that rush into the system. I was surprised when I heard this, but it does make sense when you think about it. For those who have not had any adverse effects previously, age can suddenly become a factor as well and reveal new realities when wearing SCBA, including other areas of firefighting also.

    It is said that department officers must train for the position that they hold. No matter how long they have been with the department or held that office. I would guess that goes for instructors as well.

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  • hwoods
    replied
    Well...........

    Originally posted by Blulakr View Post
    A person is knowledgeable enough at a certain task to teach it to others. But by doing that they neglect to actually train on it themselves. Knowing how to do it and being able to do it are 2 different things.

    I think that just won the "Quote of the Month" Award......

    And THANK YOU for sharing.............

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  • JTFIRE80
    replied
    Similar thing happened to me a few months ago. Was doing a confined space/ff survival exercise for training, and got stuck. I've got about 15 years experience, not claustrophobic, have no problem wearing a pack...BUT, this was the 1st time I've ever gotten truly stuck. I could not move forward, backward, up, down, etc... I had gotten wedged in so tight, the instructor had to hit the lights, and physically push me back the way I was coming through while I pushed back myself. IT SUCKED!!

    Although I knew i was in a safe environment, my emotions got the best of me, and I pulled my mask off. Once I got "un-stuck", I donned my mask and continued on. I also went through again to prove to myself and the instructor I could do it.

    Lesson learned: Reality Checks are best to be had in training then on the fireground!!

    Leave a comment:


  • zzyyzx
    replied
    We have a training house that we use quite a bit for search and interior drills. Everyone has been in it numerous times and can go through the house easily without help. We use the foam mask inserts and then reverse or pull our nomex over the facepiece. Does a pretty good job of blocking out anything useful. But our training officer mixes things up, puts up barricades that basically redesign the rooms. He also makes wire mazes, but they'll change every couple months. Usually we have to go through a wall, which is pretty easy to do when it's dry wall. But everyone once in a while he'll change it. I remember going through the house, finally finding the wall I had to "exit" through. Hit it a few times with the sledge hammer and it was barely yielding. He had used a solid laminate countertop, which although still able to break through, wasn't as easy as drywall. Definitely gives you one of those "Oh Crap!" moments when it doesn't yield after a couple hits.

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  • CaptainGonzo
    replied
    Put it on the inside.... no fuss, no mess!

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  • BSFD9302
    replied
    Originally posted by voyager9 View Post
    Crumpled up wax paper does the trick as well. Maybe not as nice as the Press-n-seal but also doesn't have the residue.
    Would you put this on the inside or tape this to the outside of the mask.

    Leave a comment:


  • voyager9
    replied
    Originally posted by BSFD9302 View Post
    Great Idea. I never thought of that. We do have a smoke machine but that can get a bit expensive after awhile for a volunteer department.
    Crumpled up wax paper does the trick as well. Maybe not as nice as the Press-n-seal but also doesn't have the residue.

    Leave a comment:


  • BSFD9302
    replied
    Originally posted by dday05 View Post

    And if interested I do our drills with Glad Press N Seal once everyone completes their drills and ready to move on... It works nice. 99% of the time a face piece only needs one sheet. When you find the FF who pokes a hole in it so they can see that requires 2 sheets. It shows shadows and works really nice to conduct some drills where you need to be blacked out. And smoking the room with a smoke machine I like but this way you can monitor the person and make sure they are doing what they need to do correctly or what not. It does leave a little residue on the face piece that wipes off when you are done though.
    Great Idea. I never thought of that. We do have a smoke machine but that can get a bit expensive after awhile for a volunteer department.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blulakr
    replied
    Originally posted by voyager9 View Post
    I think the key point (or the one I sympathize with) is that as a front line leader.. LT, CP, or even BC you are stuck in the position of having to lead your crew, but also lead the in-house drills. As an instructor your role is to stay detached an oversee (and guide) the entire drill. As a front line officer your role is to lead your crew while performing the drills. You usually cannot do both.

    The take away is that if you find you are always the instructor you should also attempt to jump into the drills as often as possible as well. There's nothing worse then a training chief who hasn't seen the front line in forever.
    Exactly. Well stated.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blulakr
    replied
    Originally posted by LeatherHed4Life View Post
    for information sake, how did you lose your place in the room? you said you finished in a right hand search pattern, did you have a point of reference when you started?

    The idea behind the drill was to use the TIC to search rooms and to only manually search the areas in the rooms that could not be seen with the TIC. This makes for a much faster primary search.

    In my case there was an obstacle in the center of the room and I started outside the room in the hallway. All I needed to do was, using the entry door as my starting point, go straight to the obstacle and swipe behind it with my axe handle. Then I should have turned 180 and with the obstacle at my back, return to the door or at least the wall that the door was on. Where I screwed up is I am so used to just doing a right or left hand search I started out with a right hand then remembered that the object is in the middle of the room. I then left the wall and located the object. After searching around it I totally lost my sense of direction. I just crawled until I found a wall and proceeded with my right hand all the way around the room until I found the doorway. I could tell I was back in the hallway by my teammates voices nearby.

    I know when reading this it seams pretty simple and I shouldn't have gotten screwed up but that goes to show how much you lose your wits when you start to panic.

    At least we trained enough that following a wall was second nature and I knew to do it regardless of my mental state.

    Leave a comment:


  • dday05
    replied
    I teach FF Survival and RIT quite a bit. With that being said I do every thing that I talk about when we do hands on. It number one in my mind shows the students that you know what you are doing other then just talking about it.

    On a side note I harp big time on training with your TIC. Only because people become so use to using it we get lax in searching. I have heard people say we don't need to train on search & rescue since we have a TIC it does the work for us... I always ask what happens when it has a failure or the batteries die then you guessed it back to our old ways quote unquote...

    And if interested I do our drills with Glad Press N Seal once everyone completes their drills and ready to move on... It works nice. 99% of the time a face piece only needs one sheet. When you find the FF who pokes a hole in it so they can see that requires 2 sheets. It shows shadows and works really nice to conduct some drills where you need to be blacked out. And smoking the room with a smoke machine I like but this way you can monitor the person and make sure they are doing what they need to do correctly or what not. It does leave a little residue on the face piece that wipes off when you are done though.

    Leave a comment:

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