Fire captain reprimanded for using fire truck to water lawn

[NJFFSA16]

KOKOMO, Ind. (AP) - A city fire captain must repay the
department $120 for using a fire truck to water his yard.
Capt. Kevin Shaffer was also reprimanded and must pay 35 cents
per gallon for the water he used, officials said.
Shaffer and other firefighters were training recently on the
south end of town, after which Shaffer wanted to purge the truck's
tank.
Instead of dumping the water down on the street or down a drain
as is normal procedure, Shaffer put the water on his lawn in the
city 50 miles north of Indianapolis, Deputy Chief Pat Donoghue said
Tuesday.
"We consider that a misuse of fire department equipment,"
Donoghue said. "He said he didn't want to waste it. If he didn't
want to waste it, he could have watered the department's lawn."
Shaffer did not want to comment on the situation, but said he
did not plan to appeal the reprimand or fine.
---
Information from: Kokomo Tribune, http://www.ktonline.com

(Copyright 2005 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)

[CAPPYY]

This poor guy must have some enemies in his town. These days I guess we have to sit down and thoroughly think out every minor decision we make cause theres always someone lookin to hang your butt. Too bad.


God bless and pull the ceiling as you go.

[Dave1983]

Well, at least he didnt take the crew over to remodel his house and then try to pass it off as building construction training.:D



PS: For thoese who dont know the story, this has been done.:eek:

[Bones42]

after which Shaffer wanted to purge the truck's tank Just curious, but is this normal procedure for a lot of people? Why would anyone want to keep their tank empty? :eek:

[EFD840]

We had this amusing exchange with a citizen just last month.

The guy calls me up and says he's just bought an above-ground pool (turned out to be one that looks like a frameless dump tank) and he needs the FD to come and fill it for him.

That's not an unusual request, but we don't do it. I explain to him that it would effectively be stealing water from the water department and also we aren't supposed to use public equipment to do work on private property. He's not real happy, but he accepts it.

Fast forward about three hours...

The guy calls back. It seems he's got his pool over half full (about 3000 gallons), only to now realize that he was supposed to put it on LEVEL ground (doh!). He didn't, and it is about to collapse and go rolling through the neighborhood.

So why is he calling the FD? Well, he's already bought that water and doesn't want to lose his investment. He wants us to empty our tanks, come over and pump his water into the truck, hold it while he fixes the problem, and then refill the pool with his water.

He was quite serious and not very happy with the answer I gave him.

[MIKEYLIKESIT]

Ahhh. the ol' "purging the tank".. Anybody have a bridge they want to purchase?

[Bones42]

A few years ago, when the Aquarium in town opened, they donated some money to us for helping fill their salt water shark tank. Drafted from our inlet and ran 5" 1/2 mile down the boardwalk. Best part was they got their own 5" and laid it out for us so there was no re-packing of hose to do.

PS - we "purged" the pump and discharges after that to get rid of the salt water, but not the tank.

[GeorgeWendtCFI]

Did they do a complete investigation befoer they disciplined this poor fire fighter? That is $120 worth of food they are taking out of his kid's mouths.

[JackTee09]

Did they do a complete investigation befoer they disciplined this poor fire fighter?

George - They should, and probably did, investigate prior to rendering a decision. The sarcasm that you present is evident on the FDNY thread and here. You, above everybody else, should know that looking into a situation is vital before reaching a decision to discipline a person.

With respect to the Captain that watered his lawn - hey - you gotta think. While it seems minor - everyhting the brothers do now is under a microscope. You can't do this type of thing.

[GeorgeWendtCFI]

Originally posted by GeorgeWendtCFI
Did they do a complete investigation befoer they disciplined this poor fire fighter? That is $120 worth of food they are taking out of his kid's mouths.

This post was COMPLETELY sarcastic.

I would suggest that if you don't like it, there is no one holding a gun to your head to make you read it.

[spearsm]

George,
For what it is worth, the majority reading this knew:D :)

[doughesson]

To,ahh,facilitate my response time,I hang out at my station a lot(vollie dept)and every now and then,the phone will ring and I'll field a question about baby seat installations and if we still fill swimming pools.
I direct both questions to the city fire department and give them the Chief's office number for the pool fill request.

[Farmun]

Originally posted by MIKEYLIKESIT
Ahhh. the ol' "purging the tank".. Anybody have a bridge they want to purchase?

"Purging the tank" is quite common and should be done regularly. We do it every Saturday but we call it "backflushing."

Procedure:
1. Remove pump large diameter vacuum connections caps (direct in each side of the pump)

2. Pull tank-to-pump thereby draining the tank out through the pump.

3. Connect front soft suction to hydrant and turn on thereby flushing the pump and the tank through the open caps on each side.

This works really well and you will be AMAZED at how much junk collects in the bottom of your tank and pump. It is just good procedure. Try it.

[GeorgeWendtCFI]

Originally posted by Farmun


"Purging the tank" is quite common and should be done regularly. We do it every Saturday but we call it "backflushing."

