Psyche on Written?

[CollegeBuff]

I took a written test for a municipal department yesterday. 105 questions in Section 1, and Section 2 was an additional 50 questions that could only be described as a psych test.

My understanding was that the psych test happened along with the medical- ie, after the written and agility.

Is this allowed? Is it more normal than I thought it was?

[CaptBob]

Normal

The psychological interview will come later. Here's what's happening now:

Psych Questions on the Written

If you haven't already figured it out yet, there are psych questions being placed in the entry-level written test to eliminate candidates early in the process. The red-hot candidates, who have been the backbone of the fire service are taken out by these purposeless questions. If you answer those questions as you normally would, you could fail that section. Go figure. Are you prepared? Most aren't. We've had several calls from candidates looking for a way to get over this hurdle.

"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you."

There is one company that is at the cutting edge of providing candidates with study information to get over this hurdle. The Don McNea Fire School at www.Fireprep.com

Here’s a segment from The Don McNea Fire School Psychological Exam Preparation program:

Psychological Examination

In today's fire entry-level testing field, many departments are moving toward the direction of including psychological testing, not only during the last steps of the hiring process but during the initial testing phase. Some of these examinations are used to decrease the number of applicants taking the examination because of the cost involved in testing large numbers. When giving psychological tests as part of the written test, it will significantly reduce the number of applicants usually a minimum of 50%. The number one cause of failure on these types of examinations is not knowing what information these psychological tests are trying to retrieve from the fire applicant. The questions used on psychological examinations are determined by identifying major personality traits and characteristics of a successful firefighter. Knowing what personality traits and characteristics are being sought will improve your chance of scoring well on these examinations.

One fire applicant recently emailed us the following question:
One of the questions I am never sure how to answer on a psychological exam is whether a question should be answered "uncertain" or "not sure." There are questions that I have encountered during testing that I feel should be answered that way. My scores are not reflective of the individual I am and I was wondering if you have any insight into whether these questions could be making a difference in my score.

Answer: This is one of the most frequently asked questions from fire candidates taking psychological examinations. When you encounter a question that you aren't sure how to answer, we strongly urge you not to answer "uncertain" or "not sure." Doing this gives the impression that you are a fence-rider and not sure of decisions you make. In a psychological profile of a firefighter (on which many of these questions are based), they are looking for an individual who is very confident of the decisions he or she make.

You can learn more about the testing right here on this firehouse.com web site in the career articles section by clicking here:

http://cms.firehouse.com/content/sec...sp?sectionId=8

Captain Bob

www.eatstress.com

[johnmrobinson]

but seriously, how can your answers on personality be "graded?" unless they are just using them to obtain a general overview of a candidate ... i can't imagine these questions being part of the pass/fail decision, to determine if you are one of the top 100 or 125.

[kghemtp]

John, how one answers certain questions can show the evaluators how the person thinks or COULD rationalize a given scenario. Those who think a certain way are given first chance to move on to the next step.

[CollegeBuff]

One of the questions (to be answered by the standard "Strongly agree/Agree/etc etc") was "Nice guys finish last."

I SWEAR I'm not making this up.

Oh well. The top 125 were going to get phonecalls yesterday and today inviting them to the agility.

No call.

[johnmrobinson]

No call here, either, brother ... I tested for the same dept as you, and literally did not sleep Monday night. I had to take the day out of work today to catch up on sleep.

I can't imagine how many of the first 105 questions I could have gotten wrong. I would love the opportunity to go over the exam with an instructor sometime, at least to see where areas of improvement could be. It would be interesting to see what I got wrong.

[DAVESGMC]

I TOOK THE SAME TEST YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT ALONG WITH 4 OTHERS FROM MY DEPT. NONE OF US HEARD ANYTHING MONDAY OR TUESDAY. BETWEEN US ALL WE HAVE ABOUT 70 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE IN THE FIRE SERVICE. THIS IS ABOUT THE 3RD EXAM I HAVE SEEN LIKE THIS. HOW DO YOU KNOW WHAT THEY ARE LOOKING FOR?

[johnmrobinson]

I have no idea what they are looking for. I answered every one of the "psych" questions honestly, based on my personality. If they ask a question like "Do you like to take the lead on things?" You could get bagged either way. I would answer "strongly agree" because I am a leader type, aggressive, not passive, and what I feel a "take charge" guy. Do they interpret something like this as being too bull-headed and not able to take orders? Because that wouldn't be the case. A good leader knows when to take orders. And who knows how much weight the psych part played on the exam, which is why I wold love to review it to see where I could improve on the next exam I take.

[CaptBob]

How? Why?

You're all asking what are they looking for in the psych questions. the information is right here on this Firehouse.com web site from Asst. Chief Brent Collins. Click here to find out the inside secrets: http://cms.firehouse.com/content/con.../bio.jsp?id=17

Captain Bob

www.eatstress.com

[Thehangedfrog]

Re: Psyche on Written?

Originally posted by CollegeBuff
I took a written test for a municipal department yesterday. 105 questions in Section 1, and Section 2 was an additional 50 questions that could only be described as a psych test.

My understanding was that the psych test happened along with the medical- ie, after the written and agility.

Is this allowed? Is it more normal than I thought it was?

Is it allowed, sure.. Is it normal? depends on area, I would usually say no though..
If they can weed you out with a quickie psych test, they dont have to wait and pay 500+ bucks for a full blown test..

I took one for a remote overseas tour. It was called the MM-1 (dont remmeber what it stands for), 300 some odd questions, then the company had their own Part 2 which was another 300 questions, all during the test, a psycologist and a psycatrist both came in and pulled people out and asked their questions. then you would go sit down, work on your test some more, then get called by the next one.

Stupid questions, are you afraid of the dark, Fire, heights, heat
All the way down to do you love your mother.. talk about answer Ophedius.. Yeah I do, but NOT IN THAT sense... After a while we (8 of us) were just having fun with it... Now the problem is, I dont know if I passed, or failed, but I got to go on a remote overseas contract for 1 year.

Gerard


also I see alot of departments have morality questions, if you see someone take a watch from a home of a medical pt. you are treating, how do you handle this, tell superior, ask for a cut, ignore it, ask him to put it back etc.
If you found a envelope with no name that has $5,000 in it, what would you do...

Do they want the truth or the safe answers? (grin)

[Dutchy]

Test questions

"Do you like Alice in wonderland?" and "Do you like to to have friends in high places that can get you out of things like parking tickets" These were two of the questions I saw on my last test...

[CaptBob]

Psych

Interesting how much importance has been placed on the psych in recent years, yet in Canada they don't use the psych at all. Go figure.

Captain Bob

www.eatstress.com

[dmfireschool]

Pyschological testing

Twenty years ago, firefighter examinations were strictly skill tests to measure ability such as reading comprehension, mathematics, map reading, mechanical, etc. These abilities will only predict what an employee is capable of doing on a job. It is the "can do" component of the test; equally important, however, is the "will do" component. Personality tests, interest inventories and attitude assessments are examples of written instruments that are used to determine what a person would do on the job. By combining measures of skill and ability with measures of personality and motivation, the best fire candidate can be selected. if you have the characteristics of a successful firefighter.

We are continually seeing candidates who are not sure why they are scoring poorly on these types of examinations. The reason is that they don't understand the psychological and personality characteristics these tests are looking for.

Additional information on pyschological testing can be found at the link below.
http://www.fireprep.com/fireman_psyc..._examinat.html

www.fireprep.com