Chasing a Stolen Vehilce

[KenNFD1219]

This Firehouse.com article (http://cms.firehouse.com/content/article/article.jsp?sectionId=46&id=50426) states that members of Charleston, WV FD chased down a stolen pickup that belonged to one of the crew members.

While I certainly do not agree with what they did, I do understand why. What steams me is this comment:

"It was very interesting, however, for his colleagues back at the firehouse who heard, "We're in pursuit of a firefighter's stolen vehicle," while listening to the police scanner. Assistant Fire Chief Rodney Winters couldn't believe what he was hearing.."This was absolutely hilarious," he said. "We thought, 'Did they just spot the truck?' No! They were actually in pursuit."

An officer has the responsibility to stop actions that are dangerous or improper, even if the fire fighters doing it think it's OK.

The stolen truck blew a red light while they were chasing it. Did the officer ever think about what would happed if the pickup hit someone?

Did they ever consider that the person they were chasing was armed?

Anyone else bothered by this, or is it just me?

[SSTONER]

This Firehouse.com article (http://cms.firehouse.com/content/article/article.jsp?sectionId=46&id=50426) states that members of Charleston, WV FD chased down a stolen pickup that belonged to one of the crew members.

While I certainly do not agree with what they did, I do understand why. What steams me is this comment:

"It was very interesting, however, for his colleagues back at the firehouse who heard, "We're in pursuit of a firefighter's stolen vehicle," while listening to the police scanner. Assistant Fire Chief Rodney Winters couldn't believe what he was hearing.."This was absolutely hilarious," he said. "We thought, 'Did they just spot the truck?' No! They were actually in pursuit."

An officer has the responsibility to stop actions that are dangerous or improper, even if the fire fighters doing it think it's OK.

The stolen truck blew a red light while they were chasing it. Did the officer ever think about what would happed if the pickup hit someone?

Did they ever consider that the person they were chasing was armed?

Anyone else bothered by this, or is it just me?

They put themselves at risk, and the public if they followed the driver through a red light. They should have let LE do their job.

If what is in the story is accurate anyway.

[engine4cLT]

I would be fired on the spot. But, then again , I might could get a LE job. Then again, who wants that....ugghh.

[SSTONER]

Then again, who wants that....ugghh.

Apparently Charleston!

[nmfire]

Someone did this nearby here. Except it was a POV chasing a vehicle that was evading an MVA. Ended with tragic results and lots of court proceedings going on right now.

[IFDFFENG20]

I can just hear the theme from The Dukes Of Hazard playing with a loud rendition of Dixie coming from the airhorns on the apparatus. YEEEHAAW!!

[hwoods]

We're not known to be the kindest, gentlest spot on earth here. So, steal my truck and see where you end up. You COULD end up being pursued by a whole box alarm.... :eek: As to those who think we should leave it up to the LEO's, ours are very busy to begin with, so we don't want to add to their workload, except to ask them to take the thief to the station after we're finished with our "investigation" :D :D

[wag11c]

I fail to see any humour in that situation and think it is totally irresponible and reckless. Around here we are having enough trouble with public perception during legitimate police pursuits, I am thankful to hear that this one didn't end in a trgedy and another blackeye for the Fire Service. That said, there may be a situation where I would consider such a tactic, but it would definetly have to involve some type of voilent and bizzare crime.

[WebFire]

Funny how we hammer the crap out of LEO for making a save, yet some of you think it is ok to pursue stolen vehicles. :rolleyes:

[EFD840]

I gotta go with Wag on this one. There are times where a very extraordinary situation might occur but a stolen truck ain't it. I don't have a problem with following at a discreet distance, obeying traffic laws, and using the radio to guide the guys with guns in for the kill but a pursuit - no way.

[CaptainGonzo]

I gotta go with Wag on this one. There are times where a very extraordinary situation might occur but a stolen truck ain't it. I don't have a problem with following at a discreet distance, obeying traffic laws, and using the radio to guide the guys with guns in for the kill but a pursuit - no way.

I, too have to agree with Wag on this.

[FTMPTB15]

That said, there may be a situation where I would consider such a tactic, but it would definetly have to involve some type of voilent and bizzare crime.
On that note, we were returning from a call once and noticed the van in front of us driving rather recklessly. We notified PD and began to follow the car discreetly. The van turned into a neighborhood, as did we, and began to speed up (even faster than it had been going). Obviously we couldn't drive fast with the speed humps in the neighborhood, but we did what we could to follow in a safe manner. Eventually the van cut through the neighborhood to another main road (which is what we had anticipated) and low-and-behold the PD intercepted the car on the other side of the neighborhood. Turns out, the driver had mixed some meds and alcohol and decided to take their child (not properly restrained) for a ride. Good thing for everyone involved, this case turned out well.

I would not condone 'chasing' someone, but as stated earlier, following at a discreet distance and calling it in to PD is probably the best thing to do.

[SgtScott31]

From my standpoint as an FTO, Sergeant, and DUI Instructor, I catch anyone pursuing a stolen vehicle you get a reckless driving charge (at minimum) from me.

What is the purpose of pursuing? What do you lose? A freakin inatimate object. A car that is insured and replacable.

What if your POV pursuit causes injury and/or death?

