Hard to finding medics

[rumedic1]

I am in South Carolina and I was just wondering if any other agencys in this state have a hard time finding Paramedics. I am talking paramedics to just apply for the job. We had five openings at least and not one paramedic applied. I think we are feeling the crunch of the "none existant" shortage of paramedics.
I was just wondering if it was a local thing or is it all over.. I am in the Lowcountry area

[ericjames131]

I am in South Carolina and I was just wondering if any other agencys in this state have a hard time finding Paramedics. I am talking paramedics to just apply for the job. We had five openings at least and not one paramedic applied. I think we are feeling the crunch of the "none existant" shortage of paramedics.
I was just wondering if it was a local thing or is it all over.. I am in the Lowcountry area

Are you guys a fire department or just EMS?

I am looking for a full time fire job....I HAVE MY MEDIC, FFII !

Email me if you have any info!

zach
immodice@aol.com

[DrParasite]

I am in South Carolina and I was just wondering if any other agencys in this state have a hard time finding Paramedics. I am talking paramedics to just apply for the job. We had five openings at least and not one paramedic applied. I think we are feeling the crunch of the "none existant" shortage of paramedics.
I was just wondering if it was a local thing or is it all over.. I am in the Lowcountry area
hmmm, are other agencies in yoru area feeling the same crunch? most paramedics are going to other fields for various reasons. medics get paid poorly, deal with a lot of stress, work long hours, often crammed in ambulances during their entire shift, and are forced to run call after call after call with little down time. Also, most current paramedics work as a medic in more that one location (full time at place A, part-time or per-diem at place B) just to make ends meet.

I know there are many senior medics leaving the private sector for jobs as career firefighter/paramedics, or jobs with non-profit semi-municpal ambulance companies because they know they can make more money with less stress. how do your salaries compare to your neighbors? what is the work enviorment like? while your salary (40 hour work week) might enough for a single male, but what about when he gets married and has kids? will that be enough to support a family?

people in EMS shouldn't be saying that there is a paramedic shortage, but rather why are we having trouble finding medics, and what can we do to rectify the situation.

[croaker260]

Money is important, Dont get me wrong. But also consider staff develpoment. Not just basic CE, but sending your people to CCEMT-P, conferences, ABLS, etc.

Do your standing orders go beyond the basic VOMIT medicine? DO you have standing orders for pain control so your medics dont have to BEG the OLMC for meds to make a little old lady feel better?
DO you have CPAP? Is your MD involved, or a dictator, or just a name on the liscense and recert paperwork?

In other words...do your medics feel like medics, or the bastard step child of the fire service and the health care commuity both? Remember (most) medics want to be MEDICS, treated like adults and challanged to excell.

TO take an example...KCM1 system pays very well...but when you consider the area (seattle) its not awsome. Its good, but not the same as it would be somewhere else. This is an assumption, but the medics there dont stay for the money...They stay for the medicine and the pride of the job they do. A level of medicine and staff development most other places dont even try to come close to.

[jtkmedic69]

I am in the same state as rumedic1 and we are having the same problem. We currently have 17 openings. At all of our assesment centers, we only have 5 people show up and 3 might be part time and two are either intermediates or a medic. I think we have a great system with progressive equipment and standing orders but it is hard to compete with a private service who offers bonuses and incentive pay.

[rumedic1]

I here that jtkmedic now has 19 openings :eek: in my area 6 to 8 openings and now I here the state of Georgia is in the same boat. At least the services along the coast are in short supply

[rumedic1]

hmmm, are other agencies in yoru area feeling the same crunch?
Yes they are the private and government bothe fire and EMS.

most paramedics are going to other fields for various reasons. medics get paid poorly, deal with a lot of stress, work long hours, often crammed in ambulances during their entire shift, and are forced to run call after call after call with little down time.
some medics are going in to nursing other than that they are just moving around taking advantage of the open job market and bouncing from job to job for the etra few cents each has to offer.

Also, most current paramedics work as a medic in more that one location (full time at place A, part-time or per-diem at place B) just to make ends meet.
yes some do work more than one job but that is not consistant with those leaving.

I know there are many senior medics leaving the private sector for jobs as career firefighter/paramedics, or jobs with non-profit semi-municpal ambulance companies because they know they can make more money with less stress. how do your salaries compare to your neighbors? what is the work enviorment like?
We are county based third service no fire. We have it made 600-800 call a month 24/48 rotation fire first responds on all calls they assist they will carry stretcher get it out the truck for you we have NO non emergent transfers a private handles all home to dr or dialysis ect..

The private sector pay is more but none have left to go private actually we have hire personnel from them that take a cut in pay to work here

Salaries are very close we have one issue in longetivy but this will hope fully be resolved in July this is one reason we have retenttion problem.

work ever. is very easy compared to other agencys, you can sleep after 1300, new ambulances, lp 12 loaded allbells and whistles, cpap, adult IO ezio, vents on units, body armour, all uniforms provided when you start we provide everything except underware and socks no joke..


while your salary (40 hour work week) might enough for a single male, but what about when he gets married and has kids? will that be enough to support a family?
medic is 35000-36000 yr BASE

people in EMS shouldn't be saying that there is a paramedic shortage, but rather why are we having trouble finding medics, and what can we do to rectify the situation.
This is true but in our area there is a shortage not enough going to classes this is in both the state of Georgia and South Carolina I work in both I can speak for the coastal regions of both

[missmekissme]

I am have always been interested in being a medic, can someone please help me with information on how to get myself started?

Thanks
Amanda

[rumedic1]

I am have always been interested in being a medic, can someone please help me with information on how to get myself started?

Thanks
Amanda

we need to know what state you are in is first thing

[missmekissme]

I live in northern Virginia

[rumedic1]

I hoped someone from VA would jump in this is the best I can do good luck..
EMT Basic info (http://www.vdh.state.va.us/OEMS/Training/tprog.asp#EMT%20–%20Basic)

[FLMedic80]

I work in Orlando currently and as far as I know in Florida, the medic shortage is pretty bad. Most of the counties in Florida are pretty much all Fire/EMT/Medic certified and compete for employees in wages, benefits etc. So what ends up happening is everytime the new Union contract for a fire dept gets negotiated, the money goes up and people leave mulitple vacancies at other places causing a shortage.

There are also some county run EMS systems here that run with BLS fire depts and they are now competing and causing the private agencies to crumble. For example, Polk County EMS just raised their starting wage from 32K to 38K and had 15 vacancies which were all filled in a matter of weeks.

Now I live in Orlando where I must say we have just about the most screwed up EMS system I have ever worked under which is why I am leaving angoing to Sarasota soon. Rural Metro currently runs the East Orange County area and all of the city of Orlando for 911 transports. Well I work PT there and they have approx 30 medic slots the last time I checked. Its so bad that they are losing the Non-emergency contract with Orlando Regional Healthcare which is about to crack Rural Metro and send them packing which is why AMR is now bidding to take over soon.

Its a huge ripple effect. Lets face it, salaries and benefits are the key to keeping medics and keeping them happy. Same goes for EMTs. Also having a Medical Director who is all in favor of what is in the best interest of the patient and not liabilities and by trusting his/her medics to do what they went to school for is the key to having a great EMS system as a whole nationwide.

I am just absolutely appalled by the type of money nurses make in comparison to what medics make. I not by any means a nurse hater, hell im dating one, but lets face it, who is required to make critical thinking decisions on a constant basis which really makes the decision of life and death for a patient? Paramedics with the assistance of course of EMTs. Both of our professions RN and Paramedics have a nationwide shortage, so for us to get paid significantly less is absurd. So until we all get significant pay scale increases that allow for a confortable life style for most, the shortage will only get worse. Its sad because I love my job and I wouldnt trade it for anything. I just wish we could see some positive changes in the field.

[NFfireman23]

i gotta get the hell outta WI!!!! Im a medic for a private service...$10.56 an hr to start. I also work in an ED, that pays better, $19.90 per hr (RN starts at $36 per hr though)
Even the municipal FD (Green Bay, WI) only gets a $5000 per yr bump if your a medic. I guess thats why we work 100 hrs a week!

[NYCCEMTP]

Same problems in NY.

The issue, when it comes down to it, is how much money you make and what your costs of living are. When EMS agencies, both public and private, nickel and dime their medics forcing them to live at a payrate almost a quarter of what any numbnut nurse makes, you're going to have medics jumping from agency to agency trying to make ends meet while working 60 to 100 hour weeks.

In this area, the two large private agencies are having problems hiring and retaining paramedics. First off, they make no efforts to promote a positive work environment. Profit is king. Payrates are also held down by a very ineffective EMS union upon which the entire region bases their payscales on.

Unless pay starts to match that of other medical providers (i.e. - nurses that can't even administer a medication much less change a set of bedsheets without an order from a doc), there's always going to be a shortage of good paramedics. When a seasoned flight medic only makes half of what the average floor nurse makes, you're going to find a lot of paramedics leaving paramedicine to enter more lucrative fields.

To see a good way of recruiting good paramedics, take a look at the fire side. I know this is a fairly sore subject but you have to admit our collegues that ride big red trucks have a way of negotiating salaries, and more importantly benefits, that you can actually live on while only working 40 to 48 hours a week. Imagine that!

Reader's Digest version:
- raise pay
- better benefits
- better working conditions
- offer a career, not just a job

Be safe out there.

DISCLAIMER: Yes, I am bitter that nurses make the kind of money they make. Yes, I take a whole lot of grief from nurses everyday at work. Yes, I think paramedics should make at least what a mere RN makes.

[croaker260]

Same problems in NY.

The issue, when it comes down to it, is how much money you make and what your costs of living are. When EMS agencies, both public and private, nickel and dime their medics forcing them to live at a payrate almost a quarter of what any numbnut nurse makes, you're going to have medics jumping from agency to agency trying to make ends meet while working 60 to 100 hour weeks.

In this area, the two large private agencies are having problems hiring and retaining paramedics. First off, they make no efforts to promote a positive work environment. Profit is king. Payrates are also held down by a very ineffective EMS union upon which the entire region bases their payscales on.

Unless pay starts to match that of other medical providers (i.e. - nurses that can't even administer a medication much less change a set of bedsheets without an order from a doc), there's always going to be a shortage of good paramedics. When a seasoned flight medic only makes half of what the average floor nurse makes, you're going to find a lot of paramedics leaving paramedicine to enter more lucrative fields.

To see a good way of recruiting good paramedics, take a look at the fire side. I know this is a fairly sore subject but you have to admit our collegues that ride big red trucks have a way of negotiating salaries, and more importantly benefits, that you can actually live on while only working 40 to 48 hours a week. Imagine that!

Reader's Digest version:
- raise pay
- better benefits
- better working conditions
- offer a career, not just a job

Be safe out there.

DISCLAIMER: Yes, I am bitter that nurses make the kind of money they make. Yes, I take a whole lot of grief from nurses everyday at work. Yes, I think paramedics should make at least what a mere RN makes.

NYCCEMTP,

for once you and I are in agreement.

[AZCEP43]

If you want medics to make wages comparable to RN's, then we have to stop fighting amongst ourselves and work toward the level of professional recognition that nurses have attained.

As long as we are trained, willing to volunteer, complain about the number of hours it takes to become educated, etc, we will never be compensated for the effort.

[pocambu]

I also live in SC like rumedic1 only in the Upstate. Looks like we have about the same equipment. Our service is pretty agressive as far as SO's and SOP's. We also have a career ladder that if a person stays and works at it can make great money. All that said we still have a medic shortage mainly for reasons that others have noted.

[cellblock]

Media here in Louisiana has been running stories on the medic shortage for quite some time. Private service Acadian Ambulance is short about 60 positions. East Baton Rouge EMS is so short they have begun paying students an hourly wage when they are going through medic class. It was bad before Katrina but it's really bad now.

[EMT18325]

What could I make if I came to Arcadian in LA?

Matt
EMT-P

[medc700]

missmekissme

The way you have to become a medic in Virginia is find and accredited program in the local college and you can go and obtain your medic. The only medic programs have to be accredited or approved by the State office of EMS. They usually are in a college setting. Ofcoarse the prereqs is going to be the EMT basic class then you can get into the medic program from there. I live and work in Bedford County and we are a volunteer department that contract a third service to assist our volunteer departments during the day. We have looked into and want to explore other options because having a contract service coming in to work with the volunteers has some very unique challenges. Good luck on becomeing a medic and when you get it call me and we will have room for any medics.

[EMT18325]

You know, this thread is kind of funny. Let me tell you my problem.

There is "such a shortage on medics" here in Tennessee...then why can't I get a PT job as a medic?

Explain that one to me.

Matt
NREMT-P

[jedch47]

It is probably because they want to have full time people so they don't have to split up shifts. For the most part where I wor they want people that work as needed instaed of p/t. That way tou can sign up for a full shift instead of cutting one up.

[EMT18325]

Well..you would think that a PT medic would be better than no medic or paying a FT medic time and a half.

Matt

[jedch47]

You like me are probably just a small player in this big EMS game. I am sure that it all makes sense to the people in charge. I am under the impression that when you start in upper level managment you lose the majority of your common sense.

[medc700]

There is a problem finding medics with good work ethic. I have seen a few medics that have applied for jobs that will probably never get hired because of the way they present themselves and the way they act. Just because you are a certified medic doesn't mean you are a shoe in for a job. It means you have the ability to use you being a medic to your advantage when applying for a job.
You can have all the certifications in the world but if you are " a turd in a punch bowl" you will never get hired in the public service world. If you do get hired they made a bad mistake.

[Ridryder911]

First, I left full time nursing (yes, I have all the whistles and titles/16 yrs.) and went back in to the field full time. First, it was my love of being a Paramedic, second it allowed me to finish nurse practitioner school (I still plan to continue be in EMS),and yes salary wise I make as much as a RN, being a Paramedic.

I agree, the pay of being a medic sucks and yes deserve more. Now, with that said, one needs to compare the length of school, professional development.

I do disagree, when discussing orders and medical direction. Every health care provider has to have some form of orders, unless they are a physician. Albeit, be in form of written (like nursing) or protocols (EMS) we all have to have some form of medical direction (technically and legally).

Look at the compare the number of hours of education and professional development of the each career requires, not that you personally have, but in general. How many people use EMS as a stepping stone alone? Now, compare that with other health careers. How hard is it really to become a Paramedic (not necessary a good Paramedic), now compare the pass/fail rates of boards and certification test (NREMT in comparison to other health care test, has a high pass rate). One will see it is comparably easy to become one. If it was not, many would not leave the profession so easily.

Yes, we need money. Although, research has proven most of the time, this will not solve most industry and personal issues problems. I personally believe part of the problem is EMS is that it is a dead end career. When one has reached the goal of being a Paramedic, where does one go? True, many opt for a uni-lateral movement to supervisory, management, or education, then that's it?

As well, so many opt for the easy buck.. not looking at the long term benefit. Sure, money up-front is nice, but so would a good retirement, nice benefit package, such as insurance, education reimbursement, and longevity pay.
So many in EMS look at short term goals, and immediate fixes and not the whole picture.

So what can be done to increase the number of medics, the pay, the benefits?

First, let's not re-invent the wheel. Compare our profession to those that have better pay, benefits, etc. The LEO ha a very active lobbyist group that makes sure that they are protected in Congress and their request are heard. Look at the nursing profession, that makes sure that each state has their profession ran by a board for nurses by nurses, in lieu of others running it for them.

Instead of whining, they actually participate in large association groups and personally attend local state representation in laws and rule making. How many of you write to your representatives and know health and EMS legislation in your state? How many medics you know are members or support EMS associations and groups that attempt to make changes? Locally, nationally?

The problem in my area is not so much a shortage, as much as it is that no one wants to hire the quality of what is being produced. We crank out Paramedics every 16 weeks, that pass the exam, only not able to perform the job adequately. So many fail our entrance exam, and oral boards, it has became ridiculous. The exam has not changed in difficulty.

Yes, there is Paramedics working at Wal-Mart, delivering bread, etc. due to inability to meet the employers expectations. As well. we have found out many have poor misconceptions of what EMS is about and their expectations of "EMS" is unfounded. Rather, their goals and perception is what they have only seen on television.

Hopefully, EMS can unite to improve pay, benefits, to increase the number of those that really want to work in EMS and provide excellent health care.

R/r 911

[mitllesmertz1]

There is no medic shortage in the Seattle are, but as has already been pointed out, we have a great system and are compensated well.
Around $70,000 per year, closer to $100k after awhile.
All the benefits of a major city FF, pension, Def-Comp, etc.
As I have mentioned before, perhaps part of the "medic shortage" is that many areas are trying to put a medic on every rig in the area.
Someone mentioned how bad it is in Florida- doesn't Fl have about the highest ratio of population/medic in the country?

Anyways, I see how medics work in other areas, and what they get paid, and I can only be glad I don't live there.
If I did, I would move!

[kghemtp]

Mitllesmertz... not sure if you've said this in previous posts (so I apologize), but what would be your guess as to why various regions of the country have not seen the value of tiered systems such as Seattle? Surely the topic is raised just as the common "need a medic (or even 2!) on every truck." My department here in the northeast is fortunate not to be overrun with paramedics, and though we DO keep a medic on the ambulance, it's all part of a rotation from pump to ladder to ambulance, and medics are taken off the pump or ladder as needed. There seem to be very few tiered response services out in this neck of the woods, though I know of a couple here in NH and a couple in northern MA.

[croaker260]

I'll respond to that...four letters....I.A.F.F.

As in its a labor and PR issue to push medics evey truck...more $$, more leverage in contract negotiations, and its a good simple point to sell to the uneducated public. Many FF even belive its a good model.

After all this is america..more is better , RIGHT?

To bad its not based on patient care...

[DrParasite]

There is no medic shortage in the Seattle are, but as has already been pointed out, we have a great system and are compensated well.
Around $70,000 per year, closer to $100k after awhile.
All the benefits of a major city FF, pension, Def-Comp, etc.
the paragod hits the nail right on the head!!! you don't have a shortage in Seattle because a paramedic makes a decent wage (enough to support himself and a family), has a pension, and benefits that are comprable to that of a city FF. and I bet you don't have the turnover or the people leaving for other professions like other parts of the US experience on a regular basis.

Imagine that, in a place where a medic makes a decent salary and has good benefits and a pension they aren't experiencing a medic shortage.

maybe the rest of the county should take notice?

[arronliptak1]

Well..you would think that a PT medic would be better than no medic or paying a FT medic time and a half.

Matt
when it comes down to it it's not cheaper to high a PT so you don't ahve to pay the overtime to FT'ers. It sounds funny but it's true I've done the math. When you hire a PT guy so you have extra help so you don't have to pay over time you have to offer them benefits. That's the key it's cheaper to pay OT then to pay benefits.

[arronliptak1]

There is no medic shortage in the Seattle are, but as has already been pointed out, we have a great system and are compensated well.
Around $70,000 per year, closer to $100k after awhile.
All the benefits of a major city FF, pension, Def-Comp, etc.
As I have mentioned before, perhaps part of the "medic shortage" is that many areas are trying to put a medic on every rig in the area.
Someone mentioned how bad it is in Florida- doesn't Fl have about the highest ratio of population/medic in the country?

Anyways, I see how medics work in other areas, and what they get paid, and I can only be glad I don't live there.
If I did, I would move!

I believe one of the highest places is here in cleveland area.

[croaker260]

the paragod hits the nail right on the head!!! you don't have a shortage in Seattle because a paramedic makes a decent wage (enough to support himself and a family), has a pension, and benefits that are comprable to that of a city FF. and I bet you don't have the turnover or the people leaving for other professions like other parts of the US experience on a regular basis.

Imagine that, in a place where a medic makes a decent salary and has good benefits and a pension they aren't experiencing a medic shortage.

maybe the rest of the county should take notice?


Dont forget that they also have a rewarding work enviroment..they are enabled and empowered to take care of their patients..they see a high volume of high acuity patients, and they have RESPECT....in otherwords they get top notch wages and benies to provide top notch care. THIS is what makes SEATTLE/KCM1 different.

The first will attract medics, the second will attract GOOD medics.

[OCFirePM]

FF/PM in southern california for most major or moderately sized departments make $75k to $100K/yr, with engineer and captain/medic pulling in $90k to $150k/yr, and more with overtime etc. You could make over $200k/yr if you spent a large amount of your life at work for a year. This pay is base salary with incentives (educational, longevity, tech bonuses, preceptor pay, hazmat, etc.). Top it off with retirement 3% at 50, which means at 50 you are eligible to retire at 3% times how many years worked to max of 90%. In your retirement will have survivor benefits too. Most cities pay the employees share of their retirement.

Example: age 50 with 27 yrs on = 81% of highest paid salary yr (minus OT) paid to you each year by PERS for life. If he works three more years, he can retire at 90%.

Retirement usually has some kind of medical program with it, many have lifetime medical program paid.

We have paid holidays, FLSA (mandatory OT pay), deferred comp, fully paid medical/vision/dental (or you make a small contribution for your family PPO plans), city paid long term disability, city paid life insurance, death and disability insurance, etc.

Most start at 144 hrs vacation yr and 120 hours sick and increases with time on.

Cities pay for all uniforms/equipment and provide annual allowances for dry cleaning. Many cities offer ride share programs to help curb gas prices. Stations are great, equipment is top knotch we only work modified Kelly schedules which are 24 hour shifts, a total of 10 shifts per month.

Advancement opportunities are in rescue, hazmat, usar, swat, engineer, captain, battalion chief, etc. You can be a medic on an engine, truck, ambulance, squad, anything. All of this stuff changes the monotany of the job sometimes.

Of course southern CA is one of the most expensive places in the country to live so pay needs to be comparable to cost of living.

Of course there is mandatory OT, where you get forced to work and that sucks, especially on holidays but so is the nature of the beast. There are a lot of openings for FF/PM, but testing is rigorous, you have to pass polygraphs, psych exams, assessment centers, physicals, physical agilities, several oral interviews. Usually 1-2 out of 100 get hired. Probation is 12-18 months constant drilling and testing, at will employees. It is tough, but a very rewarding experience.

There are not a shortage of applicants, but only of "qualified" candidates...

[cprs1707]

Well, as far as our EMS system goes, our BLS units are medication certified, and we have standing orders for most meds, the only one we have to call for is epi-pens. This is only if the pt. does not have one, then we have to call for clearance to administer, or"assist" the pt.
As far as recruiting goes, our community is a rural farming county, and getting people to volunteer is a real pain. We do not get paid, at all, true volunteers. I am the director/coordinator of EMS for our department, and life is difficult for us right now. We cover about 150 square miles with one station, two trucks(one medium rescue-crash rescue, and one non-transporting BLS ambulance), and ten personnel. Right now we have three prospects on new volunteers, adn we are trying to put together a first responders class, but the amount of time it takes to get it cleared through IDPH to get the class is 60-90 days, depending on the backlog. I need people now, not in six months!!!
To make matters worse, for those of you in Illinois I am sure you know this, Illinois no longer has a BLS test. There is a Paramedics, and they are developing an I test, but no B test. It is the National standards test. Now, Dont get me wrong, I am sure it is all good and well, but I think that the national standards test is geared more for the veteran EMT-B, not someone just out of class. I could be wrong, but that is my opinion. And to boot, the national standards test last year had such a high failure rate, only 1 of a class of 20 at a neighboring department passed the B test. To my understanding, this has been corrected, but it still lingers in the minds of prospective students.

[cprs1707]

Matt,
WHere you at in TN?

[lexfd5]

I'll respond to that...four letters....I.A.F.F.

As in its a labor and PR issue to push medics evey truck...more $$, more leverage in contract negotiations, and its a good simple point to sell to the uneducated public. Many FF even belive its a good model.

After all this is america..more is better , RIGHT?

To bad its not based on patient care...


How is the IAFF any worst than Rural-Metro or EMSC (i.e. AMR/Laidlaw) in trying to take over EMS? Are they going to be any better?

You just have to read their annual financials to learn all they care about is $$$$. Both mention losses in revenue due to a lower than expected intra-facility transfers because the flu did not hit that hard.

Is there one good answer? No. You have to find what works for your area. Does the IAFF have an agenda? Yes. Does Rural-Metro and AMR? Yes. Do they all have what's best for the patient in mind? More than likely not. Do they have their eye on the almighty dollar? You bet.

My only problem is when you take out the wacking stick on the IAFF like they are all that is evil in EMS. How does your service which is funded by taxes and use fees differ from a FD based EMS also funded in the same manner?

I would be more afraid of AMR and Rural-Metro who are both in business for the bottom line (not the medics and the people on the street mind you, but the ones in the corner offices where patients equal revenue.)

What would happen to your service ("municipal, third-service") if AMR walks into your county council meeting and says "We'll give you $10,000,000 for exclusive 911 coverage." What would the outcome be?

BACK to the TOPIC:

If you need to find some paramedics we are going to have a bunch graduating from the academy in a few months. Most have never taken a blood pressure but are part of the chief's everyone is going to be a paramedic policy. So no shortage here. Just a bunch of brand spanking, ink wet on the card medics coming soon.

Stay safe and have fun.

[rescuehuck]

I know at my department, we have a hard time also, but the pay is low and so is the ammount of calls.

[croaker260]

How is the IAFF any worst than Rural-Metro or EMSC (i.e. AMR/Laidlaw) in trying to take over EMS? Are they going to be any better?

You just have to read their annual financials to learn all they care about is $$$$. Both mention losses in revenue due to a lower than expected intra-facility transfers because the flu did not hit that hard.

Is there one good answer? No. You have to find what works for your area. Does the IAFF have an agenda? Yes. Does Rural-Metro and AMR? Yes. Do they all have what's best for the patient in mind? More than likely not. Do they have their eye on the almighty dollar? You bet.

My only problem is when you take out the wacking stick on the IAFF like they are all that is evil in EMS. How does your service which is funded by taxes and use fees differ from a FD based EMS also funded in the same manner?

I would be more afraid of AMR and Rural-Metro who are both in business for the bottom line (not the medics and the people on the street mind you, but the ones in the corner offices where patients equal revenue.)

What would happen to your service ("municipal, third-service") if AMR walks into your county council meeting and says "We'll give you $10,000,000 for exclusive 911 coverage." What would the outcome be?

BACK to the TOPIC:

If you need to find some paramedics we are going to have a bunch graduating from the academy in a few months. Most have never taken a blood pressure but are part of the chief's everyone is going to be a paramedic policy. So no shortage here. Just a bunch of brand spanking, ink wet on the card medics coming soon.

Stay safe and have fun.


Lex, sorry for the late reply, I must have missed your post.

1st, I agree that the AMRs and R/Ms of the world are out for profitt. It also seems that one of the few patient oriented provates, Pridemark, has finally fallen to the pressure of socklholders and profit margins, or so rumor has it from a few former employees....if there are any former pridemark employees onhere, perhaps they wouldlike to shed some light....

2nd, about 10-11 years ago AMR did scout our our area, the feasability study reported that the current third service...as in us...was too well entrenched in the community and had the medical communities support to make a bid for the 911 contracts worthwile. Since this was a year and a half before I arrived I cant attest to it, but I heard it from a former AMR mid-uppper level managemnt type.

3rd, the AMR's and R/M's seldom offer money for the contract. What they do instead is offer to do it for a smaller tax subsididy than the current model. this is the only way they can make 911 feasible, that and some contractual terms that lock down the non emergent transport strictly to AMR. While there may be some areas that a private payed for permission to operate, that is a rareity. Most of the time they wrangle out a way to get paid.

4th, doenst your statement on the new medics in fact back up what I was saying , rather than dispute it? Just a thought. I take it you dont think much of the medic on every street courner concept either now, huh? or am I taking your comments incorrectly?

[lexfd5]

I'll have to take the fifth on the last one for a few months. Don't want to rock the boat in a public forum.

Actually, many in our local have questioned the chief's new practice. It was not labor who wanted the change, but management.

[hungrymonkey]

I think I need to move east.

I live in Oregon, and the last 20 hiring processes I have been to has had at least 30 emt-p applicants. Competition for jobs is pretty stiff.

[korourke]

We have 33 Paramedic openings. Our problem is that we are over worked and under paid. No one wants to come to our service just for experience anymore.
Kim in Galveston,Tx

[ArkansasFan24]

A lot of the paramedics around here work part-time at other things. I'm a paramedic, and I don't/won't work as one anymore. The hours and pay are too miserable. I think that's the principle issue why recruitment and retention is bad.

When I was taking the paramedic classes at night, while I was getting an unrelated college degree by day, the instructor, who owned his own amublance service, more or less told me he'd have a position for me when I finished. He did. I went to work there shortly after getting certified, and I did all my internship stuff there in school.

The fire dept. here has its own ALS ambulance service with all firefighters being required to be EMT's with several being paramedics. They'll pay for the classes. Most of them work part-time with the private services in the area. Most of the private ambulances have few full-time employees.

[gonzo3128]

I have to agree that better pay and benefeits are the way to recruit and keep paramedics. I currently for Durham Region E.M.S. which is located in Ontario Canada and in this part of Canada there is very stiff competions for ems jobs. We only hire approx 6-10 medics per year, and only on a part time basis until full time openings are available, and there is usually several hundred applicants per year. I beleive the reason why we don't have the shortage problems that the U.S. has or other parts of Canada is that the pay here is excellent along with good insurance, retirement package, vacation, and room for advancement. We work 12 hour shifts nights/days, 4 nights with 4 days off then 3 days and 3 nights then 4 days off then return for 4 days then off for 6 days, then your rotation stars all over again. The starting salary for an advance care paramedic ( emt-p ) is approx 88,000.00 canadian or equivalent to 80,000.00 american. The pay scale for paramedics, ff, and rn's is just about equal. FF and RN's typically have better benefeits, but we are working on that too. I used to work in Texas and just to survive I was working 3 jobs. I would like to see all of medics in the U.S. to have better pay, I just do not know what it would take to achieve that step.

Good luck to you all and be safe.

Later's
Gonzo

[Portomaso]

I am new to this forum. And stumbled into this discussion at first.

I agree that paramedics need to get better paid. But seeing it from the other side of the atlantic with my eyes in the German EMS system, we as paramedics also need a better reputation in the public. Not that we are bad medics, or doing our job badly. But if people would honor our work a bit more, many paramedics would stay in our profession much longer.

In contrast to some states in your country we do not have a shortage of paramedics, but a shortage of jobs. Some thousands of paramedics (we have a 2 yrs full-time education of 2,800 hours in Germany) overhere are desperately seeking a job in EMS. I guess many of them would leave the country for a job in EMS.
But only a very few of them have the chance for reciprocity in another country due to the very strict regulations in the health care business.
I can say that I am in the lucky situation to hold not just my German paramedic license, but also licenses for Belgium and Illinois.
If I would leave my country to work abroad?
Yes, I would. Even if it would mean to give up my succesful self-employment as an emergency care instructor. Being open for new challenges is what counts.

With the shortage of paramedics in some states I am wondering why there are still so strict and hard ways for reciprocity from other states and countries. And why employers are not looking abroad to get well educated and experienced paramedics.
It is easy for German nurses and physiotherapists to get a work permit for the US. So why not is it also for German paramedics willing to go to the states with a paramedic shortage? Seems there have to be alot to be done in administration.

[DAN911]

Here in Quebec, we are under staff. Our agency just recruit few guys from Ontario because they don't hire a lot and they have enough staff. But the people who decide to work with us have a price to paid: Our salary is a lot less then in Ontario, it start at 16,74/hrs and stop, after 12 yrs, at 23,35/hrs.
We have 12, 10 and 8 hours shift. We also have a ''7/14'' shift: work 24 hrs/day during 1 week and after that one week off but we are only paid 80 hrs/ 2 weeks.

[RicanMedic78]

if a nurse can get paid upward of $40 an hour, I dont see why the same would not matter for a medic (or at least close). There are things only a nurse can do and there are things only a medic can do. But as far as skill level goes, we should all be in the same ballpark here in my opinion. Its all politics and its extremely unfair. I'm a firm believer in not settling with what is and saying "we dont do it for the money." Even though I hope most of us dont do it for the money, by living by this principle, it puts us in a weaker position to fight for higher wages.

thankfully, where I work, we do get a somewhat higher wage, however, so do other fields as well, which in the end, beat us out every time.

So much for appreciation huh?

[croaker260]

Here at my service we just upped our starting wage to 40K /year for new medics, goes up to almost 50 for a 10 year medic. We will see if this helps.....

[sassyffmedic]

With the shortage of paramedics in some states I am wondering why there are still so strict and hard ways for reciprocity from other states and countries. And why employers are not looking abroad to get well educated and experienced paramedics.
The EMS arena in general in the states need to improve our quality of providers and reputation, which would improve the level of respect and understanding from Physicians and in turn would allow Paramedics higher pay with a licensure similar to nurses but until we improve on smaller educational facilities that try to cram paramedic course in a few months rather than the quality of a college accredited curses that focus on quality clinicians and not quantity of cookbook medics. The other Issue that holds our field of practice back is the amount of persons whom have a criminal background yet are allowed to slip through the certification due to states not requiring a Federal background check with fingerprints, they in turn reflect poorly on all ems providers when their crime hit front page we are all tainted in the publics eyes including those whom decide if we should have an increased pay scale.
In addition, Paramedics whom are NREMTP could find work across the Nation they would just have to be willing to relocate to where the jobs are, which would also give them a broader experience of the field.
A few links to view on this similar view
http://www.capem.org
http://www.advocatesforems.org

http://www.fieldmedics.com
Council for the Advancement of Prehospital EMS (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.view profile&friendid=97265840&MyToken=cd54922b-b8c2-4cda-a559-74cdcc5c4cf9)
http://b0.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/01344/05/10/1344540150_s.jpg (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.view profile&friendid=97265840&MyToken=cd54922b-b8c2-4cda-a559-74cdcc5c4cf9)

[gsfire]

Is there any paramedic Classes in S.C.?

[rumedic1]

http://www.scdhec.net/health/ems/bas2002c.pdf

This might help.

We did just get raises in our area paramedic base pay about 42000.00 to 43000.00 year working 24/48

we accept NREMTP in south carolina you just have to put in some paperwork to get reciprocity. see link http://www.scdhec.net/health/ems/05recipr.pdf

[croaker260]

http://www.scdhec.net/health/ems/bas2002c.pdf

This might help.

We did just get raises in our area paramedic base pay about 42000.00 to 43000.00 year working 24/48

we accept NREMTP in south carolina you just have to put in some paperwork to get reciprocity. see link http://www.scdhec.net/health/ems/05recipr.pdf

Hmm, our medics start at 40 before exp bonus, and only work 48 hours a week, every week, set days (12s or 24's or combo of 12's/24s), no rotations.

[SnakeManDan]

Hmm, our medics start at 40 before exp bonus, and only work 48 hours a week, every week, set days (12s or 24's or combo of 12's/24s), no rotations.

I work for SouthWest in Arizona. We have way too many medics here. Each day there are about 10 too many and some are sent home. Many are not happy. Maybe some of you East Coast guys should focus on the west for recruiting.