Lateral Transfer hire-St. Paul, MN

[SPFDRum]

Information:
Local 21 site (http://www.iafflocal21.org/)
PDF file for job (http://www.stpaul.gov/jobopenings/firefightertransfer.pdf)
Worth a shot, it's a great department to work for. Being a paramedic will be a huge asset, as a matter of fact, it's a must....

[b52turkish]

Rum,

Do you see this pushing back the "general hire" timeline or requirements? Is SP going to make Paramedic a must when they open up their hiring process?

[jccrabby3084]

Took a look at the site and it was very good.

As far as medics go...why the push to have FF's as paramedics?
How many ambulances are you guys staffing?
What is the ambulance staff's job on the fire scene?...strictly EMS and rehab or do they do fire related activities as well?
What is a rotation like between an ambulance and a fire rig?

What is the general staffing like for a truck company and an engine?
What is a standard fire response, how many rigs/personnel?
What is a standard EMS response, does an engine or truck typically get sent along?

Thought I'd throw them out there, looks like a nice department.

[SPFDRum]

As far as medics go...why the push to have FF's as paramedics?
How many ambulances are you guys staffing?Currently we are running 11 ALS rigs, but that is being reviewed.
What is the ambulance staff's job on the fire scene?...strictly EMS and rehab or do they do fire related activities as well?If the fire is in that medics first due, they go as an engine company-the engine/medic is cross staffed
What is a rotation like between an ambulance and a fire rig?As of now, no rotation, if its an medical in that medics response area, the medic will respond, leaving the engine behind

What is the general staffing like for a truck company and an engine?4 and 4
What is a standard fire response, how many rigs/personnel?Standard for a working fire is a district chief, RIT/safety chief, 3 engines, squad, 2 trucks, and a RIT company-4 on each apparatus, 5 on a squad, 2 chiefs
What is a standard EMS response, does an engine or truck typically get sent along?Standard is 1 medic rig with 4, a truck or engine may be sent for shootings, stabbings, full arrests, and/or any other major incident. The medic Capt can also request assistance. Also, a non-transport rig will be sent ahead if the first due medic is out.
Hope this helps.

[SPFDRum]

Turk, unfortunately I can't answer your question on the time line. But I don't believe that medic will be an absolute requirement in the future.

[jccrabby3084]

Yep that helps thanks.

Although the question I had regarding the rotation, I meant more so how many days is one on the ambulance before doing so many days on a fire rig? Or is it that you are always on the ambulance?

[scrapper]

Yep that helps thanks.

Although the question I had regarding the rotation, I meant more so how many days is one on the ambulance before doing so many days on a fire rig? Or is it that you are always on the ambulance?

The way I've always understood it is this:

as an example, you are assigned to Medic 14 and Engine 14. You are at the station. If a fire call comes in you hop on Engine 14 and go. Medic 14 is automatically placed out of service until you get back to the station. It works just the opposite also. If an ambulance run comes in you hop on Medic 14 and go and the engine is out of service. And yes this applies to all four people assigned to the rig.

SPFDRum please correct me if I'm wrong since maybe you guys are changing things. This is the way I've heard it for the last 15+ years.

[emt161]

as an example, you are assigned to Medic 14 and Engine 14. You are at the station. If a fire call comes in you hop on Engine 14 and go. Medic 14 is automatically placed out of service until you get back to the station. It works just the opposite also. If an ambulance run comes in you hop on Medic 14 and go and the engine is out of service. And yes this applies to all four people assigned to the rig.

Oh my GOD.

A major metropolitan city is CROSS-STAFFING?

And sending 4 PEOPLE in a transport unit?

Holy CRAP. I can't believe that even the union thinks this is a good idea.

[jccrabby3084]

Oh my GOD.
A major metropolitan city is CROSS-STAFFING?
And sending 4 PEOPLE in a transport unit?
Holy CRAP. I can't believe that even the union thinks this is a good idea.

Thanks for the info scrapper.

My first impression reading this was exactly the quote, but then again who are we (outsiders) to question how things go. I'm sure SPFD's union, like any, would want to have personnel staffed on each rig, but why judge when one doesn't know the circumstance.

From my point of view that is fine. I have seen FF/medics get the shaft time and again when it comes to a fire. Even though they are supposed to perform FF ops they get sent for rehab or EMS standby. Then every so many days they get a break from the ambulance and put on a fire rig. They may get a burner and they may not, but what you end up with is a person well qualified in EMS, but not as much as fire. Fire is really what the job is about. If SPFD will run a crew for EMS on one call and fire for another fine. You get people more readily to respond to both situations.

If up to me send both units in case a fire call comes in at the tail end of an EMS run, but again I don't know how the city operates. I will not sit back and degrade another department because things don't work the way one would think they should.

I may be completely out of line here and have no clue about the workings of the SPFD, but I will not criticize things I don't know about either. To me the SPFD sounds like a great department, although I probablly won't apply, it doesn't hurt to ask questions. But this is no place to criticize either.

[scrapper]

Thanks for the info scrapper.

My first impression reading this was exactly the quote, but then again who are we (outsiders) to question how things go. I'm sure SPFD's union, like any, would want to have personnel staffed on each rig, but why judge when one doesn't know the circumstance.

From my point of view that is fine. I have seen FF/medics get the shaft time and again when it comes to a fire. Even though they are supposed to perform FF ops they get sent for rehab or EMS standby. Then every so many days they get a break from the ambulance and put on a fire rig. They may get a burner and they may not, but what you end up with is a person well qualified in EMS, but not as much as fire. Fire is really what the job is about. If SPFD will run a crew for EMS on one call and fire for another fine. You get people more readily to respond to both situations.

If up to me send both units in case a fire call comes in at the tail end of an EMS run, but again I don't know how the city operates. I will not sit back and degrade another department because things don't work the way one would think they should.

I may be completely out of line here and have no clue about the workings of the SPFD, but I will not criticize things I don't know about either. To me the SPFD sounds like a great department, although I probablly won't apply, it doesn't hurt to ask questions. But this is no place to criticize either.

Well the SPFD will send a fire unit to medicals also. The way I understand it they send the closest medic unit and if they aren't first due then the closest fire unit to first respond also. Also they will send a separate medic unit to a fire if needed and I believe it is a standard response on 2+ alarm fires.

Tridata did a study of SPFD, it's on the internet somewhere and I have read or at least perused most of it. One of the options in the study is for SPFD to change to dedicated 4 ff's on fire trucks and 2 dedicated to ambulances with no cross-staffing. Maybe that is what they are shooting for. I don't know if they intend to implement all or any of the study but IMO it might explain why they need medics right now.

Again this is all from my point of view. I do not work for Saint Paul Fire and never have. I have ridden with them a couple times and have studied up on their operations somewhat as a lifelong resident of the Twin Cities. I could be way off-base and that is why I am hoping someone maybe can correct me if I'm wrong. However, I will say SPFD is top notch and one month ago I would have applied for this opening in a heartbeat as I have always wanted to work for SPFD. Now I am committed to another recruit academy and I'm not moving back now. But I would highly recommend this opportunity for anybody interested, they are a great dept.

[Golzy12]

Where did you get hired scrapper?