Leave the law enforcing to the police. There are reasons pursuit policies are in place.

[SSTONER]

As to those who think we should leave it up to the LEO's, ours are very busy to begin with, so we don't want to add to their workload, except to ask them to take the thief to the station after we're finished with our "investigation" :D :D

Sarcasm...Thats how I am looking at this. Hopefully. The bad part of having Fire Apparatus pursue anyone is that you dont want to find yourself in a gunfight and all you have is your Ax.

[MalahatTwo7]

Wag said it all. :( What a wonderful picture this paints to the imagination of the 7 yr old who heard this in the local news.........


Just very happy to hear that a "blown" red light was the only bad news in this story and not something much worse.

[MalahatTwo7]

We're not known to be the kindest, gentlest spot on earth here. So, steal my truck and see where you end up. You COULD end up being pursued by a whole box alarm.... As to those who think we should leave it up to the LEO's, ours are very busy to begin with, so we don't want to add to their workload, except to ask them to take the thief to the station after we're finished with our "investigation" :D:D

Harve were you trying to tell us something???? :confused: :p

Two Fire Department Vehicles Stolen In Md.
Vehicles Taken From Residential Neighborhood

POSTED: 6:32 pm EDT July 28, 2006
UPDATED: 7:36 pm EDT July 28, 2006

WASHINGTON -- Officials said they are concerned after the recent theft of two cars belonging to members of the Prince George's County Volunteer Fire Department.

News4's I.J. Hudson reported Friday the cars were used by command officers.

Officials said that in the last three weeks, the department has been hit by a thief who stole vehicles from in front of homes.

"Two vehicles, both from the same station, vehicles that our volunteer chiefs or command officers would typically use. And another commonality is the fact that both of the vehicles were taken from the same residential neighborhood," said Maj. Chauncey Bowers.

Officials said both officers live on Tyrone Road, which is about five miles away from the department.

The vehicle stolen Thursday night was a Taurus sedan. Police said it was recovered early Friday morning in the Silver Hill area. The other stolen car was a Red Crown Victoria with a white roof, and is still missing.

Officials said the stolen vehicle would have markings and lights similar to other Prince George's County fire vehicles and local government tags.

Officers said they believe the decals may have been removed and that difference in coloring may be visible.

Bowers suggested that the culprits may be joy riders because he said the cars were taken in the same area, but said taking the cars has an operational impact.

"There is equipment in a vehicle at any given time that people are using on an operational basis. So, obviously, if that vehicle was stolen, that equipment is not immediately available to you," Bowers said.

Prince George's County Fire Department is asking anyone who see the missing Red Crown Victoria to call 911.

Copyright 2006 by nbc4.com.

[dave29]

Sarcasm...Thats how I am looking at this. Hopefully. The bad part of having Fire Apparatus pursue anyone is that you dont want to find yourself in a gunfight and all you have is your Ax.

Dont forget the hoseline LOL Hell that would take care of their ass

[KEEPBACK200FEET]

Dont forget the hoseline LOL Hell that would take care of their ass


I'm pretty sure you'd be dead if brought a hoseline to a gunfight.

[MalahatTwo7]

Depends on who draws first. :D How good is your pump operator?

[MichaelD77]

I think this would make a good "Rescue Me" episode, "Tommy's truck got stole". I smell an Emmy...

[Res343cue]

Been there, done that, sort of.

Local assh*le that was in my graduating class at the high school was tailgaiting me, about 3 feet off my bumper. I was getting ready to take a turn when he rear ended me and took off. A quick call to dispatch, turning around and following him discretely and at a distance until I could get a PD unit up to my location proved beneficial. Now he's paying for the damage to my vehicle, as well as for possession of a controlled substance, following too close, speeding, and a bunch of other tickets.

He's denying it, but the red paint on his bumper says it all. :rolleyes:

[Chief2100]

:eek: :confused: As both a Police Officer and a Fire Chief any type of pursuit should only be performed with extreme caution using a police vehicle operated by a police officer. I don't remember taking a single class on vehicle pursuits during Apparatus Operator School. I have been in quite a few pursuits in the last few years most recently a few weeks ago and to be honest they SCARE the HELL out of me every time when I was a rookie they were a lot of fun nothing like the adrenaline of running 100+ to catch the bad guy but after seeing a few bad ending I now realize that they are dangerous to other motorist, Pedestrians and though I could usually care less the perp always gets a few bruises or worse, and most importantly good ole ME, in addition they typically end up with some type of property damage which typically belongs to some poor working stiff who will never get a dime back.
I most certainly would'nt condone a crew who is unequipped and untrained for a situation such as that to participate in something such as that no more than what I would send a SWAT team in a burning house to put it out. The last chase I had that I referred to above is a prime example of how it can go wrong quick for someone who is ready, just before I cancelled the chase the guy wrecked into a fence, reversed the car and hit my car luckily I was in a police cruiser that was nimble enough I could get out of the way or it could have been trajic. My personal take is even Law Enforcement should be very cautious and selective as to who, what, and Why they chase and though we appreciate all that the Fire-EMS units do for us we would much rather have them as good witnessess in a case like this than dangerous participants. Take Care, Stay Low, Hit Hard, and Go Home Safely!!