Procedure:
1. Remove pump large diameter vacuum connections caps (direct in each side of the pump)

2. Pull tank-to-pump thereby draining the tank out through the pump.

3. Connect front soft suction to hydrant and turn on thereby flushing the pump and the tank through the open caps on each side.

This works really well and you will be AMAZED at how much junk collects in the bottom of your tank and pump. It is just good procedure. Try it.

Alot of FD's do it. It's called firefighting.

[FlyingKiwi]

It's called firefighting

George strikes another blow for TRUTH. :p

[JackTee09]

George:

My apologies. I did not realize that it was humorous sarcasm - so I was totally wrong.

[CaptOldTimer]

Oh well, It happens....


Maybe he just wanted to get rid of the old bad water that was in the tank and didn't want to put it in the town's sewer system.

I have watered a few yards in my time! :p :D

[kentbwj]

I can't even believe the media turned this into a "news" story. Honestly...

[Farmun]

Originally posted by GeorgeWendtCFI


Alot of FD's do it. It's called firefighting.

George that was pretty low. I bet most high end CFI's like yourself see a ton of fire. And while you are "slaying the devil" everyday I hope you never suffer a damaged pump or clogged nozzle from your obvious lack of routine maintenence. Better yet, just order one of your junior CFI's to flush out the pump once in a while so that you can rest up for the next big "worker."

[Dave1983]

Originally posted by GeorgeWendtCFI


Alot of FD's do it. It's called firefighting.

For what its worth, we back flush the first of the month AND after each fire (yes, we have thoese). Nasty stuff comes out of hydrants sometimes. We would also do it when we draft if we did.;)

[PattyV]

Its a brilliant idea to do it if you dont run too many fire calls. We once forgot to do it after drafting from a pond :( When we opened up the top 2 weeks later, the water was septic :eek: . We had to flush it twice and run a couple of bottles of pine-o-clean through the tank to get rid of the smell.

[GeorgeWendtCFI]

Originally posted by Farmun


George that was pretty low. I bet most high end CFI's like yourself see a ton of fire. And while you are "slaying the devil" everyday I hope you never suffer a damaged pump or clogged nozzle from your obvious lack of routine maintenence. Better yet, just order one of your junior CFI's to flush out the pump once in a while so that you can rest up for the next big "worker."

As I told you in your PM, you need to get over yourself. I have never advocated not maintaining your pump. But you are missing the point of this thread.

BTW, do you even know what a CFI is?

[Farmun]

Originally posted by GeorgeWendtCFI



BTW, do you even know what a CFI is?

Yes George I do. Around here it means Certified Fire Investigator. It could also mean certified fire inspector or certified fire instructor. I was just using a little of the brash sarcasm that you seem so fond of.

[RyanEMVFD]

I always thought firefighters were supposed to improvise...

[nmfire]

Fine, I'll change the subject to stop the bickering.

When we needed to empty the FFFP foam tank on our engine, we sure weren't going to just drain it in the parking lot. So, we dropped it into pump, cranked open the eductor on the pump, and proceeded to foam the entire front lawn of the firehouse. The grass was looking pretty bleak so we figured it could use the watering anywhere. Let me tell you, the organic material that makes that FFFP foam smell like a dead cow floating in a cess pool makes a GREAT fertilizer! That grass turned 20 new shades of green and grew like hell for weeks!

[GeorgeWendtCFI]

Originally posted by nmfire
Fine, I'll change the subject to stop the bickering.

When we needed to empty the FFFP foam tank on our engine, we sure weren't going to just drain it in the parking lot. So, we dropped it into pump, cranked open the eductor on the pump, and proceeded to foam the entire front lawn of the firehouse. The grass was looking pretty bleak so we figured it could use the watering anywhere. Let me tell you, the organic material that makes that FFFP foam smell like a dead cow floating in a cess pool makes a GREAT fertilizer! That grass turned 20 new shades of green and grew like hell for weeks!

Had a FD near here dump their foam into a stream. They didn't get charged criminally (although they could have) but they had a bit of explaining to do to the environmental folks. That part of the case is still pending, I believe.

[nmfire]

Yea, we have a pond down the hill in the back and we didn't want it to just run down the road and into the pond (not that there is anything of this earth in that pond to kill). In the front it pretty much stayed where we put it.

[StLRes2cue]

.........."

[Bones42]

For those that fill pools, has the thought of using a 2 1/2 with a flowmeter been discussed? That way you could calculate how many gallons were used and bill/charge accordingly for the water. 300 gpm for 1/2 hour = 9000gallons. Just a thought.

[Farmun]

In the area around my home town in PA some fire companies still (last I heard) filled pools and watered lawns for a donation to the fire company. Makes draining your tank on your lawn seem minor.

Come to think of it...those were volunteer fire departments and it seems there is less oversight over volunteer companies than paid ones. I guess the governing bodies figure they are getting a very expensive service for free so they should keep their mounths shut.